To think this insensitive and the end of a long friendship

[turquoiseandblue]

My two best friends from uni, one who was on my course and who I suppose I'm a bit closer to but we've all been friends for over 25 yrs it's all pretty equal now.
I got a message from one saying they were meeting the other and could do with a chat as we hadn't spoken in so long, saying that lots of WhatsApp and a few face times given COVID (the last zoom call we tried to set up she didn't want to be bothered with).
I called her to be told she was in fact going on holiday with her children and our other friend as they had a spare room in their lodge they knew they would take and I was more 'difficult' (I have a toddler). I was then told it had been booked over a year ago. I replied that had they let me know I could have booked somewhere near, that was met with a pitying sigh as if I had some kind of problem.
I was then asked if I wanted to come on a zoom call with everyone when they were there, I replied I'd rather not as it was just a reminder that I wasn't there with them and hadn't been invited, I did say this all in quite a light hearted manner though again it was met with another sign.
AIBU to think they are just disregarding my feelings, particularly now they have returned they want to meet up in an area between all of us which they have chosen. This is in fact not at all in the middle and a 4hr drive for me.
It's such a long standing friendship but I have felt very left out on a number of occasions (lonely in a group of three) and I just wonder whether despite being godparents to each other's children and bridesmaids etc whether I should still be putting the effort in when my feelings aren't seemingly considered . If it were me I wouldn't have planned a holiday after lockdown without considering each of them and certainly wouldn't have made a guilty phone call just before I was about to leave for a holiday. Any advice on what to do next is welcome

When one door closes another door opens. Never be scared to dispose of toxic meanies and move on OP.

Er, no; they're alright, actually, inviting you to join a Zoom call from the holiday lodge to which you're not invited. How munificent of them.
Fuck this pair of Lady Bountifuls, OP. They can take their patient sighing somewhere else.

It's clearly not just about the holiday as OP said she's felt left out on a number of occasions. The sighing would really piss me off. And the arranging a meet that suits them but is miles out of your way.

They couldn't be saying more clearly that you are not as important in the group friendship as the other two. I couldn't be bothered with this. I'd try and cultivate friendships with other people who are more considerate of my feelings OP.

Not U for friend 1 to invite friend 2 along to her holiday property and not you too.

So why not mention it until now? They obviously knew they were going to hurt her feelings.

Sounds like the zoom call was (misguidedly) suggested in response to OP having previously suggested calls and OP expressing sadness that she wasn’t invited.

It’s not U for friends originally part of a friendship group to have independent relationships and, over 25 years, for things to change!

I think people on here are being very soft on your friends. The one you spoke to sounds deliberately mean and passive aggressive

I’m sorry to hear that you’re feeling upset by these things.

I’m in a friendship group of three. We all live c.1 hour away (in a sort of triangle) so when we meet up in tends to be planned in advance.

In earlier years, we would always meet up as a three, and we’d rearrange if any one of us become unable to do that date. It worked fine.

More recently, I think because we’ve all got slightly different circumstances and our lives have evolved, it is not unusual for any of us to meet one of the other group. We don’t hide it from the third person (who may not have been invited) and there appears to be absolutely no resentment from anyone. I think it works because we will sometimes meet up as a three and sometimes in pairs but it all balances out in the end.

So I think your resentment sounds unhealthy, jealous, immature.

If you didn’t like the sound of joining their holiday one day via WhatsApp, it’s absolutely fine to politely decline. By expressing that it would remind you of being left out, you’re likely to push them further away.

If I were you, I’d join the meet up four hours away and, next time, take the time to find a more mutually convenient spot and you do the organising.

I wonder whether these friends form the majority of your social life, and that might be why it affects you more to be ‘left out’ of an arrangement? If so, try to build other friendships, hobbies etc., while also maintaining this friendship.

@Dozer

Presumably they each have their friendship with you, and with each other, which is fine.

Not U for friend 1 to invite friend 2 along to her holiday property and not you too. For any reason. Perhaps friend 1’s DC are older? Many people, including parents, dislike spending a lot of time with toddlers!

I think you were U to express annoyance/sadness about them not suggesting a joint holiday or you staying nearby.

As for meet ups, if suggested locations are too far, don’t go.

