To think that a Rape Crisis centre should not have a transwoman CEO?

[ArabellaScott]

Mridhul Wadhwa has just been appointed CEO of Edinburgh Rape Crisis. The job was advertised as for women only. Mridhul is a transwoman (born male) without a Gender Recognition Certificate.

AIBU to think that women survivors of rape and sexual violence should be able to have a female only space?

theedinburghreporter.co.uk/2021/05/new-boss-for-edinburgh-rape-crisis-centre/

I have said nothing against Mridhul Wadhwa, I have nothing against transwomen. Yes, I am aware that men are victims of rape, too. I am aware that trans people are victims of rape.

My question was whether a post that was advertised specifically for women only (for pretty understandable reasons) should have been given to a transwoman.

Did they specify the role was open only to women? Yes
Is this person legally a woman? No

Simple asthat. Agree 100%.

@Ereshkigalangcleg

think she was an excellent choice for CEO, best of luck to her.

Why?

Because Be Kind and TWAW and all the other mindless thoughtless sound bites is why.

@LondonStone

This is why everyone thinks Mumsnet is shit and transphobic. I really like it here generally but I’d be embarrassed to mention it in real life.

God yeah. How embarrassing to think that women who have been raped have the right to a service that puts their needs first

And if men want and need rape centres then they should campaign and set them up themselves as women did in the 70s.

Both dogs and cats are subjected to horrendous cruelty from humans.

Is it discriminatory against dogs that we have separate, specialised cat rescues? Would you insist on sending a cat that was terrified of dogs after being attacked by dogs and humans, to Battersea Cats and Dogs Home?

Or would you understand and have empathy for her needs, and send her to a specialised cat sanctuary where she wouldn't see any dogs?

@Jesusmaryjosephandthecamel

Women are not the only victims of rape. My local centre sees male and female victims.

My partner is a male victim of rape and he still thinks that women should have their own spaces.

They lied about their sex to get the job. I think that alone makes them a huge problem. Watch as women are now pushed out of this service. This was a token hire and it will backfire badly for women.

They lied about their sex to get their original job. I suspect they were welcomed into this one to virtue signal, and because the women's sector today is chock full of TWAW queer theory fans who see the wishes, feelings and needs of their female service users as secondary to their personal and ideological agenda.

Whenever people ask a question or challenge anything concerning the trans community they always end up being called trans bashers! Absolutely ridiculous.

If the advert was for women only and this person whom I have never heard of is legally a male then I don't understand how they have justified giving her the job. Regardless of how well she may perform.

My question was whether a post that was advertised specifically for women only (for pretty understandable reasons) should have been given to a transwoman.
Absolutely not, as they are not a woman

I would like to know what the genuine occupational requirement was that allowed them to advertise the position as being open to women only.

If a biological male can do the job, then the post should have been open to all applicants, including men.

If the postholder needed to be biologically female due to the nature of the work, then this person does not appear to meet that criteria.

If the post was advertised as being open to people of female gender only, then I would very much like to know the rationale for that, and indeed the legality of such a restriction.

It would be very interesting to see this challenged in court.

@everybodysang

It's not an issue. She'll be an excellent CEO. YABU, however, for bringing your trans-bashing out of the Feminism boards. And I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who thinks so. MN isn't just for transphobes.

Agree, there's a reason I hide the feminism board!

I'd have more respect if a biological male had applied who presented as a male, and who said that they felt that they had the right skills to be the CEO and explained why, and also agreed that access for women to biological women counsellors would be protected. If he then also argued that there should be services for transwomen, and also for males who present as males, and that the centre should expand to provide this (or other centres should be set up), then I would listen and consider their arguments.

But by totally ignoring the fact that the job was for a woman, and ignoring why this was, and knowing that they were not one, but still tried to get the job - it feels deceptive and like they have no understanding of the needs of women. And how they can square that with being a CEO of a rape crisis centre, I don't know.

It's a completely separate issue from whether rape crisis services need to be provided to trans people, and to men, and what the best ways to go about providing those services are. You don't get that by hiring a transwoman for a job that was intended to be for women, to run a service that was meant to be for women, because that will just mean that that particular service then becomes for transwomen instead, and biological women won't all be comfortable using it.

studentnewspaper.org/article/an-insight-with-mridul-wadhwa-into-working-in-a-rape-crisis-centre - this is the article referred to.

