We did not end freedom of movement. The only people we ended fom for is ourselves and our children.

[Kendodd]

I don't know why we would celebrate this.
The children of our EU friends living here still have their fom, when they leave school they'll be free to live and work in any one of 31 countries (I'm pleased for them) our children won't be. I've heard 'EU passport holder' is starting to appear on CVs now as it makes people a more attractive employee in certain sectors.

Oh and I grew up in one of the most deprived areas in the country on state benefits attending a failing school. I made use of fom in my youth and it gave me opportunities young people in my situation won't have anymore. It's not just for rich people.

Not everyone who voted leave is stupid. By far! There were some very intelligent people who explained their reasons well and quite some were actually understandable. That's the truth.
But every stupid voted leave.

@TakeTheCuntOutOfScunthorpe

This thread nicely sums up the chasm between "intelligent" remainers and those who voted leave.

Remainers can't grasp the fact that for many leavers, living and working and even holidaying abroad are largely irrelevant. Nobody in their family is likely to want to go abroad on a long term basis. Nobody in their family "takes a year out" "to go travelling" around Europe. That's a luxury they can't afford. To them, FoM meant more competition for social housing, it meant eastern Europeans coming over and taking low-paid and low-skilled jobs. FoM had no benefits for them, but lots of obvious drawbacks.

No, what it shows is some areas blamed FOM instead of the Govt of the day for purely UK problems. Cornwall has little EU migration (or any tbh) yet has few low skilled jobs, no social housing and very long NHS lists (pre CV).... Voted overwhelmingly for Brexit.

FOM was a handy little scapegoat for the cheerleaders of Brexit.

Going forward, the pressures on housing and public services, once the flow of migration from Hong Kong starts, will make FOM seem very minor.

It's not a great example but it's still something worthy of mention.

In my experience many young people in the UK, have zero idea of the concept of working visas.

Many simply have never considered the idea that many countries around the world ( not just Russian, 'friendly" countries such as Australia and the US are other examples) don't simply issue working visas at the drop of a hat to any foreign national that requests one.

Apologies..ignore the last ..

But every stupid voted leave.
What a ridiculous assertion.

Yep, I know someone who was very vocal about "immigrants taking all our jobs" who is now outraged that her DD cannot work in the European country she had planned to.

Apparently it's not fair and she genuinely thought it would work one way only

^ Case in point🤷🏻

Not just FOM, the UK fashion industry is facing ruin, its worth £35 billion to our economy.
Skills, raw materials all more expensive or no longer available.

Government response was "Go and approach EU governments directly, see what they can do?"

But we all knew these problems would happen back in 2016 didn't we?

lockdownalli

Yep, I know someone who was very vocal about "immigrants taking all our jobs" who is now outraged that her DD cannot work in the European country she had planned to.

Apparently it's not fair and she genuinely thought it would work one way only

Also a colleague of mine. Vocal about voting Leave.

Now bemoaning the fact that retiring to Europe comes with higher financial hurdles and restrictions so is having to look elsewhere.

My hearts bleeding, babe.
Bloomin' bleedin'

KenDodd Those little PO passports were awesome. I think I still have mine. Great for working class teens/youths to go hop off to travel.

I am English and have a small a English school in Spain. Most people I employ are young British people who come and work four days a week for me whilst learning a language and spending weekends exploring a country.

I'm not a big business who can afford to sponsor someone's working visa, and I don't have time to look into the ins and outs of it. Luckily a lot of young Irish people want to come here so I'll be able to find staff but I feel so sad for the young Brits who need to work abroad to pay their way. Most of my teachers have come from working class backgrounds and in a couple of cases it's been their first time abroad.

This thread nicely sums up the chasm between "intelligent" remainers and those who voted leave.

Remainers can't grasp the fact that for many leavers, living and working and even holidaying abroad are largely irrelevant. Nobody in their family is likely to want to go abroad on a long term basis. Nobody in their family "takes a year out" "to go travelling" around Europe. That's a luxury they can't afford. To them, FoM meant more competition for social housing, it meant eastern Europeans coming over and taking low-paid and low-skilled jobs. FoM had no benefits for them, but lots of obvious drawbacks.

Oh I can grasp that - thanks.

What I really struggle with is why anyone thought that ending FOM from Europe would address the issues of
‘more competition for social housing, it meant eastern Europeans coming over and taking low-paid and low-skilled jobs’.

Net migration hasn’t decreased since the Brexit vote, and it won’t. All that will change is the migrants’ country of origin.

No, what it shows is some areas blamed FOM instead of the Govt of the day for purely UK problems.
Cornwall has little EU migration (or any tbh) yet has few low skilled jobs, no social housing and very long NHS lists (pre CV).... Voted overwhelmingly for Brexit.

Indeed - in fact wasn’t Cornwall one of the areas of the U.K. most dependent on EU subsidy?

@QuentinInQuarantino

I am English and have a small a English school in Spain. Most people I employ are young British people who come and work four days a week for me whilst learning a language and spending weekends exploring a country.

