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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think this divorce term is unfair?

142 replies

joysexreno · 06/04/2021 20:42

My ex was financially abusive and is completely obsessed with money. He strung me along for ages, refusing to reach a financial settlement in our divorce. However, he recently decided it was advantageous to him to settle so we may almost be there.

We have reached a big sticking point. He has agreed to pay basic CMS and half of childcare costs, but wants the childcare obligation to end if my finances improve.

He explicitly refuses to have DD4 during the week because of his important job, so I do all the heavy lifting during the work week. He has her on alternating weekends.

I am afraid that if childcare is dependent on my being sufficiently poor, this would open me up to constant challenges and efforts to examine my finances. It also seems generally unfair.

Aibu?

OP posts:
Slayduggee · 06/04/2021 21:47

Personally I don’t think it’s fair. However, would he know if your circumstances have changed? Would he drag you to court every time you took a holiday, bought a car, had some work done on your house, etc?

Catsahoy2021 · 06/04/2021 21:49

Please please please make sure his child maintenance payments do not stop at 18!
My 20 yo DD uni student still gets £1300 per month from her dad as it was built into the court order, which is very helpful when at uni!
It’s very common now and worth pushing for. It does not count against you for uni loans etc.

buttcrackmcheese · 06/04/2021 21:50

£1100 a month!! My ex gives me £150 a month for his 2 children 😳 and he thinks that's too much.

LouiseTrees · 06/04/2021 21:51

[quote joysexreno]@Soontobe60

This is a term in a consent order. The question is whether it would be fair to me to agree it

He basically straight up says that if I marry an investment banker, he will want to stop paying for DD's childcare. So I think he would be monitoring my life for any signs of financial change[/quote]
Doesnt work that way. She is half his child not half the investment bankers child. Also you don’t earn out of what he pays, that’s what the CMS have determined keeping the child for the proportion of time you do costs.

mygenericusername · 06/04/2021 21:51

Hahahahaha. May I remind you I donty dance to your organ anymore. See you in court.

MooseBeTimeForSummer · 06/04/2021 21:51

But if there was provision in the order for spousal or child maintenance he could make an application to vary the amount down the road anyway.

Have you issued financial proceedings? I’d be tempted to take it to the FDR hearing and float his idea past the Judge. I can’t see him getting very far to be honest.

Original poster
joysexreno · 06/04/2021 21:56

@MooseBeTimeForSummer

He is such a poisonous nightmare that I prefer to avoid court if possible.

This gives me strength to fight him, though - I think his back is against the wall and he won't want the legal risk.

OP posts:
LittleOwl153 · 06/04/2021 21:58

Yes as PP says make sure there is a mention of uni costs etc in your papers. I can't remember what the terms are but you don't want to be in a position where dd's student finance is assessed on his wages - or indeed his refusal to complete the form - but you end up paying for her as he refuses- and you get nothing from him as she's hit 18.

Ginfilledcats · 06/04/2021 22:01

I'd argue back that should his pay increase he has to increase his contributions. Fairs fair no?

Tankflybosswalkjam · 06/04/2021 22:01

Court is NOTHING for you to be afraid of. But if he is floating nonsense like this, court is something that he should be absolutely shitting bricks about. Grin

He’s also woefully misinformed which would make me wonder if he’s actually retained a solicitor or he’s trying to do this himself and just running things past a lawyer occasionally.

LeaveMyDamnJam · 06/04/2021 22:04

The court will see right through him. He is a typical arsehole and they see his type daily. He will get short shrift from them. You have nothing to worry about from the court.

Cocomarine · 06/04/2021 22:06

[quote joysexreno]@MadeOfStarStuff I do have a solicitor. She was very confused by the proposed term, I think because it's so insane.[/quote]
Your solicitor is shit.

Do not waste your money on a solicitor who is “confused” and then leaves you posting on MN!

Obviously, he might propose something which is unclear either in motivation or detail (or both!). But the solicitor shouldn’t be confused, she should be purposeful.

She should be sorting this out.

Is it fair for him to stop making a payment is your salary increases? Of course it is. Is it fair for some types of payments to stop if you remarry or cohabit? The courts think so - that’s usually an end point for spousal maintenance or Mesher orders, for example.