Also from that article

"Most importantly, rape crisis centres are spaces for those affected by sexual violence, most of whom are women. The Student asked Wadhwa if she believes a man could be a successful rape crisis centre manager. She does not: “I don’t think men are ready to go out and set up services of this nature. Women’s aid organisations and rape crisis centres have been set up with the blood, sweat, and tears of women. It’s about the women’s experience of sexual violence. Our workforce is reserved for women only.”

Either it's important that a woman is CEO of Edinburgh Rape Crisis or it isn't.

It was clearly important enough that the job advert specified that only females can apply.

So why has a biological male been appointed in the role?

@paralysedbyinertia

I would like to know what the genuine occupational requirement was that allowed them to advertise the position as being open to women only.

If a biological male can do the job, then the post should have been open to all applicants, including men.

If the postholder needed to be biologically female due to the nature of the work, then this person does not appear to meet that criteria.

If the post was advertised as being open to people of female gender only, then I would very much like to know the rationale for that, and indeed the legality of such a restriction.

It would be very interesting to see this challenged in court.

The job could not be advertised on the basis of gender, as that is not a protected characteristic.

The biological reality is, as would be a GRC, but the appointee has neither of those things and therefore was ineligible to apply, never mind be successful.

Rape crisis centres can meet the needs of men, women, trans people and all other chosen definitions. That's not the issue.

The question to think about is do you believe that a woman, who wants female only support in female only spaces following a rape, should be denied this for political reasons that benefit male people? Bearing in mind this will mean that some women just give up on trying to get support. Or is it perfectly possible to have female only services alongside mixed sex and all other forms of service?

And then when you've thought about how you feel about that, the next question to ask yourself is: how ethical is it that someone be placed as a CEO in charge of these services who not only has a powerful political belief about ending female only services for females but a strong and personal vested interest in ensuring this? Is that in keeping with usual standards for public office?

@TruelyWonder

I get that women of course need their own space but surely the organisation should be providing help and a space (separately) for men too.

Absolutely men should have and fund their very own space, if they need one. Not piggyback onto one I personally help fund because it was women only users staffed by women only. There are reasons for women only spaces and a rape shelter is one.

None of these 'you're so transphobic' posters seem to actually be addressing any of the points being made in this thread?

If it's advertised as a position for women only that should be biological women otherwise anyone can say they are a woman and apply. Not that transwomen or transmen or men can't be good CEO's but I assume there's a good reason it's for women only otherwise it would be discriminatory.

OP, I think you’d have got different responses if you’d asked it more like

“People who lie or conceal important information when applying for jobs shouldn’t be then given the job”.

As I said on the FWR board, this organisation has suffered from huge scope creep as to what services they provide and to whom.

I suspect the women only post holder rule and the name of the organisation itself are now out of date.

From their website:

We offer free and confidential emotional and practical support, information and advocacy to women, all members of the trans community, non-binary people and young people aged 12-18 in Edinburgh, East and Midlothian, who have experienced sexual violence at any time in their lives. This includes, rape, sexual assault, sexual abuse, childhood sexual abuse and commercial sexual exploitation.

That article confirms that she has acted as a counsellor before.

The work is incredibly emotionally draining, so Wadhwa has to be balanced and mindful of her own emotional state. The Student asked her what she does to take care of herself: “Well I don’t deal with individual survivors every day, so for me what I do in terms of self-care is a lot of avoidance. I do see survivors – four a week usually – who help me stay connected to the cause…but it’s important to keep it fun. We should be able to laugh and use humour atwork.In terms of my team, I try to cook for them once a week or every other week.”

@Letsgetreadytocrumble

None of these 'you're so transphobic' posters seem to actually be addressing any of the points being made in this thread?

Easier to squeal "You are transphobic" and shut down the difficult conversations about what being "kind" now actually means for vulnerable women and children.

@ArabellaScott

If a job has been advertised specifically for women and only women, I presume there is a reason for that.

Was this job specifically advertised as such? Are you allowed to do that?