Panicking that we cannot afford this baby and we will not cope.

[Redrosesblue]

I have just found out I'm pregnant and completly freaking out. DD has just celebrated her first birthday this week and this is a completely unplanned pregnancy.
We always planned to start TTC for DC2 when DD was at least 2 years 3 months so that by the time the baby arrived, she would definitely be entitled to her 30 free hours childcare. I earn good enough money and am the breadwinner. DH is self employed and his income has been hit hard by Covid (perfectly timed for mat leave with DD1 to start) and I ended up going back to work much earlier than planned to make sure we were okay.
There's no way we can afford double the childcare. DD will only be 1 year 8 months when this baby arrives so even if I take her out of childcare for my mat leave, she'll still be far off 3 by the time I need to go back to work which means double the childcare fees! I am terrified. We cannot afford this baby. I also suffered very badly with hyperemesis last time and I don't know how I will cope. DD is still breastfed to sleep and DH can't get her to sleep on his own. There's so many reasons why this is just not a good time! I'm so scared. I don't want to have to consider termination and never ever thought I would need to but I am so worried that there's no way we can make this work.

I didn't say you're making excuses, but most of the ideas appear to be a no no because someone would have to sacrifice something. That's not the approach with which you may want to make a serious decision about this pregnancy, this is why I've suggested you step back for some time and digest.

Annual leave is accrued during maternity leave, so 9 months mat leave could probably add 4 weeks annual leave, which would make it 10 months off and an extra month's childcare not spent (keep some leave for children being ill).

Alternatively, one day's AL per week might stretch to when your DD turns 3, plus if your DH goes down to 4 days out of Mon-Fri means only two days nursery per week.

Could you keep your other child at home with you while you are on mat leave?
My OH and I earn around £35k a year combined and I also have two (much older) kids from a previous marriage. Rent alone is £900 p/m.
I'm returning to work four days a week when baby is one year old and we will be using a childminder.
If I fell pregnant again we definitely couldn't keep the baby due to finances but we earn a lot less than you do.

Sorry, I don't mean to sound defensive. I know people are just trying to help. Thank you

@Redrosesblue

Sorry, I don't mean to sound defensive. I know people are just trying to help. Thank you

You don’t sound defensive, OP. You sound like you have a good head on your shoulders.

Some posters seem to get defensive and oddly go on the attack when you don’t highlight their post and reply with “that’s it! You’ve done it! You wonderful person, you’ve fixed everything.”

Keep talking to your husband, keep thinking about you’ll figure it out. Among all the posts, there hav been some good suggestions.

A PP made a good point about the challenges of parenting an older child whilst pregnant. My 13 month old currently is happy bashing pans or me holding him up on the windowsill to watch the cars. He also has a lovely long nap.(or 2!)

When I was pregnant with a 3 year old at home he wanted to go and do things, have friends over, play actual make believe games! AND he didn't nap anymore, so I struggled to get through those days as I felt guilty if I didn't take him out or play with him.

I know you have some big decisions to make @Redrosesblue but can I just suggest you give yourself a little bit of time, a few days maybe. I know when I found out I was pregnant with number two I faced many issues that you are facing and I was in a total panic. When you've had time to take in the news you might be better placed to make your decisions.

Some others have already suggested this but the obvious solution to me is to take your child out of nursery while you are on maternity leave. Paying £850 a month for nursery when you are at home sounds like an expensive luxury to me.

If you plan to have 9 months off on maternity leave, and do not pay nursery fees during that period you will save more than enough to be able to cover 7 months of double nursery fees until the free childcare kicks in.

Could you consider keeping your DD in nursery for 1-2 days a week to keep the place and give her consistency?

@Redrosesblue

Sorry, I don't mean to sound defensive. I know people are just trying to help. Thank you

You don’t sound defensive at all. It’s a massive thing to deal with and there’s a lot to consider.

I thought I would save a bit of money by reducing DC1 nursery hours while on mat leave with DC2. I was on my knees in a matter of weeks and felt like such a failure ringing nursery to beg for the hours to go back up.

We now have credit card debt built up from that mat leave. It's all on zero percent cards and I move it around each time a deal comes to an end. We will pay it off maybe in the next 3-4 years all being well, sooner if either of us gets a salary increase.

Looking back the only thing I would change would be to never have reduced the hours in the first place, I put so much unnecessary pressure on myself and it was confusing for poor DC1.

The point is, debt is shit but being burned out and stressed is much, much worse.

The only way we afforded it was to remove oldest child from childcare when on maternity leave. Nearly all the parents I know did that - a real luxury to pay for it when it is not needed. That may help you financially.

I would look at ways you can up your income both now and when the baby arrives. This may be more on your husband since you'll be a bit out of action for a few months, but realistically does he currently work 7 days a week? Could he diversify for example offering hedge trimming, garden clearance, even rubbish removals on a weekend if he has a van or truck. If he could do even half a day extra on a weekend that could easily be an extra £50 to £100 a week, but the important thing is to look at ways to diversify rather than looking at the business as 'this is what we do' because he can't ask his business partner to work 7 days a week.

Outside of his current job could he take on a second one? My husband did takeaway delivery for a year or so when things were tight. Again, made over £100 for 2 nights a week work, and really helped us out when the kids were small.

