Panicking that we cannot afford this baby and we will not cope.

[Redrosesblue]

I have just found out I'm pregnant and completly freaking out. DD has just celebrated her first birthday this week and this is a completely unplanned pregnancy.
We always planned to start TTC for DC2 when DD was at least 2 years 3 months so that by the time the baby arrived, she would definitely be entitled to her 30 free hours childcare. I earn good enough money and am the breadwinner. DH is self employed and his income has been hit hard by Covid (perfectly timed for mat leave with DD1 to start) and I ended up going back to work much earlier than planned to make sure we were okay.
There's no way we can afford double the childcare. DD will only be 1 year 8 months when this baby arrives so even if I take her out of childcare for my mat leave, she'll still be far off 3 by the time I need to go back to work which means double the childcare fees! I am terrified. We cannot afford this baby. I also suffered very badly with hyperemesis last time and I don't know how I will cope. DD is still breastfed to sleep and DH can't get her to sleep on his own. There's so many reasons why this is just not a good time! I'm so scared. I don't want to have to consider termination and never ever thought I would need to but I am so worried that there's no way we can make this work.

it is a sad fact of life that planning babies doesn't always work out. I know some people who are teachers who have reliably planned the birth of their children to tie in with the school year and some, like me, who had all their plans thrown up in the air by a series of miscarriages. I ended up with a much bigger gap between my two sons than I hoped for and decided i wouldn't have a third child because I couldn't face the possibility it might happen again. It is just one factor we need t take into account when planning our futures, that nature might not give us exactly what we plan for.
So far as the OP's difficulty is concerned if child 1 comes out of nursery during maternity leave a move to a childminder would not be such a big thing, I much preferred a childminder to a nursery. If OP and her husband have a mortgage a remortgage to free up some funds might be a possibility, the monthly amount would not be great and they could always overpay when things got better.

What a predicament. It’s a really personal decision that only you can truly decide. However on the money side, could you also get 0%credit cards and use them for purchases for things like food, annual insurance payments etc then do balance transfers and make minimum payments until childcare costs are less and you can pay more off?

[quote Redrosesblue]@PurplePansy05 Thank you for your kind words.

DH work is complicated. He does charge £150-£175 day rate (each for him and business partner) and sometimes they work for piece rate and sell the wood they chop. It's this part that is the problem because since Covid, the people who buy their wood are just not coming to collect it so it sits there for months at a time. He has the work, he works full time, he just doesn't seem to get paid as much as he should because his tool maintenance etc. is a high outgoing. On paper he should be bringing home more than he is but he just hasn't been this year at all. I've seen his accounts so I know he's telling the truth, it's just people are not coming to collect the wood they agree to buy and he doesn't get paid until they do. It is something we have discussed a lot about him stopping but it has only been a problem the last 12 months. The £1200 is average what he is bringing now, not normally; he always used to bring in above £1500 every month but this year it just all seems to have slowed down at exactly the wrong time.
But we live in hope that it will improve. To stop and have him be a SAHD would be to completely quit his business and there would be no going back so it's not a decision to be made lightly if there's any way we can power through. Him getting another job is all well and good but he already works full time and is out of the house 10 hours a day, 5 days a week in a very physically demanding role. We were making it work, we were okay and we could weather this cash slump storm and hope it would get better which it should but this pregnancy has just thrown that all into chaos.[/quote]
He is working 50 hour weeks for £5.50 an hour, You keep supporting this but surely you can see it's not stable long term?

think the key issue is your DH. You sound like the person holding it all together and doing all the organising and management whereas he, whilst potentially hardworking, is actually sailing through this, allowed to do the job that brings crap money for full time working hours, allowed to do it in way which don't help your finances and that's that

I agree with this too. He should be bringing home quite a bit more than he is for a 50 hour week in a skilled, in demand trade, that people pay very good money for. Why isn't he making more money?

Are they undercharging? Pissing about when they could work faster? Could they work separately and employee apprentices/assistants so do more work?

You've posted about this before haven't you? I made a comment about 'playing with chainsaws' that I've just remembered. He's just treating this like a hobby job, rather than an actual business to bring in a proper wage to support a family.

On the HG side, I also had awful pregnancy sickness with my first and my second baby was unplanned. I wasn't sure how I would cope, but like you, we had planned for a second child within the next year.

