To think that a Rape Crisis centre should not have a transwoman CEO?

[ArabellaScott]

Mridhul Wadhwa has just been appointed CEO of Edinburgh Rape Crisis. The job was advertised as for women only. Mridhul is a transwoman (born male) without a Gender Recognition Certificate.

AIBU to think that women survivors of rape and sexual violence should be able to have a female only space?

theedinburghreporter.co.uk/2021/05/new-boss-for-edinburgh-rape-crisis-centre/

[MarieIVanArkleStinks]

It's grim that a girl who was gang raped wants a female doctor to examine her injuries?

Indeed Fernlake. And this 'CEO' who has apparently been appointed on an entirely false premise seems to think it quite appropriate to force this practice on an already traumatised victim.

This is cold, cynical targeting by stealth of the spaces of the must vulnerable women. Activists are infiltrating these and then imposing their ideology from a position of power. Having attained those positions then they can't be ousted from on pain of asserting their own 'rights' over those of women. The consequences for trying to do so have been felt by the likes of Maya Forrester, J K Rowling, Kathleen Stock, Sarah Phillimore and others.

There's something very coercive, invasive and forceful about the way in which women are being forced to capitulate; something not dissimilar to the kind of enforced power and humiliation that motivates the crime of rape in the first place. To a victim (as I once was) this could easily be seen as a continuation - this time social and institutional - of exactly the same imposition of degradation.

I'd suggest anyone who doesn't see this as part of a concerted, insidious and misogynistic campaign against women is missing a great deal of the bigger picture.

[thepuredrop]

@poppycat10

This thread prompted me to check my employer's diversity policy. It says that it covers the various protected characteristics under the EA - including sex and gender reassignment. So far so good.

But then it says that it monitors work carried out related to certain characteristics as well as any disciplinary action taken in relation to certain characteristics - and both refer to gender, not sex or gender reassignment. Hmmmm.

Am I brave enough to point this out? I don't think so, but if I ever leave the job, I will.

If you’re feeling brave, there’s an argument to present that your company might be in breach of GDPR if it’s collecting data for monitoring purposes that are poorly-defined.
GDPR principles include that data collection is accurate, for a specific, explicit and legitimate purpose.
Sex and gender reassignment are the protected characteristics for Equalities monitoring, gender isn’t legally defined thus how can it be more accurate than the protected characteristics?

[R0wantrees]

Atlantic long read article by Helen Lewis provides context:
'Scotland’s Feminist Schism
What happens when a political party has no viable opposition? It creates one from within.'
(extract)
"Sometimes, though, there is a clash between these new progressive values and liberalism’s older traditions, which emphasize free speech and robust debate. Take the recent Scottish Hate Crime Bill, which is—by American standards—extraordinarily illiberal. In its proposed form, Scots could be prosecuted for “stirring up hatred,” even if they had not intended to do so, and libraries and bookshops could be prosecuted for loaning or selling “inflammatory material.” Even speech within a private home could be subject to criminal sanctions.

These provisions were later watered down, but even so, some feminist campaigners in Scotland fear the law will further chill discussions of sex and gender. In March, Mary Gordon, a great-niece of the SNP’s founder, chalked a message on a government building in Edinburgh: “Women’s rights are not a hate crime.” Soon after, two uniformed police officers visited her house to warn her that she could be arrested for breach of the peace if she repeated the protest. The backlash to Rowling had already frightened many people and organizations away from any engagement with the subject: In July, a billboard reading only i [heart] jk rowling was removed from an Edinburgh train station because it was “political” and potentially offensive.

The gender wars have pushed disagreements within the SNP, which are rarely allowed to reach outsiders, into the public eye. Nothing has ever challenged the power of Queen Nicola—and the party’s reputation for lockstep unity—quite like this before. (The SNP even has rules that none of its junior politicians can criticize its policies or the leadership.) Joan McAlpine is the highest-profile feminist SNP dissident at Holyrood, the seat of the Scottish Parliament, while Joanna Cherry fulfills the same role at Westminster. Alongside more than 100 female members of the SNP, some of them anonymous, both signed a “Women’s Pledge” in the fall of 2019 addressed to Sturgeon, which stated: “We require single-sex spaces in order to be able to participate in public life. Put simply, for reasons of bodily boundaries and trauma, we cannot share female-only spaces with male people regardless of their personalities, dress sense, identities etc.” (continues)
www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2021/05/nicola-sturgeon-scotland-election/618790/

[tellmewhentheLangshiplandscoz]

As an aside, I note the thread police are out in force chastising OP for discussing this outside of FWR.

I ask those posters - do you police all threads to this degree or just those which involve women standing up for sex based rights?