@Dozer - given this is not an isolated incident and the OP has felt excluded before, it seems more like two of them have a friendship with each other, but those two don’t make and effort to, or want to, see the OP on her own, or for long, as she is more just one of a historical group of three. If they all had genuine, close, individual friendships, why would friend 2 only want to Zoom call when friend 1 is on holiday with her? She has infinite opportunities to catch up with the OP without doing it in a way that highlights the fact she prefers to go on holiday with friend 1.

I replied that had they let me know I could have booked somewhere near
This was the problem. Then going on about it continued the problem.

I have 3 friends and sometimes we do things as a group and sometimes independently. We all have slightly different interests and family situations so sometimes it doesn't work to all be together. Sometimes that's a little shit and you think I would have enjoyed that.....but we are all adults and all entitled to 'do our own thing' with each other as well as together. In fact finding dates when we are all free can sometimes take months. Lol.

This was booked when you had a new baby. I can understand why they didn't include you at that time. Babies require effort older kids don't and limit holidays. It can still be good but if you are past that point it would be hard to go back. If you love your friends then let it go.

I read it as one booked a holiday and then wanted to “sublet” a spare room to a friend. That’s a bit different from sitting down and planning a trip from scratch. Plus - as others have said, toddlers are a pain, especially if you have older kids in the mix. (If they both do and those kids get on well, that’s a different dynamic as well.) Just because you haven’t been included doesn’t necessarily mean you’ve been excluded.

I do think the Zoom call suggestion was insensitive - oh here we are on our holiday together, location in background! I don't blame you for declining, OP.

@Dozer

Sounds like the zoom call was (misguidedly) suggested in response to OP having previously suggested calls and OP expressing sadness that she wasn’t invited.

It’s not U for friends originally part of a friendship group to have independent relationships and, over 25 years, for things to change!

Not unreasonable but they are not treating her very well, this is the issue.

Trying to tell her that meeting someplace that is 4 hours away from OP is 'an area between all of us' when OP knows it's not is just treating her like a mug.

If you've got a toddler and they don't they probably just wanted a nice holiday without the schedule and activities being dictated by naps, tantrums, toddler-friendly stuff.

I have a 3-year-old and he's lovely, but he's full on and can't do things that older kids can - zip wiring, Go Ape, climbing, even longish walks.

Most people don't get many holidays, so it's not at all unreasonable for them to want a holiday together without you + toddler.

You're thinking too much about this - not everything needs to be done as a trio, you can (and should!) see each other 121 sometimes.

So Friend A booked a holiday and had space in her lodge for one other family so invited Friend B. Either because she feels closer to them, the partners get on better or it was just a better fit.

Yeah I would be hurt even though Friend A hasn't done anything wrong in my opinion. Though it was unfair of them to keep it a secret, but your reaction to it kind of make it clear why they felt they had to.

You finf out and try and insert yourself in the holiday by saying you could have booked somewhere nearby, which would have changed the dynamic of the holiday for them. Not because of who you are but because they will now need to accommodate a third family's needs, and one not even on site so they will have to wait for you to arrive with them in the morning, or text you changes of plans, it creates a level of organization for Friend A on her holiday which just isn't there if everyone is in the same place.

I don't think your unreasonable to be upset and hurt that's human nature, but I also don't think they have done anything wrong apart from keeping it a secret, but I can totally understand why they did.

How old are their kids if you have a toddler OP? If theirs are at least 8 or so, it totally changes the holiday dynamics to include your toddler. Mine are teens and early twenties and I can’t think of anything much worse than having precious holiday leave spent not being able to do what I want because the toddler was tired, bored, tantruming or wanted to go run around when I wanted to enjoy a relaxed lunch in a cafe.

You also mention that they could have met in an area half way between you rather than the place they were going to. They’ve both chosen to go to a particular location and it’s quite reasonable to go where you want on holiday, and not a place someone else wants to go - I’d rather do my own thing than holiday somewhere I wasn’t interested in.

I think it’s fine for a group of three to do their own thing with just one person separately, and I don’t agree with friend possessiveness with someone getting the shits if all three of you aren’t joined at the hip all the time. It’s natural for relationships to change over the years.

I’d say it all depends on the ages of their kids. If they also have toddlers then I’d say the friendship has run it’s course. If they have kids that have come out of the toddler years then it’s completely understandable why they don’t want a toddler (and therefore you) on the holiday and your offer to stay nearby but still include your toddler in the holiday shows a lack of understanding on your part. Toddlers dictate everything - what and where. In in order for everyone’s lives to be bearable everyone needs to work around a toddler and if they are past that stage it’s understandable they don’t want the holiday ruled by it. But again, if they also have toddlers then it doesn’t make sense and I’d then rethink the friendship.

