Why can't the government create 'Nightingale' schools.

[Jessy193819]

I may be in la la land here and I bet you any money it's all to do with funding.
But the nightingale hospital was open to help NHS (lots of controversy about how useful it's been I know).

How come the government can't use hubs and other unused buildings to create some 'mini schools' (per say) to help with social distancing and creating smaller class sizes during covid.

There are thousands of supply teachers and supply TA's out there who would probably jump at the chance to apply for these roles.

There probably is a reason why this won't happen but it'd help ensure all children have a full-time education whilst reducing class sizes.

I wrote about this at the start of the first lockdown. Nightingale scale intervention for schools. A lot of the posts back ran along the lines of "it's not going to be for long, just keep your kids at home with you for a few weeks and do baking, ffs". Ha fucking ha.

For what it's worth, I'm a trained teacher. Left a couple of years ago to be a SAHM for a while. I would go back in a nightingale scenario, if it meant we got kids back on education and my own kids could go to school again. I don't want to be a teacher long term, but I'd do three to six months (yes, without ppe!) as part of a wider whole country effort to get the schools going again. I don't imagine I'm completely alone, out of the entire nation. There are a LOT of qualified, experienced teachers currently out of the profession, as it has terrible retention rates. So there's a pool of people there.

But the whole point in 'closing' schools in the 1st place was to minimise contact & reduce risk etc. We're in lockdown for a reason so what would be the point in setting them up elsewhere - in any shape or form? If you're going to do that, you may as well just open them all up again & go back to normal! This proposal doesn't make any sense whatsoever. And I say that as a Primary School Teacher!!

If you can have a small group in social distanced, it would be better than having 30+ children crammed in one badly ventilated classroom, but would mean children get some form of distanced socialisation with their peers and reduces the strain on WFH parents trying to homeschool at the same time.

Denmark has done this and they have much smaller class sizes to start with!

Doctors signed up to work with ill people. Teachers did not.

@LittleGwyneth

Doctors signed up to work with ill people. Teachers did not.

No one is asking them to.

I'm just going to repeat this:

Other countries did this.

They put in the time and money to sort out the logistics - and they did this.

It was a choice.

Our government chose not to.

Denmark did this and their average class size for Primary is 19, and they still thought it was necessary to at least half the class size. They also are equipped for more outside learning.

Some local Primaries have class sizes of 34 and the Government think it is fine to cram them into a classroom that isn’t really fit for 30 pupils and then add in a highly infectious virus. What could go wrong? Oh wait, we have seen what could go wrong!

Danish tax rates are double those of the UK

Brits voted for Austerity Tories
don't be surprised when that is what you got

Government should have looked at this last March, including proper consultation with teachers and been able to quickly give a detailed explanation of any reasons it was/was not possible. There could then have been discussion of whether the issues could be overcome. If not fair enough- some of the reasons provided here.

What is shocking is the failure to provide laptops and hotspots to pupils and teachers as needed. That would not have helped all pupils who might not have parents with ability to help child access learning but there the chance.

Because that wouldn’t do anything to stop the tide of community transmission which this lockdown is designed to do!

Aren't schools 'closed' (you'll know why I use the inverted commas here) to reduce transmission? So having extra, albeit smaller, education depots defeats the purpose of closing schools to most/many/some in the first place?

Where are you going to magic teachers up? And it was the teaching unions saying they wanted schools closed. Remember there's more to a modern classroom than just seats desks and a blackboard - you can't just find spaces with the tech they need, plus appropriate facilities (parents would moan if there kid was moved to the temporary substandard buildings without a playground, dining hall etc)

@alwjebdbajkew

I genuinely don't think they care.

Because young people don't vote and older people do. If you are a political party wanting to get / stay elected then you prioritise spending on the elderly- enter fuel allowance, triple locked pensions / tv and bus passes etc and so basically stuff the young people/ children.