What can be done from home? I'm not talking about doing surveys for 20p a pop, but sell any of your unusual or designer clothes and shoes that don't fit, kitchenware you don't use, kids games that haven't been played with much on facebook or ebay. Matched betting, we've done all the opening offers once for both me and my husband, made £2-£2.5k each - this is NOT gambling and should not be done by anyone prone to gambling, but if you can use a spreadsheet it's pretty simple, there are guides on the Moneysaving expert Up Your Income forum. I have a couple of non facing youtube channels, so relaxation music, tutorials etc. I also have print on demand stores going, I have a couple of thinkific and skillshare courses, those same courses I have in a mini format in several kindle books, and I'm just exploring a FBA business on Amazon. You can knock out a kindle book in a couple of evenings once you break out of the mould of thinking it needs to be a 300 page work of fiction, what do you know that not everyone does? Can you write 30 pages on flower arranging, intro to stained glass, how to navigate the building regs system, 10 mistakes to avoid when buying your first home, 20 recipes in a waffle iron?! I also have a print on demand store with Merch by Amazon, Etsy/Printful and Redbubble. Almost all of it is simple, text based designs using Canva, no need to be a great designer and once I hit 200 designs or so I was getting at least one sale every day, so it's not huge money while you build a portfolio, but it requires absolutely no ongoing effort so it's good to tick away in the background. I wouldn't recommend doing them all at once but pick something that appeals and hit youtube, find a tutorial for how to do it (and there are LOADS) and start to diversify your income. Hope that helps x

If your husband wasn't eligible for the government grants for self employed, could he apply for a bounceback loan through the business? We did this as can be used to effectively pay wages. Can be repaid over 10 years at much lower rate as government backed.and you could have something legally written between him and his partner so partner was covered

OP, you are on the right path. It will all work out. I am normally very financially conservative but in this case, I agree it is a cash flow crunch so just take the short term loan. Your dh keeps his business, you both keep the baby. Reduce the childcare cost. It will be a bit chaotic but ride it out. As they say, this too shall pass.

You can make back the money. It is just money at the end of the day. Important thing is you have your family around you.

I think investigating ways to improve your DHs income is the way forward. Others have mentioned loans he can apply for. Others have said his rates are too low. Can he increase them?
Could he work one Saturday a month in addition to his current hours? If private clients pay more can he work for more of them and charge more?

Does your local CAB offer business advice? Perhaps they will have some ideas.

And yes save as much as you can and consider cheaper childcare.

I can't believe people would get into debt to pay for childcare that is not needed. I know everyone is different but it would never have occurred to me to pay for childcare I couldn't afford when at home anyway.
I had a small age gap and a slightly bigger one. The smaller one was easier as the kids had naps together. It was fab and they are so close now.
If you were planning another child anyway then there are definitely ways to work this out.
HG is not more likely with kids closer in age. It does sound like you are just panicking. I hope you work it out.

I think most people are meaning use the loan money to help cover the period of double fees between Op returning from Mat leave and the eldest getting her 30 hours paid.
Rather than using a loan to cover fees while shes at home.

Op another consideration, would you be better to take the full 12 months off work?

and OP. Sometimes the timing isn’t right and there is no shame in that.

I haven't read the entire thread as it's so long so apologies if this has been suggested but would a nanny be an option? I think for 2 pre-school children the cost can be comparable, if not cheaper, than private nursery and if you went back to work after a shorter maternity leave it might give you more peace of mind having the baby in their home environment with 2:1 care?

UC might surprise you.

The disregarded amount next year will be 515 for people who own a house and the deduction is 63%

The basic that you would get is 509.91+237.08+237.08 (a couple and 2 children) is 984.07. Divide by 63 (taper rate)×100+515 (disregarded amount) is 2077.01 which is the amount you have to earn to max the uc out and you get nothing. I think you do earn more than that.

However you add the max childcare of 1108.35 in to there the amount before deductions is 2092.42 and the earnings threshold goes right up to £3,836.30.

If you (jointly) earn 3k a month and spend 1,303 on childcare you would get £526.87 back from UC. Obviously if you spend less you would get less back and if you earn more you will get less.

Maybe you will only be on UC while on reduced earnings for maternity leave, but it is worth looking at and running your own numbers.

OP your had loads of great advice and I’m so glad to see that you’ve now got some options to seriously think about.
One thing stands out above all else on your posts - you want this baby, or you would not be tying yourself in knots now.
Everything else is temporary but a termination is not. I really hope you are able to come up with a workable solution and enjoy your lovely family 💐

Notes on UC: you must both be employed or self employed to get UC ( on maternity is sill counted as employed. the rates quoted In my last message are for 2 children so won't apply until you actually have the second child. The maximum childcare reimbursement for 2 children is 1108.04 so if you spend more than 1303 for both of them than you do not get more back. If you only send one to nursery the maximum reimbursement is £646.35 for £760.41 of cost. You must pay the costs upfront and provide a receipt to UC for verification and you would not get the cost back until the next payment of UC due. If you pay in advance for the period that ends after the uc assessment period some of it may not be reimbursed until the mother after.

But I do strongly suggest looking into what UC you will be entitled to during maternity leave and after. You may be able to reduce childcare costs to the max amount of uc reimbursement by reducing work hours slightly

It's lovely having kids close together - ours entertain themselves. You will pay this money out eventually. We found interest free cards were our friends that helped us to bridge the gap. Once the second went on to 30 hours we paid it off quite quickly. Might also be worth investigating a nanny share or similar.

I don't think you sound defensive. You sound very sensible and you obviously want to do the right thing for your daughter.

I do think your husband is really letting you down on a lot of things, but it's understandable you feel protective of him and you also see all the good things that we don't know about. But it's okay to want and ask for more from him right now.