Why can't the government create 'Nightingale' schools.

[Jessy193819]

I may be in la la land here and I bet you any money it's all to do with funding.
But the nightingale hospital was open to help NHS (lots of controversy about how useful it's been I know).

How come the government can't use hubs and other unused buildings to create some 'mini schools' (per say) to help with social distancing and creating smaller class sizes during covid.

There are thousands of supply teachers and supply TA's out there who would probably jump at the chance to apply for these roles.

There probably is a reason why this won't happen but it'd help ensure all children have a full-time education whilst reducing class sizes.

Supply teachers and village halls are rather in short supply in the middle of big cities
where the largest most crowded schools are to be found

In the North West, there are a lot of supply teachers, so there is not a shortage of supply teachers everywhere,
Yes some places there is a shortage but other places are overrun with teachers.

Because you can't compare like with like.

Nightingale Hospitals have their clientele bussed in semi-conscious and don't complain that there's no where to put their lunchbox.

They also don't need shielding grandma to collect them at 3pm because mum and dad are desperately trying to hold onto their jobs and can't just sign off.

Nightingale Hospitals have their clientele bussed in semi-conscious and don't complain that there's no where to put their lunchbox.
And the Nightingale hospital at the Excel
4000 beds
never had more than 500 patients

All because there are shortages of supply teachers and empty church halls/sports halls in places, does that mean in another place were there are supply teachers and empty halls and a school comes up with a solution to find extra space so a few more children can come into school and still be social distanced, it shouldn't be allowed to happen.

Who will run them? Who will do all the admin? The health and safety? Building maintenance/cleaning? Who will assess if the facilities are adequate and safe? How will safety be maintained at breaks/lunch? How will safety be maintained on reception? How will safety be maintained on who enters the building? Will there be adequate equipment? Books? Pens? Paper? Whiteboards etc? Tech? Internet? Phone lines? How will child protection be maintained? Assessments? Who will monitor the teachers and children's performance? Which children will go there? How will you allocate places? How will teachers communicate with parents? How will you recruit new TAs?

@OwlWearingGlasses some schools have come up with solutions, so I assume they had factored in all these things, but weren't allowed to put these plans into action

Part of the problem is that it’s very rare in the UK for the Department of Education (or government) to be headed by a parent with a child in a State school. So they have no stake in the system.

Also the Minister for Education is traditionally an incompetent who the Prime Minister owes a favour to, which doesn’t help.

@Letseatgrandma

I just think there are ways to do this if they really wanted to

They (the government) don’t really want to, that’s the problem.

They don’t want to spend any additional money on schools, and I don’t imagine they want parents to find out what it’s like for their children to be taught in classes of 12-15 either, because they’ll like it and realise how much better it is than classes of 30+.

^this ^

Subsidiarity
The idea that decisions are taken at the lowest level of government available
and only moved up the chain of command
when coordination between government bodies is needed.

In the school environment :

Those schools that could have stayed open should have stayed open.

Those that could not would have received appropriate support and guidance by the LEA

Where the LEA faced issues too large to handle the DFE would step in

Yes, different areas would have had different solutions
but decisions would have been

• transparent
• appropriate
• accountable
• flexible

instead we have had Hancock and Williamson preaching from on high
with no understanding
and little empathy or care

They don’t want to spend any additional money on schools, and I don’t imagine they want parents to find out what it’s like for their children to be taught in classes of 12-15 either, because they’ll like it and realise how much better it is than classes of 30+
yep, they dont want the common people to get ideas above their station, stay in your lane plebs

How would you decide which children were educated in school with all the facilities & resources and which ones get to go to school in random halls /other places.
Yet more discrimination against the poor & disadvantaged

@StripeyDeckchair why would it be discrimination against the poor and disadvantaged? It is just a stop gap before children can go back to school properly. At the moment some children have a TA in a class and no teacher, as the teacher is at home providing the remote provision. Is that discrimination?

