Disagreement with DH over DD staying with boyfriend

[laughinggasssing]

Disagreement with DH tonight over a possible future situation. Who’s BU?
DD has had a boyfriend for a year. They met right before first lockdown and obviously have had longish periods of not seeing each other, but always spoke every day, and are now meeting each other a lot more. She’s 15, year 10, Sept birthday. He’s 15, year 10, Oct birthday. Same school.
He seems very nice. He’s polite and she tells me he’s respectful and doesn’t pressure her to do things she’s not comfortable with. We’ve all met his parents and they’re lovely and his mum and I are on a similar wavelength about parenting. It’s all good.
His parents are American and when travel is allowed they really want to go and see family. Their plan is to go for 5 weeks in summer. Boyfriend and his older brother and sister (19 and 21) don’t want to stay for that long so the plan is that the three of them travel home after 3 weeks and boyfriend stays at home in England with older siblings for 2 weeks.

DD was chatting over dinner tonight and was very excited as she plans to spend lots of time there over the summer and apparently she will also be staying overnight. DH (usually very chilled chap) just told her no way and so now she’s sulking. Personally I feel they’d be a month or 2 away from 16, in a long and committed relationship and (crucially) if they’re going to have sex then they will and they’ll just have sex in the daytime! I’d rather talk to her about consent, make sure she feels safe and not pressured and has birth control if needed. DH seems to think I’m hopelessly lax as “it’s illegal” and it sounds like I’m encouraging it. I’m not delighted, but I’m also pragmatic.
Am I being foolish? DH has just said I’m prioritising my good relationship with DD over parenting her appropriately in this situation and it stings a little....

If I had a 15 year old son with a 15 year old girlfriend and it was a stable relationship I'd not allow her to stay overnight.

Under 16 girls cannot consent to sexual intercourse. If I let her stay I'd be making my son a rapist.

No.

Tt's not about preventing them having sex it's about a) reinforcing the message that they are underage and b) not letting them jump forward to a stage in a relationship that they aren't ready for - this exactly.
Also the lad is younger and there will be a stage where your dd is able to consent and he isn't legally. Is your dd not able to do the decent thing and just wait for a few months. Is it fair to pressure a younger boy into sex? (PS I have no idea what the boy actually wants but I hear this so often about older lads and younger girls and I do think she is putting herself at unnecessary risk of allegations if he changes his mind.

Like a PP I'm still trying to get my head around you being okay with underage daughter having sex

Yes I know u16s have sex but it's not mandatory/ a must do target to aim for

I would not allow her to stay over especially with the older siblings only present and no parents

I'm a bit concerned that she simply announced that she would be staying over night with him. No discussion with you, or asking your thought or for permission. She just told you she was doing it.

She is growing up, but she isnt there yet. Its certainly a conversation to have, but because she simply made the decision without speaking to you first, I would say no.

If they're going to have sex then they're going to have sex, but you're the parent and you need to talk to her about boundaries and that your role is to keep her from falling too far too fast. Overngihts bring a massive amount of intimacy, and she is a little young for that. There's also the worry of the older ones having their mates round to drink etc and your daughter is there with no supervision.

How does it work though? Like how many nights a week? Where is she out to? What time is she getting home? Realistically I wouldn't be letting a 15 year old stay on her own or at a friends multiple nights a week so I certainly wouldn't let her stay unaccompanied at a boyfriends. More from a perspective that aside from an occasional sleepover I'd want her home in her bed at night to know what is going on in her life. She is legally a child who I am responsible for, I need to know where she is at and her home needs to be her safe space where she comes home to.

I was first intimate with a boyfriend at 14 and of course I was far too young looking back. The government have set the age of content to 16 from an emotional/wellbeing/mental age of when they have capacity to consent to such a decision. Obviously some are capable before that but as a parent I would certainly not be seen to encourage it prior to that.

Major respect on the consent/contraception chats with your daughter. Wish my mum had spoken to me more about things. Probably would resented it at the time but definitely a talk that needs to happen.

I’d prefer they slept in separate rooms in your house.
If they both wanted too they sneaked and had sex.

In this situation in the morning there would be parents. Not older teens ? their friends.

I was so “in love” with my boyfriend at that age, I’d have loved to play house.

Different at 18

I would never let her go to the house at that age unless the parents were present.

I have a dd who is currently a few weeks off being 16. She is very mature for her age, very sensible and more than capable of speaking up for herself if she feels under pressure to do something that she isn't comfortable with.

There is no way I'd let her stay at a boyfriend's house overnight with no parents in the house, either now at 15, or in a few weeks when she is 16.

It's too much, too soon. It takes the whole relationship to a different level, and it's too intense for a child. I would also be concerned about it creating an expectation/pressure on both kids that they might not feel otherwise.

Yes, they will inevitably do whatever they want to do during the day, so you should definitely have the conversation with dd around consent/contraception etc. TBH, I think you should do that sooner rather than later, don't wait until the summer. With regard to the sleepover, I'm with your DH - it would be a definite "no" from me.

given all the aspects of this that you admit had not occurred to you, i think you had best be guided by your husband.
perhaps your own early experience has given you a bit of a blind spot.
your view sounds more like that of a teenager than a mature parent.
all the best.

