My husband says “notallmen”

[Lastchancesalonco]

NC for this! My teenage daughter and I were discussing the current outcry regarding violence against women and women living in fear, my husband entered the room, and immediately said it “wasn’t all men” and now men were “scared to do anything” wtf??? Scared to what exactly? Terrorise women? it’s very relevant I feel that my husband is a police sergeant! And although we do live in a very very low crime area so he doesn’t personally deal with many murders etc it’s mostly petty crime I KNOW he deals with domestic situations and has previously been very vocal about protecting people in domestic situations etc. This is very out of character for him, when pressed he said he felt people were “taking it too far” calling for a “6pm curfew” for men, when my daughter, who I’m ashamed to say was more vociferous than me because I was stunned, pointed out she effectively had an unofficial curfew for safety reasons, he seemed flustered like he hadnt thought of that, then he said “men are scared of attack too” and I said “who from? Who from? Not Denise on her way home pissed from her hen night is it? No it’s MEN you are scared of OTHER MEN” anyway he reflected a bit and was apologetic but I’m worried, he never used to be like this? Is he hearing some extremist narrative at work that poor white middle class men are under attack because the system that gives them every advantage is trying to be dismantled? He works with women and even a transsexual officer and has never shown any sign of prejudice or anything but acceptance for them and up till now never said anything concerning but he literally said “not all men” did we say it was??? I dunno it’s made me a bit sick, and I can’t help but wonder how a man who was previously totally on my wavelength about these things has changed to “but what about me”
Especially when we have a teenage daughter who will be going off to uni soon and won’t be in her safe little village! AIBU to take this so seriously or was he just being a giant selfish man baby and truly sees the error of his ways?

He has an opinion. It's not the same as yours. You presumably love your husband. Your opinions don't trump his and vice versa.

Namalt however when as a woman you are surrounded by strange men every single one of them could potentially be harmful in one way or another. No they won't all be a danger but they don't have distinguishing features to say this one is safe and that isn't so all have to be treated with caution and that is why #NotAllMen is so harmful, its because it totally dismisses women's concerns again

It isn’t ALL men. It’s a few just like it’s a few women who are violet against men. To tar with the same brush is terrible

Violent not violet!

I think in this context 'any man' is much the same as 'every man'

It is absolutely not the same thing as saying every man is violent

If treating people with caution is what people are required to do to feel safe then, whilst I think it's pretty sad we've got to that point for some, I can't really take issue with that.

The extent that you go to with regards your own security and safety is a personal choice for everyone

It is absolutely not the same thing as saying every man is violent

I get you. You know not all men are violent but you'll treat them all as if they were. It's a sad fact but such is the world.

@IEat

It isn’t ALL men. It’s a few just like it’s a few women who are violet against men. To tar with the same brush is terrible

If 94% of women under 30yo have experienced sexual assault, what do you think is the percentage of men who are perpetrators of sexual assault?

Is it feasible that only a few men are responsible?

Also statistics will show that ‘only a few men’ are violent doesn’t have the same meaning as ‘only a few women’ are violent.

Many many more men are violent compare to women. I don’t think we sh9d say it’s the same when it’s not.

@BigFatLiar

It is absolutely not the same thing as saying every man is violent

I get you. You know not all men are violent but you'll treat them all as if they were. It's a sad fact but such is the world.

That’s just the way I feel. Me turning my headphones off, having my keys in my hand, getting ready to run if I need to doesn’t impact the man who is walking behind me. I know it’s not logical but my past experiences have always put me on my guard.

If 94% of women under 30yo have experienced sexual assault, what do you think is the percentage of men who are perpetrators of sexual assault

I understand the comments and everyone's concerns.

In relation to the percentages though, we simply don't know. It's not a one-to-one relationship. It's likely that a man who has form for assaulting women will be responsible for many incidents - hence we can't say that 98% of men are violent. We simply can't extrapolate from that number

I don't think anyone is so poor at reasoning as to think that if 98% of women have experienced assault, harassment or abuse that means that 98% of men are violent? I certainly haven't seen that suggested, I don't think?

They have suggested that perhaps it might indicate rather more than a very small percentage of men may be committing these acts of aggression against women, which seems fair.

Big but enough men are like that. Or a minority are incredibly busy

Or a minority are incredibly busy

Fecking exhausted, I should imagine. . .or rather, wish. . .

@tangerinelollipop

If 94% of women under 30yo have experienced sexual assault, what do you think is the percentage of men who are perpetrators of sexual assault

I understand the comments and everyone's concerns.

In relation to the percentages though, we simply don't know. It's not a one-to-one relationship. It's likely that a man who has form for assaulting women will be responsible for many incidents - hence we can't say that 98% of men are violent. We simply can't extrapolate from that number

No we can’t.

But I’m also pretty certain that more than 1 or even 5% of men have sexually assaulted women.

What I am trying to say is that
1- the experience of sexual assault is the norm for young women
2- there many more men that have assaulted women than we want to acknowledge.

Similar is happening with Rape btw.
Rape is unfortunately quite common. Even some men will be serial offfenders, many more men than we want to acknowledge have raped. Often because they dint see what they have done as rape/coercion etc....
until we face that harsh reality, things won’t change. And yes we still don’t talk about all men being like this. Just many more men than comfortable (for both men and women because they are sons, father etc...)

