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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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What would happen to my partners money if he dies and we weren't married?

419 replies

grannyinapram · 07/02/2021 12:44

Not a huge amount but we are saving for a house so he has a couple of thousand in his account and I have the same in mine.
We have dc and have lived together since being teens.
But getting married is a hard one because althoufh we are enganged, we don't want to get married yet. The 'wedding' isn't happening until after we buy the house anyway because we don't want to waste money on a crappy affair when we are renting.
Priorities and all that. Covid has pushed both further out of our reach.

I was just reading the will thread where the husband won't write one and it made me wonder what will happen to our money if we died?
We aren't even 30 yet so it seems a little presumptuous to write a will, however DH (not yet lol) has a fairly dangerous job so I'm always worried of the 'what ifs'

I was under the impression that when he died I could just go on his phone and put all the money in my bank and close the account, and vice versa. However I'm not sure now. is that legal? would anyone else have a claim? does it go to our kids? no idea.

OP posts:
LakieLady · 07/02/2021 15:01

You won’t have a say in his funeral - unless his family agree

True! My beloved DP's abusive ex, who had ruined his life for many years, was adamant that she was going to come to his funeral and persuaded his son to take over all the arrangements.

As it happened, it was no biggie, as it turned out he had no idea what was involved and kept asking me what to do, but DP's entire family were horrified and upset that the ex was there.

As a result of all the upset caused, DP's brother has written and signed letters expressing his wishes and forbidding his ex to attend his funeral, and every family member is aware.

UserEleventyNine · 07/02/2021 15:02

If you select a friend or relative to look after your dc (and they agree!) do you have to leave money to them in your will to enable this? Or can they access your savings in some way? I know my friend-of-choice couldn't afford to suddenly have my dc to look after.

That's what life insurance is for. Anyone with children under 18 should look at getting some.

ItsIgginningtolooklikelockdown · 07/02/2021 15:03

Thanks User, we have two lots of life insurance but it would be left to the dc wouldn't it?

butterfly990 · 07/02/2021 15:05

But if he only has 2k in the bank, it's likely there won't be any left after funeral costs are paid for. Funerals aren't cheap.

My partner's funeral cost £4,500 and it was a basic cremation 6 years ago.

My partner did not have a will, there were kids from a previous marriage who ended up having to complete the probate process. I was not entitled to any bereavement payments. It was a mess on top of a very stressful situation.

SchrodingersImmigrant · 07/02/2021 15:06

Wedding costs like 100 quid. It's well worth it in cases like that.

It's either that or wills (or both).

DowntonCrabby · 07/02/2021 15:10

We were as naive as this, other aspects of life seemed more important and we got married when our eldest was 6.

A good friend’s partner then died in his 40’s leaving her unmarried with DC, no right to claim to any of his assets and no right to widowed parents benefits as well as not being recognised as his NOK.

I’d make watertight wills and if you want to be married just have a quickie and have a “do” in the future.

QueenoftheAir · 07/02/2021 15:12

when he died I could just go on his phone and put all the money in my bank and close the account

That would be illegal. If he died intestate, there's a legal order for inheritance of his assets - so if they're his DC, I think they's be the beneficiaries.

But not you, unless there is a will which states this.

QueenoftheAir · 07/02/2021 15:13

if you want to be married just have a quickie and have a “do” in the future

And remember that when you marry, it annuls any previous wills.

UserEleventyNine · 07/02/2021 15:15

Thanks User, we have two lots of life insurance but it would be left to the dc wouldn't it?

That would depend on the policy and how you set it up.

You really need proper legal and financial advice and your friend would need to know what arrangements you had put in place to enable her to take on your children.

grannyinapram · 07/02/2021 15:16

Its surprising nobody told me any of this at school. When we discussed marriage in RE pretty much every child in the class said they didn't believe in marriage because they aren't Christian or religious etc. The teacher didn't say anything about financial implications. It was all about love and religion and tradition.

Until somebody makes you aware, this kind of stuff just doesn't hit your radar.

Also, we have nothing to leave bar a few grand at the moment. We would sort out wills when we had something to leave (ie the house) but until then its barely anything. Enough to cover the funeral costs, if that. please don't pounce I didn't research funeral costs when I found out I was pregnant!!! shoot me
and as far as the wedding is concerned, we want a cheap wedding with only us and close family. no big extravaganza. But it still costs money, including the money lost from having the time off for it.

OP posts:
CakeIsEternal · 07/02/2021 15:16

No one is calling you a thief OP. We are just explaining that if you find what you had planned, then you would be taking money which is bit legally yours and you could end up in trouble. All for the sake of not bothering to go online and write up a quick will.