@SpinachAndMushroom

How old are their kids if you have a toddler OP? If theirs are at least 8 or so, it totally changes the holiday dynamics to include your toddler. Mine are teens and early twenties and I can’t think of anything much worse than having precious holiday leave spent not being able to do what I want because the toddler was tired, bored, tantruming or wanted to go run around when I wanted to enjoy a relaxed lunch in a cafe.

You also mention that they could have met in an area half way between you rather than the place they were going to. They’ve both chosen to go to a particular location and it’s quite reasonable to go where you want on holiday, and not a place someone else wants to go - I’d rather do my own thing than holiday somewhere I wasn’t interested in.

I think it’s fine for a group of three to do their own thing with just one person separately, and I don’t agree with friend possessiveness with someone getting the shits if all three of you aren’t joined at the hip all the time. It’s natural for relationships to change over the years.

@SpinachAndMushroom - if you re-read the OP, I think you’ll find the holiday was a separate thing. The Op declined joining a Zoom call with the two holidaying friends, because that was rubbing her nose in the fact they had deliberately timed the Zoom call for when they were on holiday together without her. The meeting up is a subsequent suggestion, now they are already back from the holiday. The suggested meeting location sounds like it is far more convenient for the other two than the OP (even though, if the OP is the one with the toddler, which was the claimed reason for not inviting her on the holiday, it makes more sense for the location to be closer to the OP’s home). It all smacks of thoughtlessness so extreme that maybe it isn’t thoughtless at all, but a deliberate smack in the face. Or maybe the person suggesting the location is just of limited intelligence and doesn’t understand people are not birds and cannot get to locations as the crow flies.

I think quite simply they didn’t want to holiday with your toddler, which is completely reasonable, but they didn’t know how to tell you so just hid it. They handled it badly but they did nothing wrong in holidaying without you.

I’m in a group of 3 and our holidays (and dinners) vary, in that sometimes it’s all 3 of us or sometimes it 2. That’s completely normal and doesn’t mean the end of a friendship.

Also, not sure the zoom call is a case of rubbing your face in it...I received a zoom call once when the other two of our group of 3 were away without me. It was more their way of including me!

Not inviting someone on holiday and then expecting them to join you on a zoom call where they will inevitably talk about said holiday is thoughtless. And then expecting OP to go out of her way and drive 4 hours to meet them and trying to pass it off as meeting in the middle is entitled and bitchy.

Agreed. You're an afterthought at best, OP. I'd cut my losses and try to develop other friendships. I'm sorry they're being so shitty.

I would see this as a bit manipulative. They want a Zoom catch up with you just when the 'happen' to be on holiday together without you? Why now? I can't stand this sort of status game playing.

I know from other friends' reactions to similar sorts of power play that I am super sensitive to this nonsense and most people shrug it off, but I'd just think they were behaving like schoolgirls on instagram, wanting to ensure you knew you were missing out on all the fun because they can't enjoy it themselves as much unless they get that kick of having hurt you.

If you feel like this, move on. It is preferable to have a tiny number of really good friends who don't do this than hold onto old friends who do.

Seem# their decision has been based on the fact that you have a toddler and i5 would therefore affect the dynamic of the trip. Ie, maybe not being relaxing if you have a toddler tearing round the place, or trying to organise activities to include needs of a toddler. But I think the reasons could have been explained to you a bit more sensitively. If you’re all so close, maybe it just needs a clear the air conversation.

Basically, truly close friends should know each other’s personalities better than this. If strangers can clearly see why the OP is upset, it’s hard to see how the other two can be quite so dense. There is a clear vibe coming out of this that either the OP is never the one thought of first and the other two are self-absorbed and insensitive, or she is more a friend for historical reasons, as a reminder of fun past times, than a friend in present reality. It would be interesting to know if the OP has ever had a holiday with one of the two but not the other. It sounds like this is highly unlikely and that the friendships are not equal.

But how far away is the meet up for the others? I assume you are the one with the longest journey, but is it 20 mins for the other two, or three hours? It may be that they place your meeting is the best place for a nice lunch, shopping etc. there is a lot of info missing.