To be cross with our childminder?

[ranging]

Name changed.

DD has been going to the same childminder since she was 8 months and she is now 2.5. She absolutely loves it there and she's very kind and friendly, I get lots of crafts home that DD does and they go out and do a lot.

DD is going through a challenging phase, not doing as she's told, very stubborn, sometimes hitting and biting.

When I picked her up on Friday, the childminder said that she had taken her shoes and socks off in the car and was refusing to put them back on, so she took her out the car and put him on the (wet and muddy) ground in her bare feet and told her basically that's what you get for not putting your shoes on. She apparently got upset by this and then finally allowed her to put her shoes back on.

I was a bit taken aback by this, AIBU to tell her I am not happy about this at all? I'm not sure if this is an ok tactic to use with a toddler but I never would and don't want anyone else to treat her like that either.

Like I've said, no one steps into glass on purpose, usually by accident as it hasnt been seen before the foot has touched it. An injury that can be easily avoided.

Anyone setting a barefoot child down is going to have checked.

But hey, if your comfortable with it, great!

I however am not.

Then you’d need to find another childminder. Just as the OP will if she disagrees with their methods.

I'd be happy with that consequence playing out. It is a more valuable lesson than strapping her into the pushchair imo, and demonstrates exactly why she was being asked to put her shoes and socks on. I wouldn't say anything, op, good childminders are hard to find.

In life, the consequence of not wanting to wear socks or shoes is not a person much bigger than you forcing you onto the wet, cold, dirty ground

If you really feel this is what happened you should get a new childminder 😏

Now she can see actions have consequences. So she got wet feet....the childminders actions didn't undermine your childs confidence. Sometimes verbal reasoning just doesn't cut it when the child's in a lather.
Imagine how you'd have felt had your toddler stood on something and hurt her feet through lack of shoes.

@BrokenLink

The childminder used a natural consequence with good effect. As long as it was done in an a calm way with no shaming, I think it sounds fine.

Agree with this

It does sound like the childminder knows what she is doing and this will help you out in the long run.

What would you have preferred? CM to put her in the buggy she doesn’t like so she tantrummed in there? Or carried her? Or made the other children wait whilst she refused to put her shoes on? You’re being precious. It’s a bit of mud, not going to cause any harm at all and she now knows the consequences of refusing to put her shoes on.

@soditall56 what would you have done?

I suspect her behaviour is worse at childminders because you adapt round your child. The childminder can't do that. So whereas you could sit in the car for an hour until she put her shoes and socks on, the childminder has to get child 1 to nursery in 10 minutes and then child 2 needs a nap in half an hour, etc.
I know with #1 I altered life round her. She was never woken from a sleep for example. She used to sleep in until 8:30, nap from 1:30-4:30 in the afternoon with no problems. #3 I had to get #1 and #2 to school/preschool by 8:45, pick up #2 at 12:00 and pick up #1 at 3:00, then sometimes #1 would have things afterschool we had to take her to.
It's a totally different situation.

Anyway, going back to the shoes and socks, it would have worked well with #1, or #3 so I would have done it. I'm equally confident that #2 would have gone "what fun, bare feet paddling in mud, I'll do this every time" so I wouldn't have done it with her. She's 17yo and still wears shoes as little as possible.

And if her behaviour is worse in one setting than the other, it may be due to inconsistency of approaches between you and CM.

@JustLyra

Like I've said, no one steps into glass on purpose, usually by accident as it hasnt been seen before the foot has touched it. An injury that can be easily avoided.

Anyone setting a barefoot child down is going to have checked.

But hey, if your comfortable with it, great!

I however am not.

Then you’d need to find another childminder. Just as the OP will if she disagrees with their methods.

Most people walking barefoot look where they are walking however accidents happen do they not?

Well if it meant changing childcare providers (after a conversation as changing without one would be a bit drastic would it not?) then so be it

You will not change my mind on this which seems like you are trying to by telling me my opinion is wrong (😂)

Seriously, have a nice Sunday and maybe look to learn that people have different opinions on different things and that is ok!

Who is she biting and hitting? The other children at the childminders?

Absolutely nothing wrong. I’d have been more than happy with this. Mind you, I’m on baby number 4 now (he’s also 2.5 and going through a challenging phase) so I’m more relaxed than I might have been if it were my first child.

That said, it was a natural consequence and taught her the reasons for putting shoes and socks on. 🤷🏻‍♀️

In life, the consequence of not wanting to wear socks or shoes is not a person much bigger than you forcing you onto the wet, cold, dirty ground

In life, the consequence of not wanting to wear socks or shoes is not a person much bigger than you forcing you into a seat, strapping you in, and pushing you wherever they want you to go.

@SoupDragon

But hey, if your comfortable with it, great!

I however am not.

So what would you have done?

As a parent I'd discuss with the childminder that I wasn't comfortable with that approach and agree a practical way forward we are both comfortable with keeping in mind the other children she is looking after at the same time and if we couldn't agree I would consider my childcare arrangements

If my child was acting like that with me I would put their shoes and socks back on before getting out the car 🤷🏼‍♀️

In our house the consequences of refusing to put shoes and socks on were cold feet. Similarly the consequences of kicking the rain cover off once too often was getting very wet.

You clearly think your upset is justified op so what is the point of this post? As far as consequences of actions go, briefly having cold wet feet is a very minor one.

Even if the ground was freezing cold it wouldn’t harm a child. I wouldn’t worry about this. If you don’t want to wear shoes you have to put bare feet on the ground. Seems ok to me.

100% PFB.

If my child was acting like that with me I would put their shoes and socks back on before getting out the car

Yeah... I bet the childminder made no effort to do that 😂😂😂

And if they didn't let you put them back on? What then? Presumably you would have used force to do so...?

I think it's really important at this age to show children that you have to follow instructions. They're pushing the boundaries and testing if they can be in charge. This is the time to be clear that you're the boss and the child must do as they're told.
Obviously this doesn't apply to every little decision, you give them choices in many other circumstances (e.g. which toy to play with, which yoghurt flavour) but sometimes (hold hands when crossing the road, wearing shoes when going out), you are very clear that they must do as they're told and provide no other options or alternatives, it's not negotiable and there will be no debate.

OP,

I think it was a reasonable lesson in consequences.

You have admitted that she is very difficult at the CM's.

I would be cautious about criticising a CM doing her best to manage a difficult toddler, when you are very happy with the general care she provides.

You could find yourself being given short noticed by her and deeply regret it.

Toddlers that are really hard work make for a long day.

I remember a friends child playing up in the morning when he started school and refusing to get dressed and there was drama and upset every morning.

One morning her husband was at home and bundled him into the car in his pjs and brought him to school.

He went to get him out of school and the child was crying etc. He was told by his father if he ever made a fuss again, he would be carried into school in his pjs.

No further problems were had.
He was shown the consequences of his behaviour.

I thought the father was correct.

If my child was acting like that with me I would put their shoes and socks back on before getting out the car 🤷🏼‍♀️

With other little ones all waiting whilst you persuaded her, whilst she kicked out or hit you or bit you. Then the others think its funny so they copy?

OP, you said you oppose shame tactics - but isn’t putting her in a push chair in front of her friends when she misbehaves just that? She is treated like a baby, and psychologically embarrassed and frustrated for her behaviour amongst her peers.

If that’s your usual tactic, it suggests it doesn’t work. See if she messes around not wearing shoes again before you judge this one, I think!

I think you're being too precious about this. So what if your toddler got cold wet feet for a few minutes. The same thing happens when you paddle in the sea.
You sound like you could take a leaf out of this experienced woman's book. She may well be able to help you shorten this 'phase'.