This is racist, right?

[Nellytheele]

I live with DM and her partner at the moment, was supposed to be moving out but covid and other circumstances happened but that's a whole other thread.

DM and partner have been together 19 years and I've never been that fond of him.
Anyway, we live in a block of flats and in the building we have a young Thai woman with her daughter, a black family next door and a Turkish family. All of them are lovely people. We all talk when we pass eachother and everyone is polite. If my mum's partner is talking about them in conversation, for example if he says he was talking to them today, he refers to them in these terms which I find disgusting. He has never referred to them as just the people/family/lady/man etc. He has to make some sort of derogatory comment. For example talking about the black family next door he has referred to them as [redacted by MNHQ] the Turkish family below he has referred to as [redacted by MNHQ] and the Thai woman and her daughter as [redacted by MNHQ] he has said many other variations of these terms but I never said anything to him because I didn't want to cause a problem. I have a DD who is almost 3 and she is repeating alot of what we say so I have started to make it clear that I don't like these terms and why. I have never been ok with them but I don't want DD to think this is ok. I know I can move out and we will, but surely telling him these things are wrong should stand whether I'm living here or not.

Today when he used this term I shook my head and rolled my eyes and my DM noticed, she told him to stop with those terms. He then took the dogs out and text my DM to say he feels that he can't say what he wants in his own house, and that he was brought up using these terms so there's nothing wrong with it and it's funny. He also told her that he has friends which he uses these terms with and they laugh it off and they call him "whitey or vanilla" back. So that's makes it ok.

AIBU to say that this is wrong? Even if he does use these terms with his friends, that doesn't mean that's ok to use them for everyone but he disagrees. He says he's not racist but I disagree. I have never heard him talk about someone who isn't white without using something derogatory.

Tell me if I am wrong, because I'm living with them (even though it's my mum's house not his) should I keep my mouth shut?

[Post edited by MNHQ to remove offensive terms]

Actions are more important than words, but he can really cause problems for your daughter, as she will start throwing those terms out there at random. He is a twat for sure but I must say it'll be hard to argue that he can't say what he likes in his own home. Maybe just try to make him stop around your dd that is probably the best you can do.

Yep he is a disgusting arrogant man and I don't like to say but he must be a bit stupid too.

You know very well its racist. You know you are right to protect your child from it. You know that to some extent you are complicit in it by living in the same household although I understand there are mitigating circumstances.

The bigger question is how do you get yourself and you mum away from it? It isn't only to protect your child from growing up around it, its to remove your mum from a situation which obviously makes her very unhappy. It sounds as if even taking the racism out of the equation he's a very unpleasant man and the relationship is bad.

Do you work? Do you have access to money which you could use to rent somewhere? Does your DM? Could you begin the process of getting accommodation from the council?

Yes. You’re right to feel discomfort. What he finds to be funny is racist. He also is aware of this as he only uses these terms in the privacy of his own home. If he thought they were so harmless and funny, he’s use them publicly.
I hope you can move out soon. He sounds like a tool xx

Hello @Nellytheele. We've edited your post to remove the offensive terminology as it was causing a lot of upset. We didn't want to remove your thread entirely as it's clear you're looking for advice about this situation. Best wishes from MNHQ.

Yes he's racist and yes you are right to be worried about your child.

My son has a classmate who makes some horribly racist comments as his father is a white supremacist and it causes a lot of problems in the classroom - they have had classes on racism (not that that's a problem, I think it's important) but more in that he isn't particularly popular because when you hear what comes out of his mouth you don't want him around your kids. He's too young to know better than what his parents have taught him is acceptable, and though I would not tell him so directly, he's never going to be welcome in my house as I don't want my kids around him.

I would ask that for the sake of your daughter he doesn’t do it around her, I know a lot of people like this (or have known), you can’t change them but I would make a constant effort to say “don’t say that infront of dd please”. Even if your dd is present, I would explain it is not a word we use to describe people from other countries or heritage.

I have had kids come out with terms Id consider racist at school.

I always try and explain why these terms are racist, and why people find them offensive the first time. The second time its straight out the class.

99% of kids apologise, and stop using the word. Hes thick as fuck if he cant manage what an 11yr old can.

@YetAnotherBeckyMumsnet

Hello *@Nellytheele*. We've edited your post to remove the offensive terminology as it was causing a lot of upset. We didn't want to remove your thread entirely as it's clear you're looking for advice about this situation. Best wishes from MNHQ.

Seriously? We’re all grown ups here, and I’m sure are disgusted about someone using such racist language towards someone else. The OP was simply quoting what her Mothers’s partner had said so we could form our own opinion about him. Were people really offended by that? Snowflake generation!

@thepeopleversuswork
I have a job but currently furloughed. I was saving to get my own place but with having to take 20% less on a minimum wage job I've not been able to save as much as I had hoped by now. I've also had to help my mum out with money unexpectedly so had to use some savings.
My mum doesn't work, has been off work for a while with depression.

As far as I'm aware, the council housing list is very long and the rent prices here are way to much for my to pay alone at the moment. I don't even know where to start with gettin help.

@sparepantsandtoothbrush

Who the fuck has voted YABU??

