Head teacher doing “shout outs”

[Atalune]

Head of large secondary is doing positive shout outs for children who are deserving.

And as bloody usual it is the majority of really bloody naughty kids who are doing sweet FA! Or those who are struggling with their mental health ( I do not grudge these)

As an ex teacher I KNOW it is important to motivate the ones who need it. The ones who are low. But I am so fed up.

Dd- she really thought he would get one this week- full marks in the work, work submitted is of a high quality, she’s joined all the lives. SHe’s keen she’s engaged. Did she get one? Nope. Her friend who is doing fuck all and crying all day long and doing no work is getting them all the time.

I DO understand that those who are struggling need more. I do I do. But I am so fed up of the kids who are working hard, doing well. What about them? Always overlooked! And so now she’s crying and saying what’s the point?! It is unfair. I can’t email the school we will look like total brats.

Grrrrr, life isn’t fair.

Just a vent. I’m on the edge today.

This definitely does happen. My child is top of class, never been in trouble etc but therefore we get zero teacher input and he gets no recognition like the naughty or struggling kids. However, why not just explain to them what’s going on? I told my child why this happens and he’s accepted that’s the way things are. No need for the dramatics.

The same children are given shout outs on Teams in my DDs class. I can never understand it because we have 30 children in the class and I only ever hear the same 3 / 4 children's names, they are always the ones chosen to read during guided reading too or to answer a question. It's very demotivating. I would have thought primary school teacher's would be a little more conscious about not doing this when teaching remotely, especially when parents are very likely to be listening in to the live lessons or reading the comments left on teams. My eldest is at secondary school and they are very fair when it comes to praise. My children's schools send out parent feedback questionnaires and I usually give my feedback to things like this then.

I sometimes bought my child a small gift because I got do fed up with her missing out. I was a teacher and valued all my pupils

These schools all sound crap by the way. Never happens in DD’s or DS’s school - they have a policy or promise that everyone will get one. Doesn’t cheapen it. Just means each child will be rewarded for showing effort in a different way for different things. Like I mentioned earlier mine got the first shout out and she was so happy. She’s definitely not naughty and has handed in all her work. My DS never got star of the week when he used to misbehave in reception but now that he’s older and much more mature he gets the recognition abs praise he deserves.

Some of you sound a bit precious. Wait your turns. You also have no idea whether the “naughty kids” are indeed being naughty these days or whether they’re producing amazing work of a high standard and showing immense effort and determination. Saying the majority are doing sweet FA makes you sound loopy. Are you spying on them in their homes?

Email the school and communicate your concerns.

Email. How does the school find out she's crying otherwise?

I would email the school and let them know your child needs a little lift up too- I’m sure they’ll support you x

I'm afraid it has been the thinking (and therefore professional training) for years. If you go back 10-15;years the most naughty, disruptive and blatantly criminal kids were being sent on foreign holidays, including a few examples of safaris in Africa.

I get the point made by one poster that some of these kids don't get the motivation etc at home but don't think it doesn't grate with those kids who are good, well behaved and get on with it. My daughters view from her last school was that it is devalued anyway as most of the class just roll their eyes when such shout outs or praise happened to kids whose normal routine is to be a continual twat.

I'm glad she is now at a school where such crap doesn't happen...they get praised when they deserve it and detentions when they don't behave...in pre Covid lockdowns anyway

Certainly not part of professional training (Ireland) anyway. As I said above such motivation/recognition can be given without the publicity, and that way to everyone. One to one comments, boosts are very effective and I believe, much more meaningful. Most children, including those getting the shout outs see through it.

If you have some sort of real relationship with the children, it's almost always possible to find times to give them positive feedback and encouragement. Specific, real stuff that is meaningful
I agree with this.
I also think it's easy for people at home to think they know what other children are or aren't doing. Across a range of threads there seems to be a lot of mumsnetters who seem to know, apparently in detail, what every other family is doing at home, what every child's home life is like, how much work is done, what quality work, how much effort all the other children have put in. It's most unusual likely to be made up

With one of my classes, one of the best engaged students on one of our online platforms is a student who regularly displays challenging behaviour at school. They have found something they click with and I get messages asking what they can do next. My school doesn't do head teacher shout outs, but if we did I would put that child forward for one because their work 100% deserves it. There might be a mumsnetter who decides the child doesn't deserve it, but they don't have the information I have, and I can totally justify why that child will be getting a reward at the end of half term.

@LolaSmiles what a fantastic post! It really irks me when people assume fistly that other kids are “naughty”. (just because your child came home one day saying the other child did something bad/got told off etc) it does not mean that child deserves that label. My DS was regularly told off in reception and year 1 for things like chatting too much, not listening, two or more boys being silly together etc. He could easily have been labelled “naughty” but how does that label help anyone? Now he’s a much more mature and well behaved boy in year 5 and hasn’t had a telling off in years from teachers, and they praise him for his hard work. Do you think it’s possible you’ve put a label on a child because you have in the past seen or heard of some “naughty” behaviour, but actually you haven’t a clue what that child’s behaviour is really like now? Kids mature at different ages and mine certainly took longer than some other boys. My DD on the other hand was the total opposite and acts like a teacher’s pet. Doesn’t mean my son would be any less deserving of a shout out.