And if you could help me understand why asking questions and challenging is transphobic that would be helpful (and a first). Links to specific so called transphobia would be good.

[tellmewhentheLangshiplandscoz]

transgender activists and allies on social media organized a “call to action” and shared outrage as it became clear that men who self-identify as transgender women would not be entitled to conduct intimate medical examinations on rape victims.

////:

Seriously, anybody who agrees with this action should not be allowed within a mile of a vulnerable woman. Their motives are so questionable it beggars belief.

[tellmewhentheLangshiplandscoz]

@Ereshkigalangcleg

This is why everyone thinks Mumsnet is shit and transphobic. I really like it here generally but I’d be embarrassed to mention it in real life.

Perhaps you should do some research on this specific person and consider whether they have the requisite empathy and consideration for women to run a rape counselling service.

The Equality Act specifically makes provision for excluding all males from applying for these jobs, something RCE have dishonestly made use of in excluding other males via the sex based exemption for genuine occupational need.

👏

Thank you.

[CirclesWithinCircles]

[quote R0wantrees]Atlantic long read article by Helen Lewis provides context:
'Scotland’s Feminist Schism
What happens when a political party has no viable opposition? It creates one from within.'
(extract)
"Sometimes, though, there is a clash between these new progressive values and liberalism’s older traditions, which emphasize free speech and robust debate. Take the recent Scottish Hate Crime Bill, which is—by American standards—extraordinarily illiberal. In its proposed form, Scots could be prosecuted for “stirring up hatred,” even if they had not intended to do so, and libraries and bookshops could be prosecuted for loaning or selling “inflammatory material.” Even speech within a private home could be subject to criminal sanctions.

These provisions were later watered down, but even so, some feminist campaigners in Scotland fear the law will further chill discussions of sex and gender. In March, Mary Gordon, a great-niece of the SNP’s founder, chalked a message on a government building in Edinburgh: “Women’s rights are not a hate crime.” Soon after, two uniformed police officers visited her house to warn her that she could be arrested for breach of the peace if she repeated the protest. The backlash to Rowling had already frightened many people and organizations away from any engagement with the subject: In July, a billboard reading only i [heart] jk rowling was removed from an Edinburgh train station because it was “political” and potentially offensive.

The gender wars have pushed disagreements within the SNP, which are rarely allowed to reach outsiders, into the public eye. Nothing has ever challenged the power of Queen Nicola—and the party’s reputation for lockstep unity—quite like this before. (The SNP even has rules that none of its junior politicians can criticize its policies or the leadership.) Joan McAlpine is the highest-profile feminist SNP dissident at Holyrood, the seat of the Scottish Parliament, while Joanna Cherry fulfills the same role at Westminster. Alongside more than 100 female members of the SNP, some of them anonymous, both signed a “Women’s Pledge” in the fall of 2019 addressed to Sturgeon, which stated: “We require single-sex spaces in order to be able to participate in public life. Put simply, for reasons of bodily boundaries and trauma, we cannot share female-only spaces with male people regardless of their personalities, dress sense, identities etc.” (continues)
www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2021/05/nicola-sturgeon-scotland-election/618790/[/quote]
R0wantrees "Sometimes, though, there is a clash between these new progressive values and liberalism’s older traditions, which emphasize free speech and robust debate. Take the recent Scottish Hate Crime Bill, which is—by American standards—extraordinarily illiberal. In its proposed form, Scots could be prosecuted for “stirring up hatred,” even if they had not intended to do so, and libraries and bookshops could be prosecuted for loaning or selling “inflammatory material.” Even speech within a private home could be subject to criminal sanctions.

Lets just say that what is currently happening in Scotland, along with past failed attempts at passing legislation in breach of human rights/EU competition law (as it was then) are garnering quite a bit of international interest amongst academics. Theres just so much materials.

Some of the advice that the SG is getting on potential legislative clashes with human rights seems...somewhat ambitious, and not particularly neutral.

But its a country of only 5 million people, with an inherited political and legal constitution still further weakened by lost rights through devolution and a weak press...its a perfect storm really. Very unprecedented in a modern western democracy.

What Scotland needs quite urgently is an independent, secondary chamber with real powers because clearly having a unicameral legislature is causing big problems.

[Fernlake]

When no one is listening, and you're shut down at every turn, censored and silenced

In March, Mary Gordon, a great-niece of the SNP’s founder, chalked a message on a government building in Edinburgh: “Women’s rights are not a hate crime.” Soon after, two uniformed police officers visited her house to warn her that she could be arrested for breach of the peace if she repeated the protest

And

Even speech within a private home could be subject to criminal sanctions.

