Fed up with everyone leaving London

[Arlington45]

My partner and I are both from London, both sets of parents are in fairly near areas to us. We have no intention of leaving London.

But so many people are. My son (6) keeps having to say goodbye to school friends. Is this going to mess him up, having no sense of security with friends sticking around? I hope at some point it will settle down but at the moment it feels like a mass exodus.

I don't feel pissed off with the people leaving, I get it. But I do feel fed up. AIBU?

After the death of my DP, I moved out of London 5 years ago to Kent. I plan on moving back ASAP. The difference in attitude and outlook of many people here is like going back 50 years, and not in a good way.

I can see how people with children want to move out, to get a bigger place for less money etc, but once the kids have grown up and moved on, living in a small town can become dreadfully tedious.

"You just spent lines of text telling me my home was shit and naval gazing but I'm the snob? Ok.

I have lived in other towns in the UK - including Birmingham actually - and the one thing they have that is different from London is a certainty of their own superiority. It's very excluding actually."

Didn't say you are a snob but that comment certainly was snobby. I see no air of superiority in Brum, but there is a strong reaction to classism.

There is always a flow of people out of London once they reach a certain age

I had to. I didn't want to. I was born there, my parents were born there. It was my
Home.

When I had my first DC we payed extortionate money for nursery, very central
Think N1. My wage barely covered it and I wanted to stay home with her as it hardly made a difference but then ex-H got a job offer in the North an we realised we could afford a three bed house with a garden instead of a two bed flat. The schools where we were, unless you went private were truly 💩. In our nearest secondary a pregnant teacher was stabbed and died.

Where I moved to they were topping the Ofsted results.

Much as I loved and still love my home town, DC's quality of life had to come first.

@LoudestCat14

The opposite. People know what racism is, they know to say racism when they see it and they know to not do it. However, at the same time you don't end up with as many terrified people waxing lyrical about critical race theory non-stop when you're trying to enjoy yourself. Conversations are there, they're just not so intense and obsessive.

I don't recognise anyone in London as being terrified, intense and obsessive about this. It must be the people you hang out with!

Perhaps, but it definitely intensifies when they move there.

I can relate a bit - DD is 3.5; over the past year she/we have lost fully half our social circle, and I expect more will go before she starts school. It makes me really sad; I know she's tiny and won't remember these kids a year or two down the line but it still feels an odd sort of transience to have a young child experience.

People though are leaving for very good reasons - it's very hard to buy a family home in London unless you're willing to relocate anyway (so why not relocate closer to home/somewhere you'll get a lot for your money?) and obviously covid and WFH has done all sorts.

[quote furrypesto]**@blueangel19
Also, the government should revise why people not working and on benefits have to live in such an expensive city.

Don't worry. Housing benefit doesn't actually cover rent in London so many of those 'living off benefits' are either living in a shit, damp bedsit, have already been shipped off the deprived coastal towns or are disabled (with all their support networks/treatment teams nearby) but I am sure your desire to socially cleanse the place of the vulnerable and undesirable will continue apace under this government and you shall get what you desire. Hopefully they'll evict the disabled and poor from the remaining council houses and sell the lot off to the deserving and virtuous middle classes.

God, human beings are depressing.
.[/quote]
You put it better than I could. Truly vile comment.

I should mention it is another city. Could not live in the suburbs or Middle England after being brought up in central London.

Saying that it was still like stepping back about 30 yrs culturally sometimes.

Didn't say you are a snob but that comment certainly was snobby.

It was a reaction to you talking about people queuing for mediocre food.

I'm glad Birmingham has completely sorted out racism and classism since I lived there 25 years ago and since my dad missed out on a grammar school place there and my Gran was a charlady there. Lucky there's been no race riots or what have you in the meantime eh. You're talking shit. The people who live in London know it's faults very well at least.

London has always been a transient city though.