Bottom line is, you haven’t got a clue how much work other families are doing, you haven’t got a clue what another child’s behaviour is like now unless you see them as often as you do your own kids and it’s ridiculous to suggest kids are getting shout outs because they’re in some way inferior to yours and need encouragement and motivation. I’ve also never heard of children with behaviour problems being sent on special school trips. That is a ludicrous idea and if true there is a real problem with those schools.

Like I’ve said time and time again, your child will get her turn. In the meantime, try to be happy for other children. When my DD got her award, everyone clapped for her and sent her such lovely messages. She did the same for all the children in her class who got an award after her. There is no need to be bitter and jealous but if you’re that precious about it then just email the HT.

We have the same - it's the kids who's parents have employed a tutor to do homeschooling that are getting all the praise not the ones that are winging it through and still doing well. Mine have busted a gut this week and really proud of themselves, nothing same people get the praise as always. Now they can't be bothered to do their best as no one seems to give a toss.

WhatToDo82
Your son sounds lovely. All children mature are different rates. It's a shame some parents are quick to throw the 'naughty' label around.

I am aware of children with behaviour problems having trips off site, but they're usually for particular reasons. For example, I know some students who would go on regular 'trips', but it was actually a series of days working with The Princes Trust because they were at risk of having few qualifications and being NEET, or they have been involved in an intervention project and there was a reward trip one afternoon. Others have done activitiess off site to build positive relationships with youth workers from local charities or school learning mentors because until school help the child address the cause of the behaviour then the behaviour isn't going to improve.

There is a real lack of understanding on here about challenging behaviour and the reality is it's complicated. What seems to happen on here is that people (rightly imo) believe their child's learning shouldn't be limited by persistent disruptive behaviour, but then when schools put things in place for those students people complain because they think their child who doesn'tneed it should have it . It's the same for many interventions. I've had calls complaining that intervention wasn't offered to a student getting a 7 when their parents wanted them to get an 8. Apparently it's morally wrong to give intervention to children with SEN when 'hard working students like DC' don't get it.

Let's be honest, we all know the parents complaining that the school have done a reward trip for a handful of students who are at risk of being NEET wouldn't want their child to be at risk of being NEET with limited qualifications in order to access the trip. They just want to prevent what they consider less deserving children of having anything nice.

I get you OP, as people have said, no harm in emailing, as they might take it on board. At least your DD does have you being her cheerleader but I know what what you're saying.

When I was at school you didn't really get praised publicly (well, people who were good at sport did, people who were good academically and / just studious and well behaved didn't - in fact there was a sort of feeling that even some teachers thought that was just a bit swotty, but that's a whole other story!) but you did get credits - which were for a range of things, from academic excellence for good work, much improved for the people who were trying hard, and also good behaviour - so seemed like there was a way to reward people individually and regularly, both the naughty children who had maybe finally done something right to try and encourage them, as well as the children who were well behaved and hard working without it having to be the same ones who were coming to attention all the time.

As a teacher I do see this happen, but I don't think this is always the case. I had a parent email me recently about her child not getting any praise or shout outs, but their work wasn't to the best of their ability, it was all correct but as a high flyer this pupil usually shows working, uses different methods to master them all, presents work neatly. So even though it was all correct, it was below their usual standard and as such not praise inspiring. Contrast that with an unengaged learner who has handed in the last seven pieces of work complete and at a pass grade and that does deserve praise. It's all about comparing them to their own standards and achievements, not comparing them to other kids.

Thank you for saying that about children, who are doing well in lockdown. I think what you’ve said needs saying a lot. My DD’s friend isn’t bucking that trend unfortunately. But the poor kid was finally diagnosed with ADHD and dyslexia last week so hopefully the help will now be forthcoming. I don’t know him, just what I hear of him on call. I know he’s a bit of a rebel. But he is really sweet to her (and sweet on her ). If he manages to start working, I will definitely be there to cheer him on..... not that I’d be allowed of course. Gotta love 12 and 13 yos....

@TwoTinyCrafters
Would that sort of scenario be would be rectified by doing, what DD’s school is doing and emailing an outstanding engagement letter to the children, who’ve done all their work each week?

And do you know for sure the child is not struggling with their mental health at home and the work isn’t up to the normal standard because they’re struggling to even get out of bed and do the work? I think it’s very hard to be teachers and I don’t want to come across as critical btw.

As a previously working LSA in a high school we saw this all the time. Yes the students we supported these students and it helped to motivate them, but we also saw how the good kids reacted to it. A group of us appealed to the HT about this and we started a reward shop. All students were eligible for rewards in every class, these added up and then could be exchanged for items in the reward shop. There was something for everyone, we took requests and where possible were able to bring these items into the shop. We had a great mixture of items available from small things like fidget spinners colouring pencils all the way up to cd's pen drives and vouchers for various shops / iTunes etc, We had a good turnover of items to keep the students interested. It was massively successful, but depended on us volunteering our time to do it. After I had to leave after a serious back operation I hope it continued. It gave all the students a boost and we got excellent comments from parents and teachers about it, even Ofsted mentioned it in their report.

