I want neighbours like the people that surrounded that van in Glasgow

[flashbac]

These people are legends. This was the tonic I needed:

twitter.com/ClareHymer/status/1392884673634836486?s=19

This is not about promoting lawlessness. Dawn raids are barbaric and it was EID.

large numbers of unskilled workers costing the economy more than they’re paying in taxes

My understanding is that the demographic in Scotland is that they are short of working age people and very much need immigrants, but they are not permitted to set their own immigration policy independently from England.

large numbers of unskilled workers costing the economy more than they’re paying in taxes

My understanding is that the demographic in Scotland is that they are short of working age people and very much need immigrants, but they are not permitted to set their own immigration policy independently from England.. I believe your understanding is completely correct, but in terms of opening the borders and allowing unrestricted immigration, are we to shepherd people up to Scotland against their will? Or just hope they make their own way to areas where the existing demographic badly needs a boost?

I completely support immigration and think it’s vital for the UK’s survival, as well as just making the UK a better place to live in general. What I don’t support is people doing it illegally. Especially when you have other people working their arses off to get here without breaking the law.

Sorry absolutely right to round up lawless illegal immigrants to be deported

You make it sound like they have been on the run, hiding out up dark alleys for 13yrs (one of them came here in 2008) this is not the case. The Home Office knows where they live. Mr Singh, a mechanic, had been trying to renew his visa, if immigration was a devolved matter or Scotland was an Independent country, he would have had his visa renewed in 2016 when he applied because we need people like him in Scotland.

As it stands, the UK Border Agency will likely be back to drag him out of his home and into the back of a van when they refuse his appeal. The people of Glasgow will be waiting, he is one of us now.

@Sn0tnose It's possibly naive to not see that the Home Office are more than capable of making decisions designed to unsettle. It's called Hostile Environment Policy for a reason.

Why dawn raids?

These guys were in the process of trying to sort their papers, in plain sight of the community.

I do despair of the attitudes on here, crying 'wokery' . Seeping of privilege.

I sincerely hope you never come up against adversity, that you don't need a stranger to stand up for you individually or collectively.

As far as I can tell, we are never far off from adversity, the pandemic has shown us that - we can go from rich to poor quickly, we can go from healthy to ill and chronic health conditions quickly. And then you'll need your community and your fellow citizens to stand by you, not judge you or treat you as less than everyone else.

The Windrush generation went from members of our communities to dehumanised 'criminals' who were removed from their homes in these dawn raids and returned to countries they'd never set foot in.

The people of Glasgow aren't saying that borders should be thrown open or that paperwork shouldn't be worked on. But what they won't stand for is the treatment of fellow humans in this manner that was disproportionate to situation. They recognised that it was about more than paperwork of 2 men.

And if that makes me 'woke' then fine by me. By me a t-shirt.

Bravo Glasgow 🥂

The Windrush generation went from members of our communities to dehumanised 'criminals' who were removed from their homes in these dawn raids and returned to countries they'd never set foot in.

The people of Glasgow aren't saying that borders should be thrown open or that paperwork shouldn't be worked on. But what they won't stand for is the treatment of fellow humans in this manner that was disproportionate to situation. They recognised that it was about more than paperwork of 2 men.

Exactly. All those criminalising these people and naively believing that people aren't detained or removed for no reason or without fair legal representation, should familiarise themselves with the Windrush scandal. Its recent and it makes clear that the Home Office couldn't give a damn about fairness.

Aamer Anwar, the mens' lawyer said, “I said to them: ‘You’re free because of the people of Glasgow,’ and pointed to the crowd behind me. They had tears in their eyes. They had heard the people chanting through the van doors, but they couldn’t believe what they saw.”

Charandeep Singh, the director of the charity Sikhs in Scotland, knows the two men from their volunteering at the local gurdwara. “People know their names and they really are part of the community, that’s why there was this outpouring, but it was also the outrage people feel about the Home Office policy of forced removals.”

Community rejection of dawn raids in Glasgow goes back decades, but Singh suggests Thursday’s response was also the result of cumulative tragedies that have affected the city’s asylum seekers of late, including their relocation to cramped hotel rooms during the Covid pandemic, the Park Inn stabbings and the death of Mercy Baguma. “As Glaswegians we have seen these cases on a regular basis, and especially over the last year. Yesterday, people said ‘enough is enough’
The Guardian

@DumplingsAndStew

Statement from the Glasgow No Evictions Network who seemed to organise much of the numbers of protestors.

Thanks @DumplingsAndStew for posting that statement. It’s well worth a read. The numbers of police deployed was terrifying. I had to pop away for a bit in the afternoon and to get back to my flat had to walk through around 50 riot police, and there were similar numbers stationed at every corner, but out of sight of the actual protest, not to mention the mounted police who arrived mid afternoon, which never really makes you feel safe in these situations. I was really concerned Police Scotland were really going to cock it up.

Dawn raids are barbaric

Yes they are when you are awoken by loud banging on door which you go to open at 5.30am to find five police officers on my doorstep and their sudden realisation that little old lady with her walking frame who opened the door is not the person they wish to apprehend.