But it needs to be specific. You pay 50/50 on childcare until such time as child leaves primary or you earn more than he does. Etc.

You need a solicitor with experience of high net worth AND arsehole. Which often goes together. You don’t need a solicitor who leaves you with questions for the opinion of the internet!

Penistoe · 06/04/2021 22:10

So he thinks the responsibility to HIS child ends if you make money? How can anyone think this is ok!!

He wants to be able to justify keeping tabs on your life. Do not accept this please.

Rainbowqueeen · 06/04/2021 22:11

Is this going to be on a sliding scale? Or is it literally that if you make one penny more then he won’t pay childcare?

You sound like you just want to get it finalised. Think carefully about this. If that is the approach you do want to take I would have it say that there is a sliding scale eg you earn 10 percent more, he pays 10 percent less but that increases in your wages don’t include any increase due to a pay rise, bonus, inheritance, prize money, partners earnings etc. it only applies if you get a new job at a higher wage. And yes vice versa applies.
You also need to cover off uni as other posters have said plus make it clear that he supports everything she needs when he has her
Have you thought about the holidays yet? Is he going to have her for all his annual leave?

Chloemol · 06/04/2021 22:18

I would not sign up for this. He either pays for his child, or doesn’t

As to he basically straight up says that if I marry an investment banker, he will want to stop paying for DD's childcare

What a twat, it’s his daughter, his responsibility, not a future partners who may bring more money in

Why not tell him that if he remarried you expect the cms payments to go up due to her income, it’s the same thing

Please don’t agree to this term

redastherose · 06/04/2021 22:28

I've just finished a Divorce with someone like this. It took going all the way to the doors of the court but got loads more by showing him I wouldn't settle for less than we deserved. Don't settle for less and if possible ask them to capitalise the child maintenance so you get a lump sum (may not be possible with the age of your DC).

Original poster
joysexreno · 06/04/2021 22:28

@Tankflybosswalkjam ding ding ding, you have totally nailed it. He is insane.

OP posts:
Viviennemary · 06/04/2021 22:32

I think he has a point. Is he even obliged to pay for childcare at all if you have custody. Difficult to judge without knowing how much disposable income he has.

Original poster
joysexreno · 06/04/2021 22:35

@Viviennemary

He makes £200k/yr and his total obligation under CMS is around £13k per year, if that provides any context.

OP posts:
Original poster
joysexreno · 06/04/2021 22:39

@Cocomarine

It's a bit awkward with the solicitor. She's very keen but she's more on the junior side. I think she's pretty good, but I appreciate she is not extremely experienced

I have had a lot of separate discussions with the ex and reported to her on them. What I meant about her not understanding the term is that he said this should be subject to material change and when I told her I was worried about challenge on the basis of my means, she was confused - I'm not sure she fully understood at first that he explicitly intended this to be positive material change

OP posts:
SuperintendentHastings · 06/04/2021 22:42

Abso fucking lutely not. No way. No how. Tell him to fuck off.

SuperintendentHastings · 06/04/2021 22:44

@Viviennemary of course he doesn't have a point. They are his children too, just because he doesn't have custody of them doesn't mean he doesn't have to contribute to their upkeep.

rawlikesushi · 06/04/2021 22:44

He doesn't have to pay any childcare costs at all, unless it's for the days that dc is with him.

Spousal maintenance stops on cohabitation/marriage, and can be varied up or down if circumstances change significantly.

So I guess that's where he's coming from. I'm not saying that it's morally right but it's not a foregone conclusion that a court would award it, and it is usual to have an end point that could indeed be once you are earning above a certain amount.

Unless you take a clean break, and for as long as you remain financially dependent on him, he will have a legal interest in your marital status and annual salary.

PicsInRed · 06/04/2021 22:45

He wants an excuse to return matters to court (or to require you to, in order to enforce the chilcare costs should he decide you're "rich now" and to stop paying). He effectively wants continued contact and continued control and excuse to harass you (including as to relationship status) under the guise of legitimate financial interest.

A hard "no" to that clause.

rawlikesushi · 06/04/2021 22:46

[quote SuperintendentHastings]@Viviennemary of course he doesn't have a point. They are his children too, just because he doesn't have custody of them doesn't mean he doesn't have to contribute to their upkeep.[/quote]
He doesn't have to pay anything above child maintenance.