It's all about comparing them to their own standards and achievements, not comparing them to other kids.

@TwoTinyCrafters

So why the need to publically reward children? If its about working against their own standards why does the world need to know about it. Surely a note or card sent privately to the child would have a similar impact and likewise a phone call to the child who's work has slipped to find out what is happening for them would surely have more impact than the shame or disappointment of never getting a shout out or reward.

I had something similar when my dd was in y2. He desperately wanted to join science club but as it was only for juniors he wasn't allowed. Then the little shit in his class was told if he behaved all week he could join science club. The message ds got from that was - misbehaving gets you what you want

I just can't believe some of the comments in this thread....

My son has adhd and asd he really struggles with school but is bright, kind and funny.

I know he can also be very disruptive in class but that is not because he wants to be but because he is in a big busy school with little support.

His teachers try and the school have got to know him as well as they can over the years but it is really hard for him and the school...

He NEVER gets a shout out, never did at primary either... our experience had always been that those that can comply, work well with little support and produce neat work have been rewarded... I get this, they have worked hard but my heart breaks again and again for my bright boy who can't sit stil and gets sent out or another red mark just for being him....

There is no trauma in this house, he is very much loved and supported every step if the way but his brain is just wired differently...

It's hard, this current education system doesn't work for so many kids.

My plea is just to stop judging kids.... it is so hard and demoralising for the kids and the parents.

I am so glad for all of you whose kids are able to succeed at school but it's not as easy as just trying harder for all kids so please just think a little more before judging.

I feel deeply sorry for the children who are struggling with their mental health right now. My DD13 has gone from a confident, outgoing child to one who is anxious and barely leaving the house int eh past year. We have even had a incident of self-harm. The pastoral lead at her school is amazing and we are making slow progress. The head teacher on the other hand is horrible, she's a robot with no feelings. All I get from her are negative emails focusing on what DD hasn't done not what she has managed.

DSD12 is working very hard but is severely dyslexic so she is struggling with the work and making extra effort. Also no recognition because she isn't getting top marks.

DN15, I am currently caring for my nephew as his mum attempted suicide in the first lockdown and is still struggling mentally. Despite all his upheaval he's doing all work set and going into school one day per week for extra catch up sessions. Because he is a middle achiever her also gets no recognition for his efforts.

DS11 is in school on a key worker place. He also had SEND, high functioning ASD and ADHD. But yet we get his progress report to say he isn't achieving and is behind and making no effort. Nothing positive about him either.

All the head teacher is bothered about is the children who get too marks in everything. She doesn't acknowledge the other kids. She's absolutely vile. Thankfully the rest of her teaching and support staff are lovely. There needs to be some middle ground on all schools and education settings.

Reading this thread made me realise that my dc's school is actually fantastic in sense for rewarding children.
I have no clue if they do the official award during lockdown or not, my dc hasn't received any. But my dc is constantly getting great feedback and reward points from teachers, and recently, deputy head sent us an email praising my dc's engagement for work.

I do agree with Daydrambeliever, I don't think it's that helpful to publicly reward children in these circumstances. Personal reward or feedback is way more encouraging to each children, without making others feel disappointed.

@supersonicginandtonic

I feel deeply sorry for the children who are struggling with their mental health right now. My DD13 has gone from a confident, outgoing child to one who is anxious and barely leaving the house int eh past year. We have even had a incident of self-harm. The pastoral lead at her school is amazing and we are making slow progress. The head teacher on the other hand is horrible, she's a robot with no feelings. All I get from her are negative emails focusing on what DD hasn't done not what she has managed.

DSD12 is working very hard but is severely dyslexic so she is struggling with the work and making extra effort. Also no recognition because she isn't getting top marks.

DN15, I am currently caring for my nephew as his mum attempted suicide in the first lockdown and is still struggling mentally. Despite all his upheaval he's doing all work set and going into school one day per week for extra catch up sessions. Because he is a middle achiever her also gets no recognition for his efforts.

DS11 is in school on a key worker place. He also had SEND, high functioning ASD and ADHD. But yet we get his progress report to say he isn't achieving and is behind and making no effort. Nothing positive about him either.

All the head teacher is bothered about is the children who get too marks in everything. She doesn't acknowledge the other kids. She's absolutely vile. Thankfully the rest of her teaching and support staff are lovely. There needs to be some middle ground on all schools and education settings.

You sound like an amazing parent and your kids/ nephew are very lucky to have you...

Just shows how messed up the rewards system currently is...

My DD is 12 has ASD and PDA, she doesn't disrupt classes but struggles internally every day... great SENCO who gets her but she didn't get praise points for being present every day, doing her work whenever she can and engaging in lessons as teachers don't understand that for her that is a mountain to climb everyday.

She was in yr 7 when we went into lockdown , teachers havn't has the chance to get to know her and so they just don't realise what she is overcoming and the effort she makes..

The system just doesn't work...

You must email the school saying exactly what your post says....I so regret being too soft when my DS’s were in school. Our children need to know that their hard work is recognised....it’s not enough for us to be their only cheerleaders!!