To think you don’t go to University just for the University experience

[CovidSmart]

Many many discussions in our house on university atm.

Two dcs who are convinced (I imagine from what school is telling them) that what is important is to find the Uni where you will get the best experience. Somehow the rest doesn’t seem to matter as

• companies will train you
• you can do whatever you want after that as long as you have a degree/master.

I see university as a way to learn about a subject so you can work after so the subject is important (eg important to learn economic if you want to work in business related fields, engineering to be an engineer etc..).

Both dcs are so adamant I’m wrong that I’m starting to question myself. Not having the experience of the British system doesn’t help (went to uni and started to work in a different country).

Any experience?

No college course except maybe nursing and medicine are going to teach you what you need for a job. But they give you skills which are transferable.. So the important thing thing is to broaden your seat of skills and they will be useful. I know students who did history who are now in business jobsk: if you can analyse the past you can plan for the fire. Others are in marketing/ recruitment/ public relations etc. They gained those new skills after college. I am all for the university experience as its impossible to learn every thing you need in a job.

Ex Big 4 accountant with a chemistry PhD checking in here to say I had colleagues on my grad scheme who had history, English lit, sports science etc etc degrees. Yes, you needed maths skills like ‘can you do percentages’ but beyond that nobody cared. I know some of our overseas recruits were flummoxed that almost none of us had done an accounting related degree.

DM used to recruit lawyers for a mid sized city firm. She liked linguists as they had European clients...

I'm struggling with this atm re Ds1. Particularly when I read a thread the other day with a uni lecturer who said she was paid to teach subject, wasn't paid to make sure every student got the uni experience!

I went to uni donkeys years ago, and to me the whole experience was fab. I wanted my children to enjoy that too. Not log online, from their bedroom that they use now, in our house!

Many unis have already announced that next year will be online. I hate that idea.

I did a vocational degree and a masters in a very closely related subject. However looking back I wish I'd done my first degree in something I was interested in, and then either a graduate scheme or a masters in my vocational subject. It would have been far more interesting!

I know some of our overseas recruits were flummoxed that almost none of us had done an accounting related degree.

As an overseas person, I certainly have the same reaction
Having said that DH is british and has a similar reaction 🤷‍♀️🤷‍♀️ I suspect having vocational training is the factor for both of us.

a uni lecturer who said she was paid to teach subject, wasn't paid to make sure every student got the uni experience!

She's hopefully doing her part to ensure the university experience ie teaching the subject.

The rest of that experience will come from university social activities, their peers, clubs & societies, experiential learning (ie non-graded) activities.

In the nicest way, you’re coming from this with a very outdated view. The vast majority of young people now who go into decent graduate jobs do so by studying something like history at a very good university. Then you can do a graduate scheme as an accountant, a lawyer, get a job in politics, work in business or do a postgrad in finance. It’s almost impossible to get a good grad job without the degree. Doing a boring degree is generally no more use then doing something interesting. If you’re smart and have good academics you’re sought after regardless of your degree topic. I don’t think a single one of the hundred people I know who studied history at a top Russell group would ever have considered being a teacher!

Its a bit of both for me.

I learnt how to live away from home. My mum looked after me too well. I’d never switched a washing machine on, never cooked a meal more complicated than a sandwich, never picked up after myself. Budgeting, shopping, getting myself to where I needed to be without dads taxi. All important life skills, which I didn’t have.

That said I did choose a ‘career’ subject and it was in the 90s so no fees and loans were tiny amounts compared to today.

For my own, I’m advising to choose a subject with an end goal because it’s a huge investment.

Many unis have already announced that next year will be online. I hate that idea.

Very few universities will offer an online only opportunity. We all recognise that university means more than just imparting information.

You would be wise to plan for some type of hybrid approach tho.

Additionally, not all online learning has been bad, there are some advantages & I will be keeping some on, even as we return to on-campus.

@EarringsandLipstick, how can you learn about the culture of one university?

Depends what you mean by 'experience'. I think often prospective students think this means nightlife. In my day (long, long, ago) the Uni experience meant learning to live as an independent adult away from home; budgeting; learning how to think for yourself, working very hard, being intellectually challenged and most of all meeting a huge range of people with different backgrounds and interests. If you don't come out of it having changed, matured, become more intelligent, open-minded, confident, clear about your own strengths/interests etc you've wasted your time. The actual subject studied should facilitate this maturing experience not just give you the facts you need to get X job.