Thelittleweasel · 07/02/2021 15:18

@grannyinapram

Please seek legal advice. If the house is owned there are two estates. "Joint tenancy" where if one dies it passes by "survivorship" to the other or "tenants in common" where you each own a share and can do what you like with the share [so it could be left to someone else]. If you make wills now and then get married those wills will be invalid.

In general if you are not married the estate of the deceased will go to the children. A partner "can" make application to a court for a share but please do not believe any one who says that "Common Law" partners have any rights. They used to in Scotland if I recall to about 2006.

Please - as I say - get leagl advice [perhaps as an addition to buying the house]

TalbotAMan · 07/02/2021 15:18

Most of the women I work with are Miss MaidenName at work and Mrs Husband'sName at home.

As others have said, wills and save in joint accounts if at all possible. The exception is that ISA savings have to be single. House, when it comes, should also be in joint names. Also, again, look caarefully at pensions and life insurance.

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 07/02/2021 15:18

Legally it belongs to his children. In practice if you quickly transferred the money it seems unlikely anyone would come after you.

There's already lots of very good advice on this thread, but it would be astonishing if somebody didn't come after you. Even if you transferred the lot a day/few days before, it would still look very suspicious.

Assuming that you have no funeral plan in place, his adult next of kin (not you, I'm afraid) would be responsible for both organising and paying for the funeral. The very first thing they would surely ask is
whether he left any money that could go towards it - and then they'd discover that you had taken it. Legally, accounts have to be frozen at the point of death (obviously usually applied retrospectively, as nobody calls the bank five minutes after their loved one dies).

You need to realise that, in the scenario that he only has a couple of thousand in his account and dies, that money would instantly be gone and needed to pay his funeral. The question shouldn't be 'am I OK to take the £2K?' but rather 'how would the extra £2-4K be found on top of that to pay for his funeral?'. As you aren't married, the burden to pay any excess would, I suppose, fall to his adult next of kin (parents/siblings etc), but you wouldn't then legally have a say in his funeral or burial/cremation arrangements or anything - also no spousal death benefits from the government.

There are some horror stories, as recounted on this thread, where partners are instantly shut out when a person dies tragically young, and parents take over; however, at the point of marriage, that's when the commitment and legal declaration are made that you now take responsibility for each other and sever links with your parents/family as the most important other (adult) person in your life. You take on joint responsibilities at the same time as joint rights. To be fair, just as the government has had no indication from you of your wishes for the above to be the case, how do your late partner's family know just how seriously committed you were?

The aspect of love in a marriage is entirely personal, completely separate and of no consequence whatsoever in law. It is usually the reason for deciding to marry, but in no way indicative of the actual marriage itself.

Legally, you mustn't think of a marriage as a way of expressing your undying love for each other, but as a way of saying to the government "We hereby share these joint rights and responsibilities between us and, when one of us dies, we automatically nominate the surviving spouse to have full control over every 'next of kin' decision."

By default, by not marrying, as far as the law knows or cares, you are effectively stating that you do not want all of this as, if you did, you would have demonstrated this in the accepted legal way by marrying (or CPing).

Unless/until you marry and make a will, the very first thing you should do is set up a joint account and both transfer all/most of your money into it (assuming you consider it all joint money). In a very limited sense, a joint account is legally like a snapshot of a small financial part of a marriage, insofar as the bank and government would expect you after the death to take sole control of all of the joint funds/spend/transfer them to your own account etc. - and not be suspicious of you in any way.

Standrewsschool · 07/02/2021 15:18

You are never to young to write a will.

HeelsHandbagPerfumeCoffee · 07/02/2021 15:19

I also know someone whose dp died.the family cleared the flat,arranged the funeral and airbrushed the partner out the picture. The deceased was portrayed as a single lad in the city.Deceased was in fact in a monogamous long term same sex relationship, and that was unacknowledged. His partner was referred to as good friend only by the family

MRex · 07/02/2021 15:22

As well as considering money, you should discuss who will look after the children if you both die, agree it with them and put that in your wills.

viques · 07/02/2021 15:23

@DowntonCrabby

We were as naive as this, other aspects of life seemed more important and we got married when our eldest was 6.

A good friend’s partner then died in his 40’s leaving her unmarried with DC, no right to claim to any of his assets and no right to widowed parents benefits as well as not being recognised as his NOK.

I’d make watertight wills and if you want to be married just have a quickie and have a “do” in the future.

There is no such thing as a water tight will.

Any will can be revoked by the simple act of making another one.

If your unmarried partner chooses to leave and changes their will to leave their savings, pension, life insurance, share of the house , Rolex collection and Hermes handbag to someone else then that’s their privilege. You might be able to challenge the new will on behalf of dependant children but it would cost you.

