What would happen to my partners money if he dies and we weren't married?

[grannyinapram]

Not a huge amount but we are saving for a house so he has a couple of thousand in his account and I have the same in mine.
We have dc and have lived together since being teens.
But getting married is a hard one because althoufh we are enganged, we don't want to get married yet. The 'wedding' isn't happening until after we buy the house anyway because we don't want to waste money on a crappy affair when we are renting.
Priorities and all that. Covid has pushed both further out of our reach.

I was just reading the will thread where the husband won't write one and it made me wonder what will happen to our money if we died?
We aren't even 30 yet so it seems a little presumptuous to write a will, however DH (not yet lol) has a fairly dangerous job so I'm always worried of the 'what ifs'

I was under the impression that when he died I could just go on his phone and put all the money in my bank and close the account, and vice versa. However I'm not sure now. is that legal? would anyone else have a claim? does it go to our kids? no idea.

Seriously op, a cheap wedding would probably cost less than a decent will and would solve most of the issues.

@grannyinapram

Its surprising nobody told me any of this at school. When we discussed marriage in RE pretty much every child in the class said they didn't believe in marriage because they aren't Christian or religious etc. The teacher didn't say anything about financial implications. It was all about love and religion and tradition.

Until somebody makes you aware, this kind of stuff just doesn't hit your radar.

Also, we have nothing to leave bar a few grand at the moment. We would sort out wills when we had something to leave (ie the house) but until then its barely anything. Enough to cover the funeral costs, if that. please don't pounce I didn't research funeral costs when I found out I was pregnant!!! shoot me
and as far as the wedding is concerned, we want a cheap wedding with only us and close family. no big extravaganza. But it still costs money, including the money lost from having the time off for it.

My son and DiL were married at City Hall on their lunch hour then went back to work. I'm in the US but I'd expect that a registry office wedding could be done as quickly with minimum time off work.

I wish to God that high schools would teach a 'family life' course that deals in part with the legalities and practicalities of various 'living with' and 'breaking up' situations. Living together and splitting up vs marriage and divorce, they both have their own set of 'rules' and complications. Not to mention being able to stress the reasons and importance of estate planning. And perhaps good lessons on the reasons for and responsibility of paying child maintenance might slowly begin to turn the tide of deadbeat parents.

RE just deals with morality. Not practicality.

Hi, in answer to your question no you can’t just help yourself to your hypothetically dead partners money.

If you want to hold off on the wedding then you need wills in place written in contemplation of marriage and you should both have life cover in place.

There is as usual, a lot of miss information on this thread so I’d advise speaking either to a specialist will writer or a solicitor who specialises in wills for further accurate advise.

This is what I do for a living and you are welcome to contact me for more info.

@grannyinapram

You also need to think about life changing circumstances - fire you example if one of you ended up very ill/ICU who would you want making a decision about care/medical discussions with doctors etc? At present you don't have any legal rights - maybe look into powers of attorney

Intestate law has no provision for people living together.

You also need to consider any funeral and depending on the family dynamics you may find you are not involved or invited.

Discuss worse case scenario with your OH and how you can be protected.

@polanama

Just going into his phone would be theft!!

This! WTF!!

I work in this area. His money would go to his children, failing which his parents and so on.

Anyone can die at any time. If you’re not married, you must make a will.

You can’t just steal his money.

Everyone should have a will. The minute you have something to leave, any kind of asset, you need to have something written about where you want it to go if you die.

I think the reason this isn't more well known is that getting married came to be seen as unfashionable and unnecessary and bringing base legal things into what was meant to be romantic etc.

Cohabiting because so popular, and socially we don't treat it any different than marriage. Even when it's discussed in public setting, people seem reluctant to talk about the nuts and bolts of it.

Plus the focus on the big wedding means that people want to wait until they have money for that.

Priorities are all wrong!

Anything can and does happen to people under 30 especially at the moment. I'm guessing from op you're overly focused on a fancy wedding and not the legal - and financial - ramifications of being married/unmarried. Especially with dc involved.

Depending on where you are (assuming Uk but it also depends which country in the Uk as this can make a significant difference on inheritance law)

You cannot simply TAKE money from HIS account it's not legally yours and that would not only be theft but you'd be breaching all kinds of money laundering laws and communications laws which carry VERY high custodial sentences (mainly as these usually apply to terrorists and organised crime)

Very foolish to have dc without being married, foolish to delay marrying until after purchasing a house, marriage simplifies so much legally/financially, inc buying houses.

Aside from financially who do you want looking after your kids if you both die? I come from an abusive family and absolutely did not want them having unsupervised access to dd let alone raising her! So that was one of first things we sorted when I was pregnant with her.

none of our parents have wills or life insurance

Are they married?!

pretty much every child in the class said they didn't believe in marriage because they aren't Christian or religious etc

Marriage has very little to do with religion, for most of its history it's been about solidifying financial matters, increasing income, ensuring money is passed down to legitimate family

I do agree the realities need to be taught in school via pshe AND financial education in maths lessons. Not everyone has parents who are aware and knowledgeable or care to impart such info. In that respect I was lucky. My ex not so much. He was pretty much financially illiterate when I met him it was a lot of work to get him to understand banking, budgeting, being a wise consumer etc

@VodselForDinner

Just to add, not having wills when you have children is irresponsible. Get those sorted.

Though even wills will offer you minimal protection without marriage- he can change it at any time without telling you. Same with any work pension or death in service.

Even if you have wills, you will be liable for inheritance tax on pretty much everything.

Death aside, as an unmarried woman, you’re in a more vulnerable position should you split than if you were married.