We once had 3 large police bang on out root at 11pm. They took one look at us and smiles ‘oops wrong flat - errr we had a call...’ we pointed to the ‘usual suspects’ flat. They were very nice about it. DS was fascinated and asked them all about their various pouches on their belts.

I agree with so many others here - of course any country needs an immigration policy. If we somehow lived in a world where every country was an equally safe place to live with equal opportunities, we wouldn't. But heartbreakingly that isnt the case.

The two things that then make me massively opposed to the actions of the home office are 1) scotland socially and economically needs more immigration but cannot set the policy itself and 2) the way immigration policy is designed and implemented by Westminster is inhumane, treats all people as criminals (which they are not, even if overstaying - theres a difference between not lawful and "illegal" but the home office also treats people actively applying through legal channels as if criminals), and actually pushes people underground, into situations where they cannot integrate with communities and economy. They dont call it a hostile environment policy for nothing.

This sums it up for me.

@Sn0tnose It's possibly naive to not see that the Home Office are more than capable of making decisions designed to unsettle. It's called Hostile Environment Policy for a reason. I get that, I really do. And I know that the Home Office has made some almighty cock ups in the past. But I think it’s also naive to believe that Immigration shouldn’t attempt to detain people who have no leave to be here on the basis that they’re good people, or that they might submit an application at some point in the future.

Why dawn raids? Same reason as Police and Bailiffs I’d imagine. So they don’t waste an entire day going from house to house looking for people who are out working.

These guys were in the process of trying to sort their papers, in plain sight of the community. Everyone seems to be assuming that they were slap bang in the middle of doing that, but there’s nothing in any media report I’ve seen that suggests that. Neither of the immigration lawyers quoted in the media made any suggestion that there were any outstanding applications or in country appeals, which is curious because if they did have anything outstanding, surely it would be the first thing that the lawyers would raise to show the incompetence of the Home Office? If there was nothing outstanding, it’s either got to be that they hadn’t submitted anything, or they had, and they’d been refused. Either way, they have no leave. Is Immigration supposed to ignore them on the basis that they might submit something else at some point in the future? None of us know how long they’d been here without any leave or how many applications they’ve already had refused, so I don’t understand why everyone is assuming that immigration have either been wicked or incompetent. And I’m sure that some people will see this and think that those are standard practice for the Home Office, but I think it’s easy to believe that when we only ever hear about the mistakes.

They may well have been in plain sight of the community, but how is that relevant? Most people are in plain sight of the community they live in. Are Immigration only supposed to enforce policy against people who don’t engage with their neighbours?

@Whoarethewho

Sorry absolutely right to round up lawless illegal immigrants to be deported. Wokery of the highest order those stopping the officers doing their jobs. At last the immigration service need to enforce border controls. And at least they know where they are and will be back.

They should be rounding up right wing useless excuses for humans, not immigrants going through appeal process.

"They should be rounding up right wing useless excuses for humans, not immigrants going through appeal process."

If only

I don't think it's woke to disagree and protest against a heavy handed border enforcement. Nobody is naive enough to think immigration can go unchecked, that isn't what the protest was about.

I think it’s easy to believe that when we only ever hear about the mistakes.

'Mistakes' (and I use the inverted commas deliberately) are made every day. Multiple ones. And you don't hear about them unless someone kicks up a fuss. The Windrush stuff was going on for years, and surfaced only thanks to a determined and indomitable journalist.

I used to be very on the fence about immigration detention etc, but since volunteering in the field and meeting these people and looking at their casework, I'm in a semi-permanent state of fury. Asylum seekeers, succesful or otherwise aren't an amorphous blob of people to me now. They're actual people, many of them traumatised by their treatment at the hands of the HO. I wish I could tell some stories here, but the danger of anyone being identified is too great.

I never saw myself as someone who'd end up taking this kind of position. I've spent my life being wishy-washy middle of the road until I took up this work, kind of by accident. But I really wish I'd been there in Glasgow. It would have been really satisfying.

It was a proud day for Glasgow/Scotland. It wasn’t mob rule, it was a peaceful protest against barbaric treatment of people seeking asylum. The fact all political parties in Scotland (except Tories of course) have expressed their desire for a more compassionate immigration policy, is something to celebrate.

@Undersnatch

It was a proud day for Glasgow/Scotland. It wasn’t mob rule, it was a peaceful protest against barbaric treatment of people seeking asylum. The fact all political parties in Scotland (except Tories of course) have expressed their desire for a more compassionate immigration policy, is something to celebrate.

Yep. On the other thread about this, people were trying to bring Covid into it. But everyone in the photos I've seen was wearing a mask, even.

A community coming together to make a stand, peacefully, was a beautiful thing to see.

While I support the protesters, I also understand there being some concern about Covid giving numbers rising a bit in that area. But yes masks were worn and people appeared to be behaving sensibly. Not like looking at the Ibrox pictures right now .

Well, that's Ibrox for you....

Ah I just heard fireworks going off. That explains it. Thought I was hearing things