We decided to go ahead with the pregnancy, and whilst I was quite poorly, I was more prepared this time. I was upfront with work and took the sick leave I was entitled to on the really bad days, so that the little energy I did have was all given to my DD and not my employer. I was generally more selfish with my time, at Christmas I stayed in bed when friends and family visited and rested, in spite of a few sharp comments (as I'm sure you found, many people are dismissive of how bad pregnancy sickness can be)

It was hard, but luckily DH works for a very flexible employer which is where I guess things are different to your DH being self employed. He took on almost all childcare and household duties for those first few months when I was really incapacitated, flexing work, the odd day of paid special leave for caring responsibilities, and taking annual leave to cover for the first few weeks when the sickness was at its worst. I don't know how we would have coped without that, so I guess that will be a big consideration for you.

If it helps OP, everyone I know with a small gap had a better time than those of us with the two and a half to three year gap. Children with a small gap tend to be close, but they are also into similar things so you get the really difficult bit over in a shorter time.
Everyone feels sad about the impact on their first one of a second baby, but when that is early on it is less of a shift. I have friends with under a year between them and they are like twins, I also have a Goddaughter who has a small gap with her brother and they are the closest siblings I know.
If you want another baby so soon then a termination might be emotionally very hard, as hard as getting through the tough patch with two babies. The timing for a baby is often less than ideal, but in my experience it does work out in the end. I would not be saying this if you didn’t want another baby, then it would be quite a different thing, but you are talking about such a short time really, before wanting another. Don’t rush into anything irreversible through panic and worry.

There is no shame I’m not being ready and having a termination OP.

I could afford a third child and would love them if they were here but I couldn’t do it - physically and emotionally I nearly broke last time and if I found myself pregnant now I’d definitely have a termination.

Oh OP, I really feel for you, and can feel the stress coming through in your posts.

This probably isn't particularly helpful but I felt this way both times that I was pregnant, we literally couldn't afford either of them! But we did it. It's funny how things have a way of working out, unexpected things happen and times/situations/jobs change. It will all be fine in the end, and if it's not fine, it's not the end, sending lots of luck!

Just to add that I am completely pro-choice so you must do whatever works best for you and your family.

Why can’t your DH deliver the wood? He needs to get out of his optimistic bubble and sort out the issues with his cash flow.

Does he know you’re considering a termination? That might jolt him into action.

I’m furious on your behalf that you’re the one shouldering all the real, practical problems, while your happy-go-lucky DH shimmies up trees with his mate all day then shrugs when it doesn’t pay the bills.

My first DH was a landscaper, and equally rubbish at the business side of his job. He did smoke a lot of weed though which probably clouded his ambition. 🙄

You’re a couple with a child who want another child in the future. The things stopping you having this child appear to all be fixable: money, hyperemesis, and a poorly cash-flowed DH.

I have a 4.5 year gap between my DC and it was temporarily easier when they were babies but much harder the rest of the time; only at the same school for a year; nothing in common; didn’t play together as they were at such different stages.

My friends with tiny age gaps had a truly hectic couple of years but then it seemed much easier.

You got meds that sorted your hyperemesis before - this time, you can get on them earlier.

Your DD took ages to settle at the nursery so maybe it’s not that magical? She might prefer a childminder - my DS2 certainly did.

Your DH should talk to more established, richer, more diverse tree surgeons and get ideas on how to bring home money.

You should dump a lot of these problems at his feet and tell him to sort them out. You’re not a single parent. These are JOINT problems and they should have two people addressing them.

I think a lot of people, if they sat and worked out finances would find they couldn’t afford 2 or more children. Things may be tough for the next 2 years, but then your family is done (assuming you aren’t planning a third?). My dsis had a nanny come to the house and I know a family that had au-pairs. Perhaps nearer the time you could get a loan and when dh has a higher paying month you could pay more off. In reality, it’s only for a few years and then the dc will be at school.
In time, your dd will not remember if she went to a great nursery and just because you were sick last time does not mean you will be sick this time (I know this!).

Your partner needs to get a second part time job. Termination makes no sense, I don’t see how you could justify it if you actually want another baby a year later.

@Kokosrieksts

Your partner needs to get a second part time job. Termination makes no sense, I don’t see how you could justify it if you actually want another baby a year later.

she doesn’t have to ‘justify’ her choice to terminate

£150 to £175 day rate for a self employed tree surgeon is too low OP. I live in a very wooded part of the country and have had some tree work down, it was £300 to take down a small tree, took maybe 2 hours, they could have gone on to do 3 more jobs that day.