@BeagleEagle I think you must have been unfortunate in your experiences of London, which is a shame. For an outstanding or popular reataurant or bar, I'd expect to book in advance. There, are lots of good restaurants but also a lot of shite or average ones. I mix with people of all classes and never found it to be elitist - but that's just my experience. There are so many people, there are bound to be a fair few arseholes too. The nurse you mentioned sounds like a ridiculous individual!

I must say it does seem to be normal that many couples move out when they have young dc, when the 2nd is needing to move out of parents bedroom, or the secondary school issue looms. You might see another group go in year 5, to be in their new house to apply for secondary schools at the start of year 6.

We were wondering if it would lead to a balancing of house prices between London and other towns in the South east, with more people doing a few days a week at home now.

I guess this year has really hammered home the "cost" of staying in the city (usually 1 or 2 bedrooms less for your money, garden, access to outdoor space etc), and the benefits are less obvious if you aren't commuting to the office and the theatres and museums aren't open.

Doesn't help your boy though. Hopefully this will be it for a while now.

We live in a capital with primary aged children. We're staying here for loads of reasons that can mainly be grouped under "accessibility"

Excellent schools, fantastic medical facilities (useful for DS with SN but also others in the family), sports, shops, restaurants, museums, theatres, bowling, lazer game, cinemas...all within walking distance.

We live 10 minutes walk from an Olympic sized pool. 20 minutes cycling (on cycle paths) from woods, an island with great play areas etc. We can cycle across the city in 90 minutes (well, at the speed of a 6 year old) exclusively on cycle paths.

We have extremely easy access to transport around the country and abroad.

And of course, all the job opportunities.

DC will soon be able to go out by themselves without us being taxis, including to their sports clubs.

@ThePlantsitter

Didn't say you are a snob but that comment certainly was snobby.

It was a reaction to you talking about people queuing for mediocre food.

I'm glad Birmingham has completely sorted out racism and classism since I lived there 25 years ago and since my dad missed out on a grammar school place there and my Gran was a charlady there. Lucky there's been no race riots or what have you in the meantime eh. You're talking shit. The people who live in London know it's faults very well at least.

You've gone on the attack. I never said it's perfect but it's better, of course it has its faults and yes 25 years ago there were and still are huge problems. Part of the problem is the government intentionally putting in policy to divert money away from the provinces towards.... London. Where there's poverty there's increased social problems. We're in recovery from that now. A comment about Pizza Express in provincial towns however reeks of snobbery and I'm sure you've recognised this which is why you've turned nasty.

Interesting thread.

Some people like living in an urban environment, others prefer a rural one and there’s nothing wrong with either and sometimes there’s no choice. I’m a rural person, I did live in London for a while and enjoyed it but knew it wasn’t for me forever and being rural suits me. I don’t get the need to denigrate either one or the other just because you don’t like it.

Sorry, didnt address OP.

We deliberately dodnt choose international schools to avoid losing friends. DS's has been really stable with just a couple of boys leaving in the first 6 years.

When we go to secondary it'll all change though. I doubt he'll know anyone but he'll meet new friends.

I'm not a Londoner, but I have said to my husband, we can't make decisions about where to live based on other people.

A week before, we'd discussed where we wanted to move next. He'd talked about staying near our friends. But somehow in the next week we chatted to three separate couples who all had completely different moves planned.

You make the decision for you, not anyone else.

InvincibleInvisibility Those are all the reasons we stay! It's a great place to raise children.

[quote Cam2020]@BeagleEagle I think you must have been unfortunate in your experiences of London, which is a shame. For an outstanding or popular reataurant or bar, I'd expect to book in advance. There, are lots of good restaurants but also a lot of shite or average ones. I mix with people of all classes and never found it to be elitist - but that's just my experience. There are so many people, there are bound to be a fair few arseholes too. The nurse you mentioned sounds like a ridiculous individual![/quote]
Fair enough, I'll give you that one.I did love Dishoom, so I'm pleased we're getting one locally. My friends are mostly people who've moved in and might not have the born and bred experience. Let me know where to go next time I'm in and I promise I'll give it a fair whack. I can't give you any feedback on it but you have my word. That nurse was a tit.

