To think that the EU have done more to endorse Brexit in the last 2 weeks than the UK managed in nearly 5 years

[Butterflyfluff]

I’ll start by saying I’ve never thought Brexit was in the long term interest of the UK and still don’t

But dear God, the EU’s behaviour over vaccinations and, in particular, the blatant prejudice around the Astra Zeneca vaccine has done more to endorse the UK leaving than anything that has been said in the UK before, during and after the vote

Instead of pointing to U.K. posters should look at mistakes made where they originate.

The first to be shouting incompetence if situation were reversed.

Look to the actual issues.

@MarshaBradyo

Instead of pointing to U.K. posters should look at mistakes made where they originate.

The first to be shouting incompetence if situation were reversed.

Look to the actual issues.

Thats like saying we wont give humanitarian aid to say Ethiopian people because of their own govts incompetence.

Not read anyone defending the EU or european nation states vaccine roll outs or Macrons stupid comments but when '000s of vulnerable peoples, just a few miles away are dying, i think its time to put away petty anti EU points scoring.

JasJas Even EC cite AZ as the issue not U.K.

Have a look at the three objectives of the vaccine task force. It includes

• Make provision for international distribution of vaccines

There are so many people doing good things re vaccines in the U.K. the constant criticism isn’t warranted. But I think that’s strong political bias and no matter what it will be U.K. is bad.

Even when creating and helping roll out an at cost vaccine.

Have a look at the three objectives of the vaccine task force. It includes

- Make provision for international distribution of vaccines

Fine words.

No actions, the govt insists it will vaccinate every adult first, trials are underway to do u18's now.

The UK has zero intention of allowing export of vaccinations this year or possibly next year too.

@jasjas1973

Have a look at the three objectives of the vaccine task force. It includes

- Make provision for international distribution of vaccines

Fine words.

No actions, the govt insists it will vaccinate every adult first, trials are underway to do u18's now.

The UK has zero intention of allowing export of vaccinations this year or possibly next year too.

How do you know?

Haven’t we been better at Covax contributions than EU?

No matter what they’ll be die hards who cling to U.K. as bad

Money isn't vaccines and because the EU, UK, Canada USA etc have ordered up most of the worlds vaccines, it means dev countries can't even get on the vaccine ladder.

Africa, combined population 1.2 billion, has vaccinated 7m people.

How many of those 7m doses came from the UK ? none.

@jasjas1973

Money isn't vaccines and because the EU, UK, Canada USA etc have ordered up most of the worlds vaccines, it means dev countries can't even get on the vaccine ladder.

Africa, combined population 1.2 billion, has vaccinated 7m people.

How many of those 7m doses came from the UK ? none.

Covax is starting to allocate isn’t it?

I think I read NZ and Canada have requested first round. Not sure why as not so low income. Canada has some reasons apparently.

The UK has zero intention of allowing export of vaccinations this year or possibly next year too

How do you know?

Govt statements and maths.

@jasjas1973

The UK has zero intention of allowing export of vaccinations this year or possibly next year too

How do you know?

Govt statements and maths.

Link to statement showing zero intention over next two years?

And mathematical workings too pls ;

Covax is starting to allocate isn’t it?

I think I read NZ and Canada have requested first round. Not sure why as not so low income. Canada has some reasons apparently

Canada has ordered more vaccines per capita than even the UK.

Not vaccinating Europe, Africa, south america etc means the danger is a vaccine immune variant will emerge, putting us back to March 2020.
Also, if china/russia does it instead, it puts these regions under their influence even more than is already, the former european soviet states being helped by Russia instead of western countries, won't be good for anyone.

The UK has zero intention of allowing export of vaccinations this year or possibly next year too

^ this is what i said, not next 2 years ie 24 months...... which would take us into 2023....

Tell me how the UK can vaccinate its entire pop. (inc children, which is the aim) twice and administer booster vaccines, inside 2021?

jasjas we can vaccinate everyone because we have made many excellent contracts with successful vaccines that will be arriving in a matter of weeks. Moderna will be here in ten days time, and depending on how things go with J&J which is coming on board too, we will have a surplus.

My understanding from the Sunday Times this weekend is that Ireland will be the first in line for priority because we share a border - 3 million I believe is going there very soon. As they are part of the EU I guess that will make the commission happy no?

I also understand the British scientists are trialling a nasal spray successfully now, so we will be using that very soon, and hopefully it will stop the endless passing around for bottling etc from country to country (and lessen the chances of armed police illegally seizing them in random EU ports)

I think a lot of this palaver is due to Sanofi failing. If it had succeeded (and I really really wish it had) then France and the EU would have plenty of sanofi to go around and they would not be so dependent on AZ ( and presumably would be less bothered about attacking it constantly) . Macron said in July that the French would be among the first to receive the Sanofi vaccine (presumably as he had a similar deal where the french/ EU would get the first lot of doses made in France which is fair enough). But Sanofi has been delayed / failed and we are where we are.