Once he has taken out the costs of maintaining the machinery, and fuel and insurance, theres nothing left.

I think he is waiting his time chopping up wood to sell. All the tree surgeons around here saw it into manageable chucks and leave it by the side of the road for people to scavenge (that's where we get our wood from) It takes all afternoon to saw up further and chop. Its not economically worth it for your DH to spend an afternoon chopping wood to sell it for £80 a ton. If he has wood chopped he needs to deliver it and get the money for it and then give up this line of work.

He should be able to work everyday if he wanted to get in some extra cash.

There are threads on here, look for earning £10 a day, all sorts of ideas people are doing from home to gain some extra money. You may be able to find some things you could do whilst on mat leave.

You say you don't want to disrupt your DDs nursery placement. But you will have to and it won't really matter in the long term.

DO you have any family who could help out with childcare?

The nursery I’m in does a discount for siblings (20%) could you find one like this or a childminder? Or can your partner be a SAHP?

You dh needs to take a 50% deposit and if not collected in 1/2mths they lose the wood

He’s working 50hrs a week but bringing home £300 ish a week. Doesn’t make sense

Take dd out of nursery when I’m ml

Find a cm who will have both - should be less then £6ph each

A loan to cover childcare could work

[quote Yaya26]**@SofiaMichelle* and @blueshoes* yes it is a utterly disgusting situation that OP is in this crap situation that she and her dh both work and yet she is trying to work out if she and her dh keep her little 3 person family afloat for a few months if they keep dc2. Desperate times - desperate measures. She more than likely would end up needing sick leave with the stress of doing it all - don’t see many men under the same pressure do you? And in my case it didn’t matter a damn that I worked my socks off for years, went back to work shortly after my first daughter died and 16 weeks after my second daughter was born. The lazy good for nothing men I worked with still got promoted ahead of me.[/quote]
It is still contemptible. Morals of an alleycat to do this.

What do good for nothing men have to do with this? That is irrelevant and just deflecting from what is essentially cheating an employer and sinking other working women to save oneself. It is not as if an employer cannot see through this charade but have to suck it up anyway because of laws protecting pregnant women. This irresponsible actions will make it more difficult for the next woman of childbearing age to be hired or promoted. No only short intervals between maternity leaves but also long 'sick' leave. Lovely.

@Redrosesblue

Unfortunately not, we both work in jobs that are done during office hours and no real way around that. Thank you for replying. I do have good friends and family but I'm ashamed to tell them what I'm thinking.

You don't have to tell anyone anything. This is a private matter. You can talk to us on MN because we are all anonymous. Weigh up your options carefully before you decide on anything.

Good luck.

Do you earn over £100k OP? If not are you aware that you can get tax free childcare that equates to £2000 a year if you pay in £8000?

Call your bank and ask about a mortgage holiday. Even if you can only get three months that might be enough to bridge the gap?

If your DH has a large stockpile of unsold wood due to covid, surely this will increase his earnings once lockdown is eased and it sells?

If wood is becoming harder to sell, suggest he stops taking payment in logs?

Our tree surgeon delivers chopped and bagged firewood (£4 a bag). Don’t think he would sell much if he expected people to come and pick it up! He also delivers chipped wood bark. Charges me £20 for a large builders bag full. I use it for the chicken run.

Trust me, I have had many many MANY conversations with DH about the finances the past year and all of your points I have raised many times but he is adamant that there is nothing further he can do.

That's not really good enough, isn't it? Aren't you furious at him for all this stress you're under while he does nothing to help but shrug?

Selling the wood, even for not very much, probably makes economic sense if the alternative is that they have to pay to dispose of it.

But yes, they have to consider the cost of chopping and ease of getting customers to take it away.

as he's self-employed dh should be able to claim nusery expenses against tax? that's what i did when ds was small, until the 30 hours kicked in...good luck working something out .

And yes I imagine very few people would want to collect their own wood. I drive a regular small car, with baby seat installed etc there’s only a tiny boot left. Not worth me collecting a bucket of wood.
Everyone here who uses wood gets it delivered, usually a whole winters worth in one go, delivered a year in advance so they can leave it to dry themselves stacked up outside house under cover.

If he has wood to sell, it need to be sold with driver costs included