There is a suggestion that there should be a curfew for men. As men is plural for man it suggests that all men need to have a curfew

@Fandabydosey

There is a suggestion that there should be a curfew for men. As men is plural for man it suggests that all men need to have a curfew

Not an actual serious suggestion, has been addressed by posters (plural) on this thread.

I never realised how sexist my partner is until this year. I feel like I have woken up and will not put up with it anymore. He has a daughter too from a previous relationship. It’s as though he has boxes in his life and he doesn’t understand how they relate. So his mates can say something sexist on a what’s app group. When I say but that could be your daughter he then can see it. But not until he is told. I don’t think most men have been challenged about what they think or say but now they are and they can’t get away with it.

@Fandabydosey

There is a suggestion that there should be a curfew for men. As men is plural for man it suggests that all men need to have a curfew

As many people on this thread have explained repeatedly, this was not a serious suggestion.

"Jones was doing this little thing called pointing out double standards. As Jones later clarified (and it’s pretty depressing that she had to clarify this), her remarks were not a serious policy proposal. Rather, they were a response to the fact that London police have advised women “not to go out alone” after Everard’s disappearance, and no one seemed to “bat an eyelid”."

It's scary how many people on this thread alone have chosen the 'men shouldn't have to have a curfew' hill to die on when it was never a serious suggestion it was a way of pointing out the double standards currently in place.

@IEat

It isn’t ALL men. It’s a few just like it’s a few women who are violet against men. To tar with the same brush is terrible

Again, for the fortybillionth time I didn’t say it was all men.

Christ alive,I’m tired of reading other women bleating on about poor men or their men
Please,just stop,think about the statistics,the accounts of women and accept that men as group, a class they are dominant over women
I get it’s uncomfortable, instead of knee jerk denial and not my man, think,ponder the uncomfortable feelings it provokes in you

It isn’t ALL men. It’s a few just like it’s a few women who are violet against men. To tar with the same brush is terrible

But it isn't 'a few' men sexually harassing women, is it? It's a lot of men. Repeating 'not all men' is a needless comment. Nobody is saying all men. They're saying that almost all women have been sexually harassed, which means many men are sexually harassing women. Not all men, no. But that comment as a response to the painful experience of growing up female and being a female adult is needless when people are not saying ALL MEN.

I think a lot of men are thinking about their behaviour from when they were young men going out for drinks, boys schools, holidays in Ibiza, stag nights etc. If it makes men and boys think about their behaviour And pick their mates up on it then that will be great.

It isn’t ALL men. It’s a few just like it’s a few women who are violet against men. To tar with the same brush is terrible

No one’s said all men are violent towards women.

But I’m going to say this - all men need to take responsibility for it. Because hideous events like the murders of Sarah Everard or Libby Squire or any of the other rare but regular murders of women by men don’t happen in a vacuum. They occur in a context. A context where men are socialised from an early age to feel entitled to women’s bodies.

If a man can honestly say that he has never touched a woman or girl without her full consent, or rated a woman’s appearance, or bought a lad’s mag or the Sun, or shared pictures of an intimate partner with his friends, or made or laughed at sexist jokes, or catcalled a woman or girl, or leered at a woman or girl or otherwise objectified one, or looked at nude pictures of women taken without their consent (up skirt photos of celebrities, for example), or looked at/laughed at dangerous pornography (I once had a boyfriend who enjoyed sharing ‘funny’ pornography like videos of women having coke cans shoved up their arses with his friends) then ok - he’s innocent, and #notallmen.

If he can’t say that, then he’s not. He’s contributed to a society in which women’s bodies are considered male property.

@tangerinelollipop

If 94% of women under 30yo have experienced sexual assault, what do you think is the percentage of men who are perpetrators of sexual assault

I understand the comments and everyone's concerns.

In relation to the percentages though, we simply don't know. It's not a one-to-one relationship. It's likely that a man who has form for assaulting women will be responsible for many incidents - hence we can't say that 98% of men are violent. We simply can't extrapolate from that number

It’s not 1:1, but it’s also not that over 90% of women have experienced sexual harassment once. I can’t even count the number of times, and the majority of men I’ve been in relationships with have sexually assaulted me, not counting male “friends” I had previously trusted and even family members. Add in street harassment, issues in public transport, comments at work, misogynistic jokes, men who make suggestive comments, men who tell you randomly to smile in the street, men who send unsolicited dick pics or turn abusive when a woman turns him down, etc etc...

It’s a lot of men, isn’t it? Not some tiny few disturbed ones, but a normalised behaviour that’s commonplace. All of these things occur on a spectrum, but they all contribute to the problem.

@tangerinelollipop

In relation to the percentages though, we simply don't know. It's not a one-to-one relationship. It's likely that a man who has form for assaulting women will be responsible for many incidents - hence we can't say that 98% of men are violent. We simply can't extrapolate from that number

Nobody here has said 98% of men are violent.

I haven't seen anyone say that anywhere. At all. Not a single person.

Are people who say 'not all men' just not even listening to what is being said at this point?