I think you’ve come around fortunately, im with your dh. Maybe it’s this relationship, maybe it’s a different one next year, but she might be staying over most nights by then and start thinking I’m not happy in this, but an emotional teen with slightly manipulative boyfriend has a hard job thinking of how to say actually I’m just heading home tonight, when she desperately wants the space, and her bf is ‘your parents are cool with it, why would you want to go home, come on you always stay Fridays, you know you want to - don’t you love me?’ So much simpler at this age if there are rules which give her some space to be herself and work out what she wants.

@maytherebepeace

Oh my mum used to try that tactic with me, boyfriend can't stay over. At 16, hormones racing at the speed of light and we couldn't keep our hands off each other...we would just shag anywhere we could find, this included her shed, a golf course, an abandoned building. It was all very romantic...AND because my mum forbid it so much I never felt comfortable talking about or going and getting contraception so I ended up pregnant at 16.

I'm in your camp, when my daughter is old enough (14 - 16 because realistically it could happen any time between or after then) I will discuss in depth consent, how sex is a natural act and nothing to be ashamed about, that she can ask me any questions she wants about it and yes, contraception, contraception, contraception! As long as it's safe and consensual I really don't care if she has sex under my roof or not.

I really can’t fathom how you reconcile that you were old enough to make the decision to have sex, and that decision should have been supported, but it’s your mum’s fault you didn’t use contraception. Surely you were also old enough to make that decision for yourself?

This is always presented as a non-existent binary: either your kids have sex in the living room surrounded by applauding elderly family members or they have sex in a skip surrounded by gang members.

It’s obviously not as simple as that.

I don't think you should be allowing her to go to her bf's when the parents aren't there anyway so the 'they'll just have sex in the daytime' thing isn't the only other option.

I really think the sex issue is a non issue, the issue is total lack of parental supervision. Older sibling is lovely, but say they have slightly less lovely friends over, everyone gets drunk, they play spin the bottle/strip poker/whatever, things get out of hand, your daughter feels uncomfortable and has no adult to easily go to, no way to just go home quickly if she’s just feeling awkward. Yes she could phone you in theory, but in practice, no one wants to be the uncool kid who says no, someone takes her phone as a joke and on and on and on.

Also to flip the consent issue around, say his parents don’t know about this plan, find out afterwards and feel their son would never have consented. Your daughter would be guilty of sexual assault. I DO NOT think any part of that scenario is likely, but it would be a legal fact. Either party can be accused of assaulting the other under 16.

Surely with the amount of lockdown we gave had your daughter doesn't really even know him that well.
Are comfortable with your daughter staying over with neither parent there. Yes he nay have older siblings but they'll probably be caught up in their own things.

I think during the day at first is best. So they can see if they enjoy each others company. Encourage her to still see her female friends too.

I think your judgment is shocking. 100% agree with your husband.

Nope not while she's underage. Why not wait and not let her until it'd be legal if they ended up having sex?

Also, make sure she's on some reliable contraception now of course if you haven't already, as a precaution.

It entirely depends on the teen as to what I would be ok with.

If she's mature and able to have honest conversations with you then I would probably be ok with it, given that they've been together for so long, they say they love each other, and you've met his parents etc. It all sounds like the classic first "big" relationship, which is often the one which becomes physical. I'm assuming by now you've spoken to her about contraception and all of that jazz.

My concern would be that one overnight stay turns into the status quo, and they end up essentially living together. They are too young for that and it often has negative consequences. It will be hard to say no to further sleep overs if they've been allowed to do it once.

However, I would probably still say yes. The issues that may follow on are for your DD and her boyfriend to navigate. I see it as part of her growing up and learning the usual lessons about love and relationships. As long as she's sensible, getting on with school etc, I would let her get on with it and be there for her if things turn sour.

@Happyhappyday

Also to flip the consent issue around, say his parents don’t know about this plan, find out afterwards and feel their son would never have consented. Your daughter would be guilty of sexual assault. I DO NOT think any part of that scenario is likely, but it would be a legal fact. Either party can be accused of assaulting the other under 16.

What the actual

If you both told her no, how likely is it that she would say she is just staying at a friends house and then actually stay at his? Then you'd have no idea where she is?

I agree with your DH 100%

To me, there is a huge difference between letting a nearly 16yo boyfriend sleep over at your house in the spare room / on the sofa and turning a blind eye to the fact that he might sneak into her room in the night, and letting her staying overnight at his house with no adults present (only older siblings).

To be honest I'm really surprised that you say you wouldn't allow the first (is that right? Or have I misunderstood?) but you would allow the second?? That doesn't make sense to be at all!

I think that you are letting your experience as a teenager sway your thinking. You did these things and therefore they are normal to you.

I had a similar experience to you, at the time it felt grown up and exciting but as a parent I can see that once I'd started down that road it led to some terrible decisions with boys for a long time. I agree with the pp that mentioned expectations of relationships and feeling like you had to take the next step even if you weren't ready.

I most definitely would not be letting a 15 year old stay over in a house without parents supervised (or not) by older teens.

They are 15, it is months away. For that reason, it is a very hypothetical argument!

Just agree to tell her nearer the time ‘depending on how we all feel then’...,and repeat.

They may well have split up anyway, your husband may feel differently or you might feel differently. It really isn’t worth stressing over yet.

I agree with your dh
I actually think that it is inappropriate for her to stay overnight while the bf’s parents are away.