In the U.K. we have had more deaths than France so any government would want to see its hard hit and long suffering population vaccinated as quick as possible.
Although having said that I absolutely think we should be sending doses to Ireland as many as we can spare and I also think we should be helping other EU countries in due course too. Macron seems a paranoid person, all that unnecessary blocking the ports back in December turned my view of him. It mostly hurt foreign lorry drivers who could not get home for Christmas. My Hungarian colleague said Hungary was furious with him as many were Hungarian drivers.

we can vaccinate everyone because we have made many excellent contracts with successful vaccines that will be arriving in a matter of weeks. Moderna will be here in ten days time, and depending on how things go with J&J which is coming on board too, we will have a surplus

Yes we have, we plan on vaccinating low risk people, whilst people in europe at far greater risk, die, so we get even more vaccine sent to the UK.......
You hate the EU, thats pretty clear from the tone of all your posts, but to hate individual states too?

Although having said that I absolutely think we should be sending doses to Ireland as many as we can spare and I also think we should be helping other EU countries in due course too

Good, we can agree, the CTA means Ireland should be helped, as should all of europe, the sea and tunnel links means whatever is happening in either Europe or UK will spread to both areas quickly.

I think a lot of this palaver is due to Sanofi failing. If it had succeeded (and I really really wish it had) then France and the EU would have plenty of sanofi to go around and they would not be so dependent on AZ

Had that happened and the AZ vaccine failed, i wonder how the loud the complaints would have been from the UK ?

Back in May, few knew which vaccines would work or not (if any) its a miracle that we have so many effective vaccines but so selfish its the wealthiest countries that have strangled supply to those that now need it most.

@jasjas1973

I think a lot of this palaver is due to Sanofi failing. If it had succeeded (and I really really wish it had) then France and the EU would have plenty of sanofi to go around and they would not be so dependent on AZ

Had that happened and the AZ vaccine failed, i wonder how the loud the complaints would have been from the UK ?

Back in May, few knew which vaccines would work or not (if any) its a miracle that we have so many effective vaccines but so selfish its the wealthiest countries that have strangled supply to those that now need it most.

But we wouldn’t have been blaming the French and Boris wouldn’t have called the sanofi vaccine quasi ineffective or that it was only suitable for under 65’s or over 55’s or said that he wouldn’t take it anyway or encouraged raiding of sanofi’s factories or encouraged blocking exports to Australia. The U.K. population would have blamed Boris squarely with a good dose of Dominic Cummings thrown in for good measure. As it happens we did buy sanofi and we’d have waited for it to arrive like we are waiting for moderna and JandJ and novovax. We’re not losing our minds over the delay to these vaccines.

Really macron et al behaviour has been pretty bad recently. I don’t know how it can be defended by a hypothetical “what the U.K. would have done if the situation was reversed.”

@Itsalonghaul

jasjas we can vaccinate everyone because we have made many excellent contracts with successful vaccines that will be arriving in a matter of weeks. Moderna will be here in ten days time, and depending on how things go with J&J which is coming on board too, we will have a surplus.

My understanding from the Sunday Times this weekend is that Ireland will be the first in line for priority because we share a border - 3 million I believe is going there very soon. As they are part of the EU I guess that will make the commission happy no?

An offer to sell any surplus vaccines to Ireland is only a headline in British newspapers, maybe words emanating from a British politician for some reaction.

The Irish government said no such offer has been made. Also said that as the British gov't have given a first jab to 55% of the population, and 6% have also received the second jab, that a surplus won't be available anytime soon.

If the British gov't are going to vaccinate their entire population, and then offer to sell surplus vaccines, then the words of Samuel Johnson to the Earl of Chesterfield on his dictionary seem fitting.

Although no offer was made (as the Irish gov't confirmed), as it would be so far in the future, if it were it would take on the complexion of one who looks with unconcern on a man struggling for life in the water, and when he has reached ground, encumbers him with help? As a different Johnson put it.

But we wouldn’t have been blaming the French and Boris wouldn’t have called the sanofi vaccine quasi ineffective or that it was only suitable for under 65’s or over 55’s or said that he wouldn’t take it anyway or encouraged raiding of sanofi’s factories or encouraged blocking exports to Australia

You don't actually believe what you just wrote.....

Johnson is, right now, blaming europe for their current Cv infections, saying that whatever happens in EU, will wash up on our shores.... getting his defense in early.

So too bloody right he'd be blaming everyone but himself.... remember when CH's were blamed for their CV deaths? blamed them for not having sufficient PPE? blamed the UK population for not following the rules?
No doubt its Jennifers fault he slept with her for 4 years.....

To be fair @sashagabadon you were the one who bought up the "what if...." stuff, i just followed up your comment.

There is no defense of Macron's concerns on AZ, so none is needed.

As Cail has just shown, the UK talks about vaccine help and covax, talks about the importance of international coop but the reality is, as with much of this govt, its just that... talk.

its just that... talk.

Does anyone have the relative contribution to Covax easily?

I’m pretty sure we’re higher than EU

Plus contribution to development of AZ vaccine, any to genomic sequencing

Johnson is, right now, blaming europe for their current Cv infections, saying that whatever happens in EU, will wash up on our shores.... getting his defense in early.

This ‘blame’ you think is here is such an odd view.