I think the landscape is going to change forever .... the government can bleet on forever about getting people back in the office but the businesses will not pay top dollar rates when they can do the work cheaper re working from home ethos....and make no mistake this will continue ....London has always been transient ....but now due to the hidden ethos of making London too expensive to live in and the covid which has accelerated the techno movement ...it will become the home for wealthy people which is what the government have been aiming for... for years known as (social cleansing ) real shame London is losing its charm of its former history the renowned East end and the markets to name a few ...the many generations of people who have lived in London for centuries is now slowly eroding ....but to get back to your point I do believe the changes in class mates for your little one will develop his interpersonal skills of relating to different people and different personalities which is good and will hold them in good stead for the future encourage him/her to see it as a another wonderful new experience of meeting new people make it a fun time as opposed to a scarey one ? he/she will develop the skills to interact successfully with all walks of life due to his childhood experiences ..
you know families who are in the army have to manage this as a matter of course ...all will be ok ....

I think if you live in or near London you get to try different nights out. Especially if you are on a budget. There are so many places go that there is no need to spend a fortune. We found a small Italian restaurant that for 3 of us main course and pudding for under £25 was excellent value.
After Covid I am hoping some of these places have survived but judging by the shutters during August last year a lot will have gone to the wall. My only hope is that these premises will be taken over by independent retailers and restaurant owners and not become chain shops and restaurants.

What is left and what opens up after this last year we need to be supporting.

I think the only time I have queued for a restaurant was the Hard Rock Cafe when there were 12 of us

Yes I can totally relate. My oldest has been through primary now and half his class had left by Y6. When it first started happening I did feel a bit sad. It also make me question whether we should also move but my DHs job is in central London, very long hours and his quality of life would be terrible with a long commute so we chose to stay.
Eventually I started to accept kids leaving the school as just part of life, found a core group of friends who have stayed in London and I just grew closer to them in time.
At secondary school I’ve found there is much less movement - people have made their decision by then and once kids are teenagers the advantages of living in London become more apparent. I definitely wouldn’t move now - DS has so many interests and hobbies that are easy for him to get to, he can get around by himself to school and meet friends and has so much independence.

@Budsey

I think the landscape is going to change forever .... the government can bleet on forever about getting people back in the office but the businesses will not pay top dollar rates when they can do the work cheaper re working from home ethos....and make no mistake this will continue ....London has always been transient ....but now due to the hidden ethos of making London too expensive to live in and the covid which has accelerated the techno movement ...it will become the home for wealthy people which is what the government have been aiming for... for years known as (social cleansing ) real shame London is losing its charm of its former history the renowned East end and the markets to name a few ...the many generations of people who have lived in London for centuries is now slowly eroding ....but to get back to your point I do believe the changes in class mates for your little one will develop his interpersonal skills of relating to different people and different personalities which is good and will hold them in good stead for the future encourage him/her to see it as a another wonderful new experience of meeting new people make it a fun time as opposed to a scarey one ? he/she will develop the skills to interact successfully with all walks of life due to his childhood experiences .. you know families who are in the army have to manage this as a matter of course ...all will be ok ....

Hard agree with this. The capital seemed amazing when it was still accessible to people without much money. Now you have to be well to do to even visit let alone live there. That's probably where the charm has gone. Exactly the same with New York. I have a nephew who grew up there and had to leave, mum was a live in carer without many qualifications. His quality of life has improved tenfold. If he was rich he'd probably have a great time in LDN but he didn't have the opportunity.

I spent 12 years lving on the outskirts of London, it was a nice area but even that was bad enough...pollution, grime, crowded with people, constant noise from Heathrow. Further into London is even worse, the noise, fumes, filth and over-crowding is excessive and just not worth it.

Thank God I'm not there any more. I can't understand why anyone at all would want to live there, I guess those who like it will stay but many will have had enough and will want to leave.....