I'm not a big business who can afford to sponsor someone's working visa, and I don't have time to look into the ins and outs of it. Luckily a lot of young Irish people want to come here so I'll be able to find staff but I feel so sad for the young Brits who need to work abroad to pay their way. Most of my teachers have come from working class backgrounds and in a couple of cases it's been their first time abroad.

This is it exactly Why employ someone who will involve more paperwork/admin over an equally good candidate who won’t?

Net migration hasn’t decreased since the Brexit vote, and it won’t. All that will change is the migrants’ country of origin.

FOM from the EU didn't end until 31st Dec 2020 though.

Wasn't eu migration down though and non eu up?

Not sure about that btw

@123HereComesTheSun

Fucking Brexit voting wankers.

This post is why I wish we could ‘like’ posts.

My thoughts exactly.

I’m bloody lucky I have an EU passport as well as a British one.

Meanwhile daffodils are rotting in fields in Cornwall because there’s no one to pick them.

Cornwall received net EU financial help but still voted to leave. Will the Tories be stepping up to replace that money? I very much doubt it.

Although it must be very annoying for people with holiday homes and those wanting to retire it's our poorest young people with few qualifications I feel sorry for. It's all very well saying just get a visa but in almost all cases you need to be very highly skilled to emigrate, it takes time and money as well and also commitment, you cant to rock up to see how things work out. Our most downtrodden young won't be able to spend a couple of years working in bars (or whatever) to get those life enhancing experiences that would be the equivalent of there richer peers studying abroad (I think routes will be made for richer kids to still do this btw). I'm sure someone will say they can just get bar or cleaning work here, but it's not the same, it's not about the job it's about giving our most disadvantaged kids a bit of a chance to see the world. I was that kid, as were my childhood friends and ok not everyone of us did this but plenty did and in every case our life was better for it. I'm quite middle class now, my kids have money. I expect they'll still be able to get experiences like this because well be able to pay. Poor kids not.

Will the Tories be stepping up to replace that money?

I've heard the fishing industry is getting millions because they were stupid enough to believe Nigel Farage (on EU fisheries committee for years sabotaging UK interests) and fucked up their own markets by voting Leave.

Kendodd

Although it must be very annoying for people with holiday homes and those wanting to retire it's our poorest young people with few qualifications I feel sorry for. It's all very well saying just get a visa but in almost all cases you need to be very highly skilled to emigrate, it takes time and money as well and also commitment, you cant to rock up to see how things work out. Our most downtrodden young won't be able to spend a couple of years working in bars (or whatever) to get those life enhancing experiences that would be the equivalent of there richer peers studying abroad (I think routes will be made for richer kids to still do this btw). I'm sure someone will say they can just get bar or cleaning work here, but it's not the same, it's not about the job it's about giving our most disadvantaged kids a bit of a chance to see the world. I was that kid, as were my childhood friends and ok not everyone of us did this but plenty did and in every case our life was better for it. I'm quite middle class now, my kids have money. I expect they'll still be able to get experiences like this because well be able to pay. Poor kids not.

Ditto. Couldn't agree more.

Even the British embassy in Luxembourg won't hire you anymore if you don't have the right to live in the EU. All those 'just get a visa' lot haven't go a fucking clue.

Visa/work permit requirements: Candidates must currently hold the independent right to live and work in Luxembourg and be prepared to ensure that right remains throughout the scope of the contract.

Please note that it is your responsibility to ensure you meet the legal requirements to live and work in this country.

fco.tal.net/vx/appcentre-ext/brand-2/candidate/so/pm/4/pl/1/opp/13733-Trade-Investment-Adviser-LUX21-031/en-GB?fbclid=IwAR2et0zE6BdXDC_DU3lQjgvTmAKzrdQ8PmGXqTfckysiDt4gPVu6fHio-lk

[quote Kendodd]Even the British embassy in Luxembourg won't hire you anymore if you don't have the right to live in the EU. All those 'just get a visa' lot haven't go a fucking clue.

Visa/work permit requirements: Candidates must currently hold the independent right to live and work in Luxembourg and be prepared to ensure that right remains throughout the scope of the contract.

Please note that it is your responsibility to ensure you meet the legal requirements to live and work in this country.

fco.tal.net/vx/appcentre-ext/brand-2/candidate/so/pm/4/pl/1/opp/13733-Trade-Investment-Adviser-LUX21-031/en-GB?fbclid=IwAR2et0zE6BdXDC_DU3lQjgvTmAKzrdQ8PmGXqTfckysiDt4gPVu6fHio-lk[/quote]
So according to that, the British Government is 'an inclusive employer' which doesn’t discriminate on the grounds of race, ethnicity, gender, blah, blah, blah.

But if you only hold a UK passport, it will throw your application in the bin.

Well. What an age we live in.

But if you only hold a UK passport, it will throw your application in the bin.

You don't have to have more than a British passport. You need work/resident permit whatever it is Luxembourg is giving.

I don’t think unlimited immigration within a block of countries with very different economies and wages is a good idea. This was one of the reasons I voted to leave and I would do so again. It does distort things and I’m not going to get into another tortuous discussion about the ins and outs and evidence. I am sorry for people who are upset about it.

I recognise we still need immigration for certain roles and hope it can still take place fairly and we pay people, no matter from where they are from, a decent wage