@DazzlePaintedBattlePants

It’s almost impossible to get teaching staff at the moment. Unless you had to, why would you want to work in an environment where you are not allowed to use any of the standard PPE found in other workplaces?

You also can’t throw out safeguarding processes or health and safety assessments of premises now either; you’d need to fit out village halls with white boards, lunch facilities etc.

I know lots of teachers who left in last 5 years (including me) who have said they would go back. I also know of 10 graduates who registered to be TAs with agencies prior to lockdown and are just waiting.

I honestly think if schools had the budget, there would be staff. It’s a money issue and a an extreme stress issue (not COVID exactly but government piss poor handling of COVID and testing and paperwork and ofsted.... the list of avoidable stresses is endless...).

vote a new government in and you will get rid of the staffing shortage in schools and have a far less mental-health-crisis-inducing education system for children, teens, staff and parents.

Apologies for the spelling/grammar above - homeschooling and toddler chasing! Must dash.

@ListeningQuietly class sizes and school buildings etc were pretty crap under Labour too.

@movingonup20 so how have other countries done this?

I made this point on another thread and was jumped on.

But I agree. Our schools are hideously underfunded with too many bodies crammed into too small a space. Covid has simply magnified a problem that's always been there.

We need to learn from this. We need classrooms that are comfortable and not crowded. Class sizes that are manageable and make for optimal teaching and learning and behaviour management.

Yes, it WILL cost money. But a well educated population is an investment in the future of the country. We are constantly told there is no money, yet the government finds money for things they consider a priority. The money wasted on HS2 for example could have been better spent on health or education.

Jessy I don't know where you live but you're very lucky if you think there are thousands of supply teachers.
When Blended Learning was put forward as a means of getting children back into school in the summer - church halls, leisure centres etc being used to allow smaller classes, it wouldn't work as there aren't enough teachers to go round.
In our area, there are very few supply teachers, so when staff are off, the ASN teachers have to cover classes so the pupils who need extra help have to miss out. Recently an ASN teacher had to cover full time for a whole term

I don’t think high schools and primary schools should be dealt with the same way. There are so many differences that the solutions need to be different.

I thought last year that for primary schools they should be placing portable classrooms in any space they could. I can see this wouldn’t be an option for every school but for many primary schools they could. Staffing would probably be an issue but they haven’t even seemed to try.

Secondary schools would be more difficult but maybe have more of a rota system with half the students in mon/Tues use Wednesday for teachers planning and assessment time and to clean then Thursday/Friday for the other half of school. Not ideal but I feel better than current system. And the days they are not in school they have online work and work set from the days they are in school.

@Yolanda524 are you blaming the schools or the Government for not trying?

The same way some of you can't believe there are thousands of teachers waiting is the same way I'm shocked at places that have a teacher shortage.
I understand secondary has a teacher shortage, but in many places, primary does not have a shortage - especially in places like Liverpool, Manchester, North Wales, Chester etc.

Rather than some people making snarky comments about the stupidity of this, why don't you put the snarkiness towards a government who don't fund education enough.
Covid or no covid, 30 is too much in a classroom, especially in primary.
We should start having a max of 20,
But the government will never put money into opening more schools, hiring more staff.

Also, I think in many places, the staffing crisis is a funding issue.
The funding issue is proven by TA's covering classrooms as a HLTA rather than someone who has qualified as a teacher.

I just find it sad how how our education system is.

I said the same as the OP last Summer. There are empty hotels with conference facilities, function rooms, etc., sitting idle. There are entire universities with moth balled lecture theatres, halls, large classrooms, and again, unused catering facilities.

They'd rather risk the health of school staff than pay for them.

[quote ineedaholidaynow]@ListeningQuietly class sizes and school buildings etc were pretty crap under Labour too.[/quote]
Labour left power in 2010

People voted for low taxes and austerity
which means school budgets have been cut year on year for over a decade
and then people are surprised when schools (and hospitals and councils) are under funded