Is so hard to address a woman as ‘Ms’?!

[skwish]

I’m married, but have kept my maiden name. Eldest DC has ex-P’s surname, younger ones have DH’s. Recently moved to country from big city (south of England do not exactly the Moon). DCs’ primary school staff INSIST on either calling me Mrs DH or Miss Skwish (having taken some time to stop addressing me as Mrs Ex-P). Despite many reminders, they just will not address me as Ms Skwish, which as a grown woman in her 40s, I expect to have used as default. Now seem to gravitate towards Miss Skwish which I find infantilising and offensive, as well as inaccurate.

Quietly fume every time this happens, and have now been tipped over the edge by DC1’s new secondary school, who have just addressed me as Mrs Ex-P in a reply to an email, from me , despite me signing as Firstname Skwish.

Is Ms just a city thing? Have I gone into some weird time warp? Surely Ms is normal and polite and default everywhere? AIBU?

@Notabove25

Cripes, you must find Mrs and Mr a trial and a half.

Well I would if they were the actual spellings rather than abbreviations, but they're not

What word is Mrs the abbreviation for, in your world?

First thing that comes u pin a google search:

Despite its pronunciation, the abbreviation Mrs. is derived from the title mistress, which accounts for that confusing extra letter. Mistress is the counterpart of master, which—you guessed it—is abbreviated to Mr. (Of course, English speakers now pronounce the title Mr. as “mister.”)

Miss is used to address an unmarried woman; Mrs is used to address a married women.
Ms can be used for both.

If you're using Miss or Mrs you're making an assumption about their marital status, so when in doubt I always use Ms - yes, some people may not like it, in which case they are free to correct me. But it is still the "default" in the sense that it applies to all women.

What the actual world MasterBeth where Mrs. is an abbreviation of "Missus" meaning married woman.

Right, by the logic of this thread, from now on I'm going to start pronouncing Mrs as 'mrrrrrrzzzzzzz' instead of 'missus'.

I’ve grown so weary of people not getting it or looking at me as if I’ve suddenly grown a second head and I’ve been Ms for over 40 years. I just ask people to call me by my first name now.

I didn’t change my name and the bloke answers wearily to Mr Detective when people make assumptions now, it’s just easier.

Yes, Mrs, Miss and Ms are all derived from mistress, but Mrs is not an abbreviation of mistress in the same sense that Rd is an abbreviation of Road or SW is an abbreviation of south west.

My mum has always been a Ms. It's rarely used properly. Because of her age she usually gets Mrs. If it's someone she knows (who should know her title) because they know she's not married she gets Miss. The only time she likes it is if she gets a sales call for Mrs xxx she just says nobody of that name lives there.

@VinylDetective

I’ve grown so weary of people not getting it or looking at me as if I’ve suddenly grown a second head and I’ve been Ms for over 40 years. I just ask people to call me by my first name now.

I didn’t change my name and the bloke answers wearily to Mr Detective when people make assumptions now, it’s just easier.

Yes. It is wearisome. I was quite young in the early 80s when my mother was asked by a salesman whether she was Mrs or Miss and she gave him a hard stare and said 'Colonel' (she isn't). My sister and I are both Ms.

Interestingly France and Germany have done away with their different terms when it comes to women.

@NiceGerbil

Interestingly France and Germany have done away with their different terms when it comes to women.

A good call, I think

What the actual world MasterBeth where Mrs. is an abbreviation of "Missus" meaning married woman.

No - Mrs, Miss and Ms are all derived from the (marriage-neutral) ‘Mistress’. But there is no formal word for ‘Mrs’ that it’s an abbreviation or contraction of.

@NiceGerbil

Interestingly France and Germany have done away with their different terms when it comes to women.

Interesting! I always thought "Frau" was a horrid word, mind you- always reminded me of "Crow" when an English accent pronounced it and made me think of an "old crow".

@DinosaurDiana

Its time we had a one fits all title, like Mr.

This with bells on

@Notabove25

What the actual world MasterBeth where Mrs. is an abbreviation of "Missus" meaning married woman.

You need to learn some etymology. “Missus” is a later derivation of Mrs - not the other way around.

Boy = Master
Man = Mr
Do men realise how easy they have it?

I love these threads.

Top and bottom of it is, doesn't matter what you think the meaning or use of Miss, Mrs or Ms is, we can't have parity with Mr while there are still 3 options for women. Like it or not people make assumptions about women based on the choice they make for a title.

We need to use just one.

A lot don't like Ms

Plenty of married women ain't going to give up Mrs

I taught for a while - kids used Miss and Mrs interchangeably. I now try and get it right or their teachers, but the only way to sort this is to get rid of titles, not to get angry when someone gets it wrong. Yes it is sexist an archaic. I did try to submit my child's admissions forms for school without my title on but the school wouldn't take them!

Cannot believe people are offended at being called the wrong title 😂 wow.

I don’t really like Ms it sounds very old lady or 40+ divorcee!
I work in an extremely corporate environment and I don’t think I’ve ever been addressed as Mrs/Ms/Miss/her/she/them!

Just my name hahaha

Don't get me started on female teachers (even if they are 60 years old with two doctorates) being called 'Miss' while their male counterparts (three months out of uni, 24 years old) get 'Sir'. Complete bollocks.

Interestingly I once had almost the opposite situation. I was covering a lesson for a colleague who was a young NQT and I said at the start something along the lines of “Right, what Dr Green would like you to do today is...” which caused mass uproar with them all telling me it was Mr Green. Instead of saying “Oh yes, silly me, it is Mr Green” I actually said “Well it is Dr Green, but he must have decided that he’d rather you called him Mr Green, which is fine.”

It wasn’t fine.

No I have no idea why he didn’t tell you it was Dr Green. No I don’t know why he didn’t become a proper doctor that makes people better but actually he is a proper doctor. Yes, even if he doesn’t work in a hospital.

I think he thought it made him seem more approachable.

@Fiona2020

Cannot believe people are offended at being called the wrong title 😂 wow.

I don’t really like Ms it sounds very old lady or 40+ divorcee!
I work in an extremely corporate environment and I don’t think I’ve ever been addressed as Mrs/Ms/Miss/her/she/them!

Just my name hahaha

@Fiona2020

Sooner than you think you’ll be an ‘old lady’, or a 40+ divorce (the SHAME) 😁

The title Ms has no bearing on age.

@partyatthepalace Haha I can’t be a divorcee but I will certainly be an old lady at some point.

It does sound a bit old to me! Like net curtains and eternal beau dinner sets 😂

I can't stand being called Miss (not that I am much, mainly long-standing stuff in the post) I am married and kept my name but also double-barrel it with my husband's). Not bothered whether they use Mrs or Ms - don't care if being Mrs MaidenName is the same as my mum was called - prefer first name terms anyway.

Just think Mrs, as a sound, flows better with most surnames, and the horrid pronounciation of Ms is why so many don't like it.

As pp said, they got this right in France and Germany.

Why don't we change to their system - it wouldn't be much of a change:
Boy = Master
Man = Mr
Girl=Miss
Woman=Mrs (regardless of marital status)

Google says Mrs is short for 'Mistress.' Not as in the OW but as in the old days when that was the title of the lady who is married to the 'Master' or 'Mister.'
It's just an old title.

Can't say as I get too worked up about it tbh, but I'm not a fan of Ms.