@CovidSmart

One of dcs wants to study history. I have no issue with that tbh. But I’m worried. They know they will never be a teacher. There are so many students doing a degree to end up with a MW job because what they learnt isn’t valued by companies. What company will need someone who knows it all about Henry VIII?

My background is engineering (so is dh) so the idea that they will end up with £40k debt for studying a subject just for the sake of it doesn’t sit well.
However, as someone pointed out, engineering is vocational so probably different.

All the rest (becoming independant, meeting new people) will happen regardless of the subject.

My friends who did exactly that (at a top uni) are: solicitors, barristers, civil servants, in politics, economists, museum curators, working in charity sector, Phd candidates.

The good undergrad degree is a gateway to almost any Carter. Often more so than a specialist degree. E.g. history at Durham or UCL will get you into being a solicitor training contract just as easily as a law degree

@CovidSmart I’m an accountant, a lot of people do grad schemes with big 4 with “irrelevant” degrees including history!

I also have an irrelevant degree that I did for fun but I did try and do something relevant first so it wasn’t my intention .

so if I am doing a summary of what you are saying

• subject as such isn't such an issue as long as you go to a (very?) good university.
• companies will then look at what sort of work experience you have (so part time jobs and placements are a must?)
• university should be chosen according to its culture and evaluation system
• but the main idea of going to Uni is to grow up (even though that one leaves me a bit )
• and the subject as such doesn't matter that much (as long as what you want top do isn't vocational, engineerring, nursing etc etc)

@CovidSmart

so if I am doing a summary of what you are saying

• subject as such isn't such an issue as long as you go to a (very?) good university.
• companies will then look at what sort of work experience you have (so part time jobs and placements are a must?)
• university should be chosen according to its culture and evaluation system
• but the main idea of going to Uni is to grow up (even though that one leaves me a bit )
• and the subject as such doesn't matter that much (as long as what you want top do isn't vocational, engineerring, nursing etc etc)

Pretty much yes! University over subject. London if possible for maximum fun plus maximum opportunities.

E.g. history at Durham or UCL will get you into being a solicitor training contract just as easily as a law degree

This is where you see you can live in a country for more than 20 years and still miss something.
Sorry it feels just so so wrong to me!! How can you do law wo a law degree

I do think it's really important to choose a university that is a good fit for you in terms of the culture and general vibe, as well as the reputation/ star staff/ research accolades.

London if possible for maximum fun plus maximum opportunities.

Haha, now that is NOT going to happen. London has been a no-go right from the start for both dcs.

I would have loved them to go there for those reasons.

And I would have had an excuse to go there more often. Why arent children doing just what we parents want?

@CovidSmart

E.g. history at Durham or UCL will get you into being a solicitor training contract just as easily as a law degree

This is where you see you can live in a country for more than 20 years and still miss something.
Sorry it feels just so so wrong to me!! How can you do law wo a law degree

The decent law firms take 50% of their recruits from non-law. So history at a top uni gets you in, law at a second-grade uni means a fight to get there.

If you want a decent London/city job a lot of the time uni is 50% finishing school, 50% qualification (1st or high 2:1, decent uni, subject irrelevant). And an absolute tonne of fun, building a group of people that end up as a network.

@AbsentmindedWoman, how do learn about what sort of culture there is at a specific university?

Unless they have a vocation in mind, I would say they need a) a reputable degree from a reputable university (but doesn't matter WHAT degree), and an experience that reflects the amount they are paying for it.

Many people end up living where they went to university, so these things do matter.

The reason that people end up in MW jobs after university is that a degree is no longer the golden ticket it used to be.

Why don’t they want to go to London? Best place for opportunities, I would say London opens so many doors for work experience. Plus it means you’re likely to end up able to stay and with friends who will also stay.

[quote CovidSmart]@titchy, what sort of grad schemes are open to students with a history degree?[/quote]
The big accountancy firms take on people with all sorts of degrees. They also take on people with just A levels as well.

The big four names to look for in the UK are PwC, Deloitte, EY and KPMG.

[quote CovidSmart]@EarringsandLipstick, how can you learn about the culture of one university?[/quote]
What does that mean?

Do you mean how do you find out about a university's culture?

You do your research! Open Days, read online, talk to people, look at their course offerings & extra-curricular options, look at the leadership, check the media coverage.

See what the academics from there contribute to society ie their publications, ideas, roles on committees etc

Sports etc - how do the teams do, how well is the area resourced. And so on!

It's multi-faceted and takes research by you & DC