It's petrifying.

[Waitwhat23]

I am just astounded that we are having to fight for the continuation of safe spaces for women when they are vulnerable in 2021. Not fighting to establish these spaces but to continue to have the protections we are entitled to in law.

The generations of women before us who fought for women's rights would have been utterly flabbergasted that the gains they fought so hard for are just being given away.

[Fernlake]

@Waitwhat23

I am just astounded that we are having to fight for the continuation of safe spaces for women when they are vulnerable in 2021. Not fighting to establish these spaces but to continue to have the protections we are entitled to in law.

The generations of women before us who fought for women's rights would have been utterly flabbergasted that the gains they fought so hard for are just being given away.

In the name of progression, pretending that they give us privilege, advantage, and turn us into oppressors.

It's a mindfuck that services set up to help women disadvantaged by their sex, are now deemed a privilege.

[ArabellaScott]

@Caplin

I live in Edinburgh, she seems absolutely qualified and also understands the BAME aspects which is important.

She is the CEO, she has a ton of experience working in the sector. What do you think is going to happen exactly? No wait, I know exactly what you think and it is grim.

What I think is going to happen?

The direct results of this that I envision are:

Women who have had traumatic experiences will not be supported. Women who are in need of support will not seek it out. Women who have been traumatised may be re-traumatised by the presence of a male-bodied person, or a male voice (articles above describe trauma response of rape victims).

The indirect results of this:

The appoinment of a male without a GRC will be used to undermine the single-sex exemptions of the Equality Act. This will ultimately mean that women will lose the right and ability to have any single sex spaces at all.

Some people think that women don't need or deserve to have single sex spaces - that all spaces, areas, fields, etc should be mixed sex.

I disagree. I think that there are exemptions made to try to address some of the sex-based discriminations and disadvantages faced by women and girls for generations, and that they are important and necessary.

[CirclesWithinCircles]

Caplin I live in Edinburgh, she seems absolutely qualified and also understands the BAME aspects which is important.

She is the CEO, she has a ton of experience working in the sector. What do you think is going to happen exactly? No wait, I know exactly what you think and it is grim.

What could possibly go wrong when public funded bodies ignore the law? No precdents for that, are there?

Laws? Who needs them?

Who even needs an accessible and affordable enforcement mechanism for safeguarding their own human rights (which is after what those pesky rights in the EA are based upon).

[ArabellaScott]

Ultimately, for me, it comes down to women being allowed to say 'no'.

This hasn't been an accidental appointment.

The board of the Rape Crisis centre includes politicians, and Scottish RC is closely linked to the Scottish government.

Why place a transwoman into a post like this? Why deliberately ignore the stipulation for a woman?

I think it's a set up. If this goes unprotested, unchallenged, unremarked upon, if any woman to question it is shouted out as a bigot, for 'punching down', then the EA is as good as dead.

[Waitwhat23]

And Scottish women aren't happy about the attacks on our rights - forwomen.scot/03/04/2021/women-wont-wheesht/

[CirclesWithinCircles]

Does anyone else wonder whether we will even be allowed to discuss things like this when the Hate Crime bill becomes legislation?

Will mumsnet be patrolled by Scottish police, ready to ask for posts to be deleted?

Will posters wishing to discuss such issues have to travel to England or use an English based internet provider to post such comments?

Or will only posters outside Scotland feel safe to comment?

The Scottish Government has created a huge, potentially internationally embarrassing problem by excluding only one protected category from the Hate Crime bill, namely sex. It really is quite incredible that they have not chosen to avoid this and gone blundering right ahead with it.

[Caplin]

@Leafstamp

Reported, not found guilty.

[Caplin]

@Fernlake

I read it, and I disagree fundamentally.

[Fernlake]

[quote Caplin]@Leafstamp

Reported, not found guilty.[/quote]
What are you talking about? This person actively flounced when they couldn't enforce legislation that said raped women can't choose the sex of their medical examiner.

What part of that is 'supporting women'?

[Helleofabore]

I am just astounded that we are having to fight for the continuation of safe spaces for women when they are vulnerable in 2021. Not fighting to establish these spaces but to continue to have the protections we are entitled to in law.

I am too. But then I see the number of people post scolding posts without reading the details and I understand exactly how it is happening.

Too many people outsource their critical thinking to 'influencers' and loud voices who have a clear bias and do not look for balance.

In the need to be seen as 'on the right side of history' and 'not like those other girls/women', people blinding go with the flow. Or, they have a personal interest that means they are so heavily invested in being 'inclusive' that they cannot see the pendulum has swung off the hinges.

Still, stay strong all you women out there willing to continue to fight for the needs of females.