Get married, it’s so much easier and cheaper, and will ultimately provide more financial security for your children.

They will almost certainly be under the inheritance tax limit. It is £325,000 for a single person.

@BumbleBeegu

I honestly don't understand it when people say 'we can't afford to get married'. Of course you can!! You maybe can't afford a big white wedding, with a fancy-pants Reception...but you most certainly can afford to get married. It does make me cross when I hear/read this as an excuse. If you truly wanted to BE married, you'd be married!

Agree.

Cost for a simple register office

Giving notice = £35 x 2 people = £70
registrar cost £46
copy of the marriage certificate £4.

so in total £120.

Less than getting one will drawn up probably. Marriage isn't a substitute for getting wills drawn up, in an ideal world you'd have both (and financial and medical powers of attorney for each other too). But if it's a financial choice between one and the other, it's a no brainer.

@AliceMcK joint accounts have other difficulties. I had joint accounts with my ex, even with the breakdown of the relationship I never thought he'd leave dd stuck - how wrong I was! Within days of split, even knowing I had no other income at that time and dd was still a baby he emptied the accounts completely inc child benefit and child tax credits with zero warning!

I did get that money back...eventually...but I will NEVER have a joint account again.

Banks can also freeze accounts if the contents are "in dispute" as in there's any kind of query as to whom the money belongs to - even joint accounts

Priorities and all that

Your priority should be to protect your interests and those of your children.

Get married. I know you've put up some obstacles to a quick wedding, but check the cost: when XH and I got married, it was £35 per person. No additional costs, and no party. Believe me, it was the best £35 I ever spent. If your family have any sense, they will not fuss about not being invited, and will be glad that you have done something sensible.

Failing that: at the very least, make a will, and make sure your partner does, too.

And I don't believe it's a school's job to teach people this sort of thing.

Please get something put in writing, and witnessed independently - my nephew and his partner of ten years went on holiday and the partner drowned. At this awful time, nephew discovered although partners fgor ten years, with no civil partnership and no will, he got nothing. The car and house they'd bought together was in the partner's name as they were the bigger earner, and so partner's estranged family - parents, siblings - got everything. They didn't have a joint account. My nephew was allowed to take his clothes and some personal possessions like the sofa, tv and a few bits he could prove he'd paid for. That was it, court awarded everything to partner's blood family. Nephew wasn't even allowed to make the funeral arrangements although he was allowed to attend the coroner's hearings as he was a witness. Otherwise he was completely shut out.

This is all true, and two years on, we - my sister, his mum - and our side of the family are still shocked by it all, nephew is having a hard time coping with the loss of his partner and whole way of life just out of the blue like that. Partner was 32, no one expected such an early death. Shit happens - make arrangements! It really could happen to you! If not ready to marry, make a will, get something in writing. For DC sake if not for yours.

I think we're all assuming as well is the OP's partner is named on the children's birth certificates. If he's not, because he's not married and doesn't go on automatically, then it gets a lot messier, doesn't it? How would someone in that case prove paternity? The legal battles could go on for months.

I had a friend who really struggled financially when her DH died suddenly when her kids were about 6 and 4. They had joint accounts but also money in separate individual accounts for tax purposes - things like ISA accounts and premium bonds which can't be held in joint names. The whole thing took months to sort out, while trying to deal with two wee kids who had lost their dad. Not fun.

Im sure in Finding Alice she had trouble accessing her husband account as well when he died even when they were married because she didnt know the details

@RaspberryCoulis

I think we're all assuming as well is the OP's partner is named on the children's birth certificates. If he's not, because he's not married and doesn't go on automatically, then it gets a lot messier, doesn't it? How would someone in that case prove paternity? The legal battles could go on for months.

I had a friend who really struggled financially when her DH died suddenly when her kids were about 6 and 4. They had joint accounts but also money in separate individual accounts for tax purposes - things like ISA accounts and premium bonds which can't be held in joint names. The whole thing took months to sort out, while trying to deal with two wee kids who had lost their dad. Not fun.

If he's not on the birth certificate (or done a declaration of parentage) then a declaration of parentage would be needed to evidence a claim against the estate. It's quite straightforward unless it's contested, but would as you say be time consuming.

The Grandparents of my two eldest DD's have had to make specific provision for them in the 'grandchildren' section of their will because my ex has never bothered to fill in the declaration despite having the forms about 55 times (amusingly he originally thought that no BC = no maintenance) and they don't trust him not to play silly buggers down the line.

His children inherit. You could act as administrator of his estate, but would have to follow the rules of Intestacy

RE making wills early when you have nothing - my mum took me to the solicitors on my 18th birthday to make my will.
I was still at school in my A level year and planning to go to university and racking up a huge debt. I had nothing but my Saturday job and £100 in savings.
I was fortunate that I never needed that will, but I've never regretted it. It's been updated a few times and has been a bit of a comfort when things have been rough. It doesn't bring disaster any closer but it's so much easier to consider what you want should the worst happen whilst you are in a good place.

@Quartz2208

Im sure in Finding Alice she had trouble accessing her husband account as well when he died even when they were married because she didnt know the details

She had lots of trouble - they weren't married (even though she called him her husband) and his finances were very messy!

Every adult should have a Will in place, whether they're married or not, but especially if they have children. I wrote my first Will when I was 22, after my first child was born.

@polanama

Just going into his phone would be theft!!

No it wouldn’t, don’t be ridiculous.

So get married on your day off .

This is just so ridiculous. You can't blame school or the fact your family doesn't do wills. You are supposed to be a grown up.

@Quartz2208 In Finding Alice, she was not married and there was no will. She had no legal right to the house.