As a PP said, he may have been brought up with those terms being used but it 100% isn't acceptable any more thankfully. Does he work? Because I can guarantee if he used that language at work he'd be in big trouble. I bet he doesn't use it there though as he knows it's unacceptable really

Sorry I voted YABU as I thought it was YABU to still live there. The man is clearly very racist!

OP, it’s probably not worth trying to get him to acknowledge he is a racist. You need to move out but while you organise that maybe try to tell him that whether or not he thinks it’s racist, these terms are not generally acceptable to most people and you don’t want your child repeating them. Similar to swearing.

Good luck and I (ope your mom manages to leave him.

Who owns the house?
Could you and your mum move out together?

No idea sorry (mnhq have removed the words)

It is horrible he hasn't learned anything, nothing will change unless this disgusting attitude is called out every time.

My nieces friends a black boy went into a well known sports shop dressed really well, they have a code when someone dodgy enters the shop, my niece was working in the back, she brought the trainers along with the code in mind to watch like a hawk while he tried them on, she was so upset when she saw her pal standing there in his lovely clothes simply buying a pair of Christmas trainers.

I grew up in the '70's and language, TV programs etc were certainly very different than they are now, but those terms would have been unacceptable even then!!

Your child is 3, IF they repeat it, ignore it and just repeat what they've said using a description you'd use. They'll soon forget his horrible one. Least fuss, soonest mended!

If, let's call him Fred, says anything horrible, just correct him too, in the same way, if DS is there. Just as if he is 3.

Bigger picture - your mum wants him to go. She's in the ideal position to separate from him now while she has you and DS there for support & company. Talk to her, ask her why she cares more about remaining on good terms with him than she does about her own happiness etc. I personally wouldn't be beyond a bit of manipulation!!! 'Mum, DS & I would live to stay here with YOU, but I can't stand Fred being around DS any more and I hate seeing you so unhappy, I'm going to start to look forward somewhere for DS and i to move to. Unfortunately I can't afford anything around here, so I'll need to start looking in x place' (somewhere that's not too near!!) ... or whatever will make her think about her choices. As it sounds like she wants to leave him, but needs a bit of a push!

YANBU. Whose house is it? Could you/your mum get him to leave and you and your daughter stay there with her permanently?

@MNHQ how can we possibly respond to this as you have removed the entire crux of the post?

We are not babies - we know that these words are quotations and not opinions, and we know not to use them. Please don't become Nanny State Moderators - that's why people use MN - because it's mature enough to allow opinions and open dialogue.

Something offensive written in print doesn't mean you support what's written and you know that. On that basis, all publishers would have to edit every historical novel ever written. Come on....

The words were racist. The OP is looking for advice on what to do about living with a racist.

@strawberriesontheNeva

No idea sorry (mnhq have removed the words)

Because they were racist

I knew someone like this who knew what they were saying was racist but they were "joking" when challenged. They seemed to enjoy the reaction they got. This doesn't help you much other than is it possible to have a calm conversation about it? It doesn't sound like he would listen and I think I'd be too annoyed to stay calm. Sorry I am not much help but I am really sorry you are in this position.

No idea sorry (mnhq have removed the words)

Why would they have removed the words if they weren’t racist?

I didn’t see the terms used because they’ve been redacted, but I think I could hazard a guess. Despite being in my fifties I haven’t witnessed much racism growing up but I do know people held offensive views back in the day, and that people who still talk that way don’t have the intellect to challenge their own views. I doubt this man is intelligent enough to realise how wrong he is, and I very much doubt that he will ever accept anything said to him by anyone else so don’t waste your time trying. I had my dad live with me for three years up until his death last May and had to bite my lip on a number of occasions. He was a vile man with prejudices towards literally everyone who wasn’t like him, I was never close to him so didn’t realise until it was too late. So I had to grit my teeth and roll my eyes, he was never going to stop.

@TinyCake

The words were racist. The OP is looking for advice on what to do about living with a racist.

Actually, OP's post heading is 'This is Racist, Right?'

So why I don't doubt that they were racists terms, someone new coming to the thread isn't able to give an answer to that specific question. I can offer advice on how to deal with racist, I can emphatically support what others on the thread have said, but I can't answer the post question.

MNHQ frequently leave fattist/sexist/ageist/homophobic comments to stand because they are being 'quoted' - and I was surprised that people complained and were offended when they are intelligent enough to understand that a quote is just that.

Maybe I am wrong. Maybe all offensive words should be taken down regardless of context but I can't see how that will end (see my reference to historical novels).

People complaining about the words being removed - I'm sure you can imagine them, they were common racist slurs.

They were removed because people find them upsetting, perhaps having been the recipient of them or hearing them used on their children.

If you can't understand/empathise with that, perhaps move on to another thread. It's not helpful otherwise.

Nellytheele

I can see how difficult it is for you.

I am not particularly up to speed on getting accommodation from the council as I haven't ever had to do it: there are others on here who will have better advice here. Have you spoken to Citizens Advice?

Would you or your mum consider going into a refuge in the short term? It does sound to me as if this relationship is abusive and doing serious damage to your mum's wellbeing: I'm not only talking about the racism here although that is clearly disgusting, it seems likely to me that her depression is linked to being with this awful man. How ready would she be now to consider this?

Would it be worth speaking to Women's Aid to see how you might be able to expedite getting some support with this?