To want to give my children a private education?

[NobodyKnowsTiddlyPom]

Really need some input to try and persuade my husband!
My three are all quite bright academically and they are all pretty good with music too. Youngest (9) is very sporty as well.

We’ve recently applied for scholarships and bursaries at a local private school and my husband is still very much on the fence about it all.

The two girls (13, 12) have been offered a total of 70% and 75% discount with scholarships and bursaries and the youngest has been offered a total of 55%

I know that my eldest would do well in state school regardless but I think the younger two would absolutely flourish with the smaller class sizes and the sporting facilities on offer.

My husband thinks we’d be better off putting the £15-£20k per year in our pension pots. I’m not currently working but I’m looking for a full time job from September. I’m a teacher so my salary would cover the fees and my mother in law has also offered to contribute £3-£4K a year towards it. His salary is plenty for us to live on comfortably.

DH would like us to sit down with a list of pros and cons for them to attend this school and I’m hoping that mumsnet can help with a list of pros!

@SunshineCake

Mine went to private school but it was never our choice and it was a horrible experience.

My children are also very bright, one is officially a genius, and would do well anywhere. They did not do any better at the private school than the state school but the teachers benefitted from the dc being there.

If I was starting again they would go to the state school, I'd not use the one we did but take the hit of a drive to get them to a better one, and use the money for any support they needed, should they need it.

May I ask why you did it if it wasn't your choice?

I went to one of the worst comprehensive schools in Liverpool and fast forward thirty years I am now working alongside people (some of whose parents paid for their private secondary education) that have all done the exact same science degree, masters etc, as myself to do our job. Some of us went to different universities but ultimately we have all ended up equal. I have put my own children in different secondary schools to the one I went to but all my children have done really really well in their chosen careers too, so no, I definitely wouldn't pay for any private education.

Main difference is extra-curricular and the work ethic/higher expectations. I thought classes were smaller but this is not always the case.

I would question the bursary too as that seems and extremely high discount if both wages and help from family have been taken into consideration. Also I would be very cautious of taking that much money from parents/in laws. It can more than often be thrown back in faces or withdrawn after a while. Could you still afford it without their help? Could afford it if the bursary changed? Lots to take into consideration

My daughter started in state education. We moved her this year (yr4) and the difference is incredible. My son is due to start school in 2022 and there is no question he will be going private. We aren’t super rich and we get no scholarship but the wraparound care and activities offset part of the cost. I wasn’t privately educated but can already see how it is and will benefit my dd and soon ds. I feel fortunate to have the choice. We visited Dd school and walked away feeling like it was perfect for her so trust your gut!!

Careful on the contextual offer front. They are offered on the basis of home postcode as well as school attended. If you live in an ok area and go to even an adequate state school, you won’t get a contextual offer. Which is as it should be imho.

It also depends on the alternative. A good state school in a desirable area is very similar to an ordinary co-ed private school and a far cry from a state secondary in a deprived area.

Hi OP, My Daughter is at private school and she has flourished. She is in Year 8 and has full time dyslexic support.
We had her diagnosed in Year 5 and for us it was the best decision to send her to the private school as she is doing very well and her confidence has grown.
We live in the SE, small village and my Daughter went to the tiny primary school.
Goodluck in choosing the school.

I’m going to be totally honest and say I think op is falling into a trap of thinking that with a high earning husband and relatively low outgoings they can afford the frills.

I think with one child definitely two possibly three, no.

And many private schools won’t tolerate poor behaviour even if caused by SEN. I get it’s unfair but it is how it is.

Private. Like it or not, on average privately educated children do much better in life. On average of course, there are exceptions on both sides. As parents, we want to give our children the best chance in life. And giving them the best education possible is the best we can do. That’s our investment into our children’s future. My husband and I had exactly the same discussion some months ago. He said we should put the money into paying off our mortgage. Then slowly he changed his mind. We’ll pay off the mortgage a little bit later but investing in our children is the right choice for us. We have now moved our daughter from state to private. Listen to your gut and good luck.

@Mummy012

My daughter started in state education. We moved her this year (yr4) and the difference is incredible. My son is due to start school in 2022 and there is no question he will be going private. We aren’t super rich and we get no scholarship but the wraparound care and activities offset part of the cost. I wasn’t privately educated but can already see how it is and will benefit my dd and soon ds. I feel fortunate to have the choice. We visited Dd school and walked away feeling like it was perfect for her so trust your gut!!

It's not as simple as trusting her gut. The OPs children are older, some are teenagers. They're settled in school with friends. The sudden offer with suspiciously large financial assistance from the school has thrown this one school into the mix. I don't think the OP has chosen this school because it's a good fit for the children, but is being led by the tempting offer of fee reductions.

It’s true that a bright child will probably achieve well regardless of the school. However, at many state schools there is unfortunately a toxic culture of ridiculing those who work hard & are academically successful. For a child who seeks peer approval, that can make school a miserable experience.

@purpleboy
I think saying that children who go to private school have better manners is incorrect, manners are taught by parents. My son was expelled from school when he was 13 and never got put back into a proper school. He is now 17 and can hold a conversation, has perfect manners and has a full time job. He knows how to behave around people and treats everyone with respect. He also has never had a problem with telling me he loves me in front of his friends, even now and will even tell me he loves me every time he leaves the room. I don’t think children’s manners should be judged on what education they have.

We also had experience of my child being bullied and them choosing to keep the bully and his brother as that was two lots of fees against just one with my child . School has now closed.