Some schools came up with this idea when they were asked to have to have some year groups in back in the summer, and it would mean more children could have actually had some face to face time at school. But they weren't allowed. I assume schools will probably go back in a similar way this time (unless the Government is completely stupid and lets everyone go back at the same time without any mitigation put in place)
Therefore, wouldn't it be a good idea if schools were able to consider these ideas.

I was reading about a school which used a community hall as extra space whilst they were waiting for a classroom extension, before COVID times. That community hall isn't being used now by the school, or by anybody else I assume. So why not let that school use it again to let more children be able to go back to school

It is just a stop gap before children can go back to school properly.
10 months and counting .....

I was reading about a school which used a community hall as extra space whilst they were waiting for a classroom extension, before COVID times.
Link please

because you repeatedly mention other countries and local schools that do not appear in search for the rest of us.

@Bourbonic I think your numbers are way, way off. They don't stack up with the number of school children in the UK.

@Jessy193819 I think it's a good idea to think creatively and challenge on this sort of thing. I do think our education system needs massive reform. How long before we have another coronavirus that will see school children being sent home for months? The government needs to be investing and making long term plans to continue on-site provision in the future. We should never, ever again force so many children to miss out on so much. If that means more space and more teachers so that we can have classes of 15, so be it.

They say where there's a will there's a way - there are a lot of people making up all kinds of excuses as to why things can't change, but if the best minds set to it then we'd find a way through.

They say where there's a will there's a way - there are a lot of people making up all kinds of excuses as to why things can't change, but if the best minds set to it then we'd find a way through

Reasons, not excuses.

The will comes from the government, i.e. the money.

@echt some of them are reasons, others are excuses, nothing more. They are not insurmountable problems.

Also, it's not just about the government's will and the funding.

Plenty of people here are listing x, y and z as blockers regardless of funding. That makes it very easy for the government to agree that it can't be done - after all, the funding is not the problem right? If all these teachers are saying the issue is safeguarding, or logistics, or.... etc.

No. Let them know it CAN be done, if they put the investment of money into it. No more listing excuses to help the government worm a way out.

All the supply teachers I know are currently trying to avoid jobs so that they don’t have to do face to face teaching and can be home with their dc because they don’t want them in school.

There are about 500,000 children per year group in the UK

FWIW about 500,000 people die every year in the UK
so several times as many as have died from COVID

There are lots of creative, innovative approaches that could be implemented for secondary school pupils at least - part time timetables and work set for home learning, reduce movement around school, bring own lunch where possible, hire additional local halls, operate a 7 day timetable (staff work 5 days), additional staff - not necessarily teachers but people who can deliver what a teacher sets - postgrads, people with relevant degrees, etc. None of this is perfect and it’s just some ideas I’m throwing out there, and yes, it all needs to be funded and yes, there would be a lot of resistance from schools. What we do have to accept is that schools are unlikely to get anywhere close to normal until at least September, maybe later, and we need as a society and in our communities to start asking ‘how’ we can make it work rather than ‘whether’ we can make it work.

A Head I know enquired about renting a unused nearby University building so their secondary could social distance more effectively back in May. The council said they would not approve 'change of use'. It's like the opposite of "where there's a will there's a way".

@Skysblue

Part of the problem is that it’s very rare in the UK for the Department of Education (or government) to be headed by a parent with a child in a State school. So they have no stake in the system.

Also the Minister for Education is traditionally an incompetent who the Prime Minister owes a favour to, which doesn’t help.

That's a perfect summary of the shit situation.

@mindutopia I assume they aren't getting paid

This whole idea is like saying ‘ I want diamonds, so I’m going to plant a diamond tree to grow them’ And then calling people negative if they don’t think it will work, and saying ‘where there is a will there is a way’. It’s a stupid idea. You knowing 2 or 3 people who say they wouldn’t mind doing a bit of supply means nothing. The uk is short of tens of thousands of teachers, even when we are teaching in classes of 80+. As well as that, schools need premises staff, receptionists, Internet access, safety inspectors, security and all sorts of staff and infrastructure these village halls just don’t have, you have no idea.

We have school buildings. We could use them for small groups. Rita’s with every child in for two half days a week, or similar, with plenty of cleaning g tone in between