Far better to be married, be recognised as next of kin in the event of incapacity and subsequent medical decisions, have legal rights re inheritance , access to bank accounts , automatic pension rights, death in service payments, life insurance and be eligible for government support.

SpiceRat · 07/02/2021 15:23

While I do agree with those saying get married, I’d certainly be making alternative provisions first. People may be forgetting weddings are not taking place. You’ll need to post notice first (after lockdown when legal weddings are allowed to take place) but the wedding rooms in registry offices will be absolutely rammed. All the weddings that were supposed to happen during lockdown will take priority over new bookings so you could be waiting months and months after lockdown is lifted (and we could be waiting months for that to happen too). I was supposed to get married during first lockdown. Obviously the legal wedding wasn’t able to take place which was in the registry office. Our notice lasted until September 2019 so a fairly decent gap between lockdown lifting, and weren’t able to even be booked in for a reschedule until after our notice expired. Obliviously this will vary county to county but it’s not unreasonable to think this will be a problem everywhere. So while you’re deciding on what to do with regards to a legal marriage I would certainly look at life insurance and other provisions if your worried as it could be 6+ months even for a basic legal wedding.

Tippexy · 07/02/2021 15:24

@BumbleBeegu

I honestly don't understand it when people say 'we can't afford to get married'. Of course you can!! You maybe can't afford a big white wedding, with a fancy-pants Reception...but you most certainly can afford to get married. It does make me cross when I hear/read this as an excuse. If you truly wanted to BE married, you'd be married!
To be fair, once you've had children and have been living together for years, the time for a "big white wedding" has been and gone! Grin
Quartz2208 · 07/02/2021 15:25

OP wills are not just about money - as myself and many PP said it is just as much as Guardianship for you children. If you have a will they can automatically go to the care of whoever you have said. If it isnt in writing Social Services would get involved and they would be in care for at least a night or two (it happened sadly to children I know)

Marriage is far more than a religious thing (that is why civil partnership now exists) and has massive legal and financial implications

HeelsHandbagPerfumeCoffee · 07/02/2021 15:25

Its surprising nobody told me any of this at school. You need to take responsibility

It’s your responsibility as an adult to avail your self of information pertinent to you

School didn’t teach me about cohabitation, credit agreements,NoK, wills and mortgages I found it out myself

mam0918 · 07/02/2021 15:27

Everything should pass to the children not you if you arent married because they are his next blood relative.

also you dont need to 'waste money on a crappy affair' to get married, to get legally married in England cost approc. £125 (thats the legal paperwork that would give you all married benefits) anything else is extras so if you just want security you dont need any kind of event just the legal paperwork.

Kazzyhoward · 07/02/2021 15:28

@grannyinapram

Its surprising nobody told me any of this at school. When we discussed marriage in RE pretty much every child in the class said they didn't believe in marriage because they aren't Christian or religious etc. The teacher didn't say anything about financial implications. It was all about love and religion and tradition.

Until somebody makes you aware, this kind of stuff just doesn't hit your radar.

Also, we have nothing to leave bar a few grand at the moment. We would sort out wills when we had something to leave (ie the house) but until then its barely anything. Enough to cover the funeral costs, if that. please don't pounce I didn't research funeral costs when I found out I was pregnant!!! shoot me
and as far as the wedding is concerned, we want a cheap wedding with only us and close family. no big extravaganza. But it still costs money, including the money lost from having the time off for it.

Google is your friend!

Re the wedding, you obviously don't want to get married, so why do you keep making up irrelevant excuses. Another poster mentioned how cheap it can be. Now, you're saying you can't afford to take time off work! It's an hour in a registry office for God's sake! Stop making excuses and be true to yourself that you don't want to get married. Then you can concentrate on useful alternatives, such as getting wills done, power of attorney, etc - but they cost more than a registry office wedding and will take more time off work to have meetings with solicitor etc to get them done. Having children etc is a big lifetime commitment and they deserve to be properly protected - that's down to you to sort out, so stop making excuses, and take control of it for their sake!

lyralalala · 07/02/2021 15:29

@HeelsHandbagPerfumeCoffee

Its surprising nobody told me any of this at school. You need to take responsibility

It’s your responsibility as an adult to avail your self of information pertinent to you

School didn’t teach me about cohabitation, credit agreements,NoK, wills and mortgages I found it out myself

I actually do think elements of this need to be taught in school.

Way too many people believe in things like "common law marriage" or in the belief that having children changes things.

Cohabiting for life, instead of marrying, is different and young people need to be taught that what their parents and grandparents situations are, or what they tell them, are not actually accurate.

It should especially be taught to girls imo because more and more and more SAHP's are unmarried mothers who don't always know how financially vulnerable they can be.