To think that the vast majority of people do not feel they have a gender identity?

[Galvantulang]

My company has recently started suggesting that we can record our gender identity and preferred pronouns (these would be publicly displayed on the intranet) on our HR record system. It's optional for now, but almost everyone I asked at work when the email came out went "eh?".

Apart from the data protection issues of collecting all this extra information, AIBU to think that the majority of people don't consider themselves to have a gender identity, just their sex?

i.e. you don't identify as a man or woman, you just... are one?

Watching laws and amendments to bills being proposed (especially in Scotland) based on recognising gender identity rather than biological sex, seems somewhat unreal.

Um...

Yabu = I feel like I have a gender identity.
Yanbu = I do not feel like I have a gender identity.

One person did did they? That doesn't sound very representative.

Sex cannot be changed - you can change the clothes and chop bits / add bits / invert bits or you walk around the high street waving your lady penis shouting I’m lady but you will never be a woman. You will always be a man.

Back to the op - I just ignore it. The only time it is just plain wrong is in medical settings. Google blood transfusions and why sex matters as one example, another why should nhs resources be wasted chasing a trans woman for a Pap test?!

Pretty much all the women I know support trans inclusion. Mumsnet FWR posters are not very representative

Except this is AIBU. The busiest board on the entire site.

I'm afraid your mates, are we irrelevant to whether or not women should have their own rights.

They can call me whatever gender they want. It is my sex that's important

@LetItGoGo

I'm northern. We earned some sort of exemption didn't we?

I think we have so far

@Ereshkigalangcleg

Fascinated to hear about your social circle jj, but your anecdote isn't actually data, so I'll take it with a large spoonful of salt.

Here's some data. Seems like it's mostly men on your side.

If everyone apart from a measly few mums on here agrees with you , remember you shouldn't try to convince everyone to your way of thinking , there no benefit

Yes, a prominent transactivist wrote in an official psychological guide to relationships that northern women were not conventionally feminine because that implied lack of strength, but being emotional and nurturing.

www.thesun.co.uk/news/7161597/therapists-claim-northern-women-not-emotional-caring-new-guidelines/

The other 7 billion people on the planet could say that transwomen are women and that wouldn't mean I was wrong to say they're not (except linguistically, inasmuch as words mean whatever people generally use them to mean).

Wow 2018. How time flies. Also hadn't seen the Sun's take on it so thanks!

That's always going to be difficult with someone like Kiera Bell who decided that because transition wasn't right for her then she should prevent anyone undergoing it.

^^ Always enlightening to see you pretending to defend detransitioners.

You just don't stop do you?

There is no prevention whatsoever.
There is a level of oversight now, which involves court approval. Because ten-sixteen year olds we're deemed unable to consent to lifelong medication involving loss of a sex life, and infertility.

Instead of And not least because she recently defended Posie Parker after she called for armed male vigilantes to start using women's toilets to protect against the trans

Again - Always enlightening to see you pretending to defend detransitioners.

I defend detransitioners,'says JJ And this is why I'm criticising them up the wazoo with any argument , spurious or otherwise, that I can utilise.

Here's some data. Seems like it's mostly men on your side.

From the same poll, you'll no doubt have noted the overall consensus that MTF trans people who had not had gender reassignment surgery should not be in women's toilets and changing rooms? Only disagreed with by 18-24 year olds and Labour supporters, I think?

And just a reminder that only a tiny number of trans people have gender reassignment surgery.

That's not true. One person even objected to the idea of converting existing communal spaces based on the fact it might put their gym membership fee up.

Oh well, because of that one person, you must be right, and we should dispense with any single sex changing rooms.

So they don't actually think they are women, jj. It's just something people say. Until they see the problems.

Pretty much all the women I know support trans inclusion.

Most women aren't voicing their true opinion irl because they are scared.

We're a pretty forgiving bunch.

Women, if you disobey we will forgive you, if it means you will agree with us in order to persuade all the other women.

It may have escaped your notice jj, but women don't care about your forgiveness, because women are not asking your permission.

The answer is no.

@Datun

That's not true. One person even objected to the idea of converting existing communal spaces based on the fact it might put their gym membership fee up.

Oh well, because of that one person, you must be right, and we should dispense with any single sex changing rooms.

I think that poster was saying that they didnt want the entire changing room made into individual cubicles

Not that they didnt want the one or two existing cubicles to be ripped out

I may have misunderstood so if jj has the specific post i can take a look at it again

Pretty much all the women I know support trans inclusion.

Are these the same women who you know, who, when confronted with a male in the spaces where they are vulnerable, naked, etc, you said would have no hesitation in punching said men?

Those women?

RufustheSniggeringReindeer

Datun
That's not true. One person even objected to the idea of converting existing communal spaces based on the fact it might put their gym membership fee up.

Oh well, because of that one person, you must be right, and we should dispense with any single sex changing rooms.

I think that poster was saying that they didnt want the entire changing room made into individual cubicles

Not that they didnt want the one or two existing cubicles to be ripped out

I may have misunderstood so if jj has the specific post i can take a look at it again

I'm sure you're right Rufus. I don't suppose there are any women who only want communal changing rooms.

Most women are perfectly happy with a mixture of both.

JJ isn't, because then the Staniland question can be asked.

Grrrr. The 20 somthings at work keep referring t each other as 'they' rather than she, even though they identify as female and r biologically female. One has a boyfriend now and they refer to themself as 'they'.

Quite a few of those detransitioners who were involved in starting organisations have since retransitioned and spoken out against the harm that came from gender critical ideology.

"Gender critical ideology" is the "belief" in biological sex. It's not really a belief of course, because biological sex is the means by which we reproduce, so none of us would be here if it didn't exist. Harmful? Perhaps it is if you believe the world is overpopulated. But that's unlikely to be a popular opinion on mumsnet.

That's always going to be difficult with someone like Kiera Bell who decided that because transition wasn't right for her then she should prevent anyone undergoing it.

She believes that she wasn't mature enough at 16 to make that decision, and the court agreed with her. This judgment didn't affect adults who want to transition.

Pretty much all the women I know support trans inclusion. Mumsnet FWR posters are not very representative

I hate to burst the bubble, but -

wingsoverscotland.com/transforming-the-question/

@Ereshkigalangcleg

Here's some data. Seems like it's mostly men on your side.

From the same poll, you'll no doubt have noted the overall consensus that MTF trans people who had not had gender reassignment surgery should not be in women's toilets and changing rooms? Only disagreed with by 18-24 year olds and Labour supporters, I think?

Yes there's a bit of a way to go on that, but toilets was actually agreed with Lib Dems, Remainers, Labour, and 18-64 year olds as a whole. Seems to be mostly old Tories, and predominantly men that pulled the figures down. This must be the only feminist movement in history whose biggest supporters are old Tory men.

[quote ArabellaScott]Pretty much all the women I know support trans inclusion. Mumsnet FWR posters are not very representative

I hate to burst the bubble, but -

wingsoverscotland.com/transforming-the-question/[/quote]
And as if to prove my point here's a survey with a ridiculously rigged question put forward by a male run blog that has spent the last couple of years aggresively defending a man accused of sexual abuse by multiple women.