@BananaSplitX

Private. Like it or not, on average privately educated children do much better in life. On average of course, there are exceptions on both sides. As parents, we want to give our children the best chance in life. And giving them the best education possible is the best we can do. That’s our investment into our children’s future. My husband and I had exactly the same discussion some months ago. He said we should put the money into paying off our mortgage. Then slowly he changed his mind. We’ll pay off the mortgage a little bit later but investing in our children is the right choice for us. We have now moved our daughter from state to private. Listen to your gut and good luck.

Dear god that's at least in part becAuse they come from better off families who might themselves be well educated and/or successful. How can we separate what part private school plays in that? My DC did well because they are bright and have parents who can think critically and are comfortably off. They went to a crap comp alongside lots of kids whose life chances were never going to be equal to theirs due to accident of birth. Sure you can pay for private and add a further advantage (crikey how many does a child need when so many have none?). But don't be daft and say it's down to the private education!

If stonewall continue to take control of schools and you can afford private education go for it without a second thought. High schools now are not as they were and are getting worse.

I work with young people and only last week one young boy of 15 told me that he often gets told off by teachers for ‘mid-gendering’ people. He is autistic and said one pupil in his class is a she one week a he another week and a they the next week. He said it is making his head hurt because he gets shouted at by the pupil for not asking them each time he sees them ‘what’s your pronouns’ he said he doesn’t understand it all and his teachers tell him ‘just be kind’

This is all a nightmare for young people 🤦🏻‍♀️

I sent both my children to private school and went without working day and night waitressing. I’ve never ever regretted it. They only had 15 in a class were taught to be confident. But you have to send all three you can’t single them out.

If you think the school in question is more appropriate for your child's needs, then do it.

Not everyone is the sort who would do well wherever they went to school.

I was let down by the private school I went to. Didn't take a science GCSE because they listened to 14 year old me saying they didn't want me to bring their stats down if I failed. They wouldn't let me participate in any sports, I later went to a 6th form college and excelled at rowing and was asked to row for the GB squad. My private school refused to even let me have a go because I wasn't one of the 8 chosen girls in the year group who did all sports at the school. Looking back at it recently a friend said to me "you were actually bullied by the teachers at school". I have a very poor opinion of the school I went to, not only did they kill my confidence in having any ability what so ever but they also told me to leave education and become a hairdresser I did go to uni in the end and left with a degree so clearly not a total wash out like they said.

Manners are definitely better in private school however drugs are prolific also.

All that said I would definitely think about it seriously for secondary school
if the local schools weren't great. We will probably move house before we get to secondary age and will be moving with schools in mind.

I worked double shifts as a waitress to send both boys private, they bother did very well and I’m now reaping the benefits as they treat me all the time. I say if there’s a will there’s a way.

I fully understand your question, and I’m interested in why you are seeking answers outside of yourself, yet of course, we all do this!
But....
I absolutely do not believe that choosing private education is a route to anything truly good; unless we simply want to reassure ourselves as parents that we will do the “ right thing” by our child?
Private education and all it stands for, will never address the catastrophic inequalities it perpetuates? Why would it?!! It wouldn’t survive without said inequalities.
I urge you to think long and hard on this. I don’t want to sound angry, or arrogant, rather I want to put forward the need for all of us to consider the long term impact and damage caused to the many...by our focus on pushing forward the few, special.... privileged ones?
The confidence we see in privately educated kids is rarely genuine, true confidence... ? Rather, it is a mask, an act ... and they are taught to perfect it in order to “ get ahead”.
The sheer scale of mental health issues in private education is masked by this facade of so called“ confidence”.
I’m a mental health practitioner with young people/ teens, with 26 years experience. I’m not pulling my thoughts from thin air.
In my true belief... private education should be scrapped. I wish you well in your decision making.

In London the ceiling for a discount is an 80k salary - although that would only be about 10% discount.
I’m a teacher and my husband works in finance - we have two on 100% bursary and one on 80% at a different school. They take into account income, amount of children, and outgoings.
We also have a second home which we told them about as it’s our pension pot.
The benefits are smaller class sizes, hopefully higher expectations, connections, resources, opportunity.
There are a few private schools which just boast along on past reputation and parents tutoring to death but if you can get in a good one you couldn’t give them a better start in life. Our schools are amazing and I am so grateful.
You need to have bright kids who are willing to put in the work though - they are really really pushed, especially near exam times, it can be tough but the holidays are long.

Private education destroys more than it gives

@mariabwebster

I fully understand your question, and I’m interested in why you are seeking answers outside of yourself, yet of course, we all do this! But.... I absolutely do not believe that choosing private education is a route to anything truly good; unless we simply want to reassure ourselves as parents that we will do the “ right thing” by our child? Private education and all it stands for, will never address the catastrophic inequalities it perpetuates? Why would it?!! It wouldn’t survive without said inequalities. I urge you to think long and hard on this. I don’t want to sound angry, or arrogant, rather I want to put forward the need for all of us to consider the long term impact and damage caused to the many...by our focus on pushing forward the few, special.... privileged ones? The confidence we see in privately educated kids is rarely genuine, true confidence... ? Rather, it is a mask, an act ... and they are taught to perfect it in order to “ get ahead”. The sheer scale of mental health issues in private education is masked by this facade of so called“ confidence”. I’m a mental health practitioner with young people/ teens, with 26 years experience. I’m not pulling my thoughts from thin air. In my true belief... private education should be scrapped. I wish you well in your decision making.

Life isn’t fair and all will never be equal.

Just to add in, can you cover comfortably non rental periods on your rental property plus your own household expenses plus the portion of fees and still live a nice life. I assume you have to cover extra lessons/lunches etc so factor those in x years kids going. It is a big sacrifice.