Shamima Begum cannot return.....

[Lillylolo]

What are your opinions?

I feel that her dual heritage has been used against her, to push her towards Bangladesh.

However, I do feel she is a threat to the general public and it would be incredibly difficult to control/monitor her actions. Which may put the rest of the population at risk.

This is just an open debate. Let’s try not to rip each other apart, more of a healthy debate

@Theunamedcat

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shamima_Begum

According to this if she enters Pakistan she will be executed as they have zero tolerance for terrorists and she was not just a housewife

It was the other girl whose mum died

I am quite confident this will happen in Bangladesh and other Muslim countries too if they have death sentences (I think Pakistan has a whole-life sentence only and death sentences are suspended again? Not sure). Regardless, our terrorists , our problem.

Irrelevant in this case, which concerns a UK citizen brought up in the UK, Theunamedcat.

[quote Welllllllwellllllllwellllllll]@Porcupineintherough well they aren't separate issues, for essentially stopped Syria from deporting her back here? Oh but wait, on the UK are allowed to deport foreign criminals when not taking own back.

People need get over it, she is British. Like it or not, she'll be back eventually.[/quote]
*we not for
*only not on

@AnitaB888

"it is very likely that the Home Office decision to strip her of her citizenship will be overturned as being in breach of both UK and international law (due to the fact she was left stateless)."

and no doubt Cherie Blair or one of her ilk will step in to defend her and then she'll sue the UK for damages for the tune of £100,000s meanwhile our veterans are sleeping on the streets.

Whoever said 'the law is an ass' got it right.

Cherie Blair and her weasel of a husband made millions out of Iraq war indirectly. They would take anything that gives them more chances to sow and breed terrorism. It’s a very profitable business after all.

That's not quite right @Thewithesarehere. The other country could only strip them of their nationality if they were British as well - ie a dual national. Not that they'd just travelled here on a visit visa. And of course we wouldn't grant nationality to someone here in prison - their offence would normally rule them out.

I have three daughters. When they were teenagers they were the most annoying empty headed creatures, joining various groups, going on marches etc.

Now they are grown up adults, some with children, they cannot believe they were carried away with all that.

@AnneElliott

That's not quite right *@Thewithesarehere*. The other country could only strip them of their nationality if they were British as well - ie a dual national. Not that they'd just travelled here on a visit visa. And of course we wouldn't grant nationality to someone here in prison - their offence would normally rule them out.

Begladesh did this in Shammima’s case. Effectively, she was only British citizen when they stripped her of citizenship. It’s a dangerous precedent and slippery slop, not to mention the sunken legal costs and potential for suing the government to the runes of yet more millions. Tory government has a weakness for looking popular at the cost of tax payer money.

It’s definitely our circus and our monkeys.
We can’t export terrorism.

She definitely should not be allowed back to the UK. I as a black woman am terrified of the inevitable right wing backlash if she came back and more people turning to white nationalism as a result. Priti Patel gets it and is making clear who she stands with. I'm not scared of shamima. I'm scared of the focal point she's become

@TheWernethWife

I have three daughters. When they were teenagers they were the most annoying empty headed creatures, joining various groups, going on marches etc.

Now they are grown up adults, some with children, they cannot believe they were carried away with all that.

A 15 year old is not adult their actions are frequently irrational even with stable parenting and the absence of radical influences.

She is 100 percent out responsibility. I am not saying bring her back give her a great life etc but it’s our responsibility to deal with her.
I would also like to point as a you know a white British girl myself, if I had been groomed and taken out the country at 15 there would have been uproar about finding me and bringing me home from the V beginning.

@JorjaSays

I trust the people saying "she was only a child" are extending the same empathy to Jamie Bulger's killers.

Agree.

I haven't RTFT (so sue me) But on a board where people regularly debate the fact that your 18 year old children aren't really old enough to make decisions why the heck are so many people dumping on a girl who made a stupendously stupid decision at 15?

As for her citizenship: neither of the countries mentioned frequently (Bangladesh and the Netherlands) have any obligation to offer her citizenship, and therefore stripping her of British citizenship is illegal.

As for someone on (I think) page 1 saying this will deter other teenagers from making stupid decisions: bloody hell. Do you even understand how teenage brains work?

I'm fine if she comes back, has a fair trial and is sent to prison. But dumping her where she is because of a bad decision at 15 (spectacularly bad) is inhuman.

@Thewithesarehere

It’s definitely our circus and our monkeys. We can’t export terrorism.

⬆️ This

Sorry but at 15 you know right from wrong. If you don't know it's wrong to be beheading people at 15 then....
She should never be allowed to return to the U.K.

@JourneyToThePlacentaOfTheEarth

She definitely should not be allowed back to the UK. I as a black woman am terrified of the inevitable right wing backlash if she came back and more people turning to white nationalism as a result. Priti Patel gets it and is making clear who she stands with. I'm not scared of shamima. I'm scared of the focal point she's become

It’s the government’s fault that, for scoring some points and to look like they are so tough (when they have left dozen of others back in, legally so too). They should accept it was wrong, should work on making tougher sentences for terrorism-related crimes and should stop giving her free publicity.

I think she should be allowed to return. She was a child when she went, she was groomed online and then married off as soon as she got there. If she is not our 'problem' to deal with then whose is she - the kurds, Bangladesh... ?

We’re Jamie bulger’s killer deported and stripped of British citizenship @FrostyChocolateMilkshake? Our money has been paying for them for how many years now?

@OutComeTheWolves

She is a British citizen who was groomed and radicalised as a child and completely fell through any safeguarding nets. Of course she should be allowed back in the country and given the support she needs. But that won't happen because she's a Muslim.

It is nothing to do with the fact she is a Muslim! She JOINED a terrorist organisation at her own free will. Why should we let her back into our country when she has made this decision? She is a threat to the UK general public.

Even if she was deradicalized she'd be in prison for life. She'd be slaughtered in public, even if she was given witness protection

The kind of maniacs who would do this would have to find her first, and if she disappeared into one of the UK's own terrorist cells I expect they'd protect her. Still, even if it was said to be for her own protection, keeping her in custody works for me

Only just logged on this morning and off shopping soon, but along with a lot of silly insults last night I see some keep asking "what about the safety of other countries?". To which I can only answer that we tried administering the business of half the world once before, and that didn't end well either. Now, minus our meddling, other nations seem to have decided that they don't want her either, and kudos to them for having a bit of sense

Oh, and though some still keep referring to the "three children" as a fact, I see nobody's yet answered the question as to whether their existence could be proved ...

@Puzzledandpissedoff
We are still trying to dictate the rest of the world. Don’t twist your words to make it look like we are not. She is made-in-Britain.
No other country should Be paying the price for our weakness.

Let her back.... but she gets here under her own steam

See how leaving the camp goes for her. Can you just walk out of that place?

@ChristOnAPeloton

I think she’s our problem, and we shouldn’t be dumping her on Syria or Bangladesh to deal with.

That will be hanging then.

@Thewithesarehere if it was up to me Thompson and Venables would have had a bullet between the eyes for what they did to that child. But that's another topic altogether.

I was agreeing with this because people seem to be banding Begum with Bulger's killers - "they are children", "we are responsible for them because of their age", "they made a stupid decision".

Underage binge drinking and trying drugs could be deemed a stupid decision.

Torturing and murdering a toddler or leaving your country to join a terrorist organisation are not stupid decisions - in both case these "children" knew full well what they were doing.

Is Syria kicking her out? Do they want her gone? She’s only our problem if she’s being asked to leave and go home