US erasing Women - Janice Turner

[feelingquitehopeful]

It was totally shocking to me this week as a supporter of the Democrats to see Biden choosing his moment carefully on day one to wipe out women's and girl's rights in the states in one fail swoop. There was no discussion, no consultation. No warning. Just like that he removed centuries of our rights as women.

He will now go down in history as the first President that abolished womenhood and Motherhood and women's rights. I am astonished and horrified and reeling actually, even this morning. I have had a few days to process the shock, but no, I am still reeling.

It is now punishable to describe a woman as a mother for instance, or to stop a man/boy with a penis showering with your pre teen daughter at school.
Prisons can no longer keep women safe, they will now lock up male rapists (Identifying as women, which anyone can now do no questions asked) with trapped female prisoners in cells. Can you imagine being in that position? The horror of being trapped in that situation, as survivor this actually keeps me awake at night.

Men can use lavatories, locker rooms and showers with young girls. It is ILLEGAL to now stop them. It is also illegal to stop a man competing in women's sports, making women's and girls sports now obsolete. What girl is going to outrun a biological male?

We have literally, as a sex been erased completely from the legal framework and with it all of our protections thanks to Biden. Men can still be men, because that doesn't offend anyone apparently - they will not be called 'testicle havers' or 'ejaculators' it will only be women subjected to this. So that says a lot of modern equality and where we are with it today in the US.

Women have been reduced to 'Menstruators' and the highly offensive 'black birthing bodies' if you are describing a mother from the BAME community. That is what we must all be called now.

That is the new healing landscape Biden describes as he cuts out the rights of half the nation.

Janice Turner as always is an absolute legend, and her excellent article 'War of words risks wiping women from our Language' in the Times this morning is outstanding, and covers the grave situation we ALL now face. For anyone thinking it could never happen here, think again.

Read it for yourself:

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/war-of-words-risks-wiping-women-from-our-language-djhp2mwjg

Do you often find that implying that people you disagree with are “pieces of shit” and telling them to grow up helps them see your point of view, Joe? Or urging them to mindlessly repeat slogans helps people think things through and reach sensible conclusions?

Crack on by all means, though. I’m horrified by the state of politics at the moment, and every time we get a thread like this and one side of the debate lays out concepts and arguments, considers competing interests and works through logic and practical results, and the other side shouts “URGH BIGOT STFU”, then I’m cool with that, because I’m gunning for the first side. No skin off my nose.

Justanotherposter00 Have you heard of Debbie Hayton? Debbie is a trans woman and a Labour party member who is very worried at what is happening courtesy of the "woke" TRAs in this country.
Miranda Yardley is another, though I don't know if he (his choice of pronouns) is a Labour member. Both have spoken WPUK meetings and other trans women have attended them.

I wish the party activists would listen to all trans people instead of aggressive TRAs, many of whom are not even trans.
Many trans people want nothing to do with what is being done in their name.

You keep stressing about something that isn’t real hun, and I’ll keep valuing my colleagues, friends and family.
I know who’d I’d rather be.

You’d rather be someone who supports a delusion because you want to be nice. Okay. But please leave rational people to discern what is true and what isn’t, because you are not in a position to do that.

I see the Conservative party activists are pushing their claim the their party is the only one for womens rights.

How you can say that when Theresa May was full on Trans Women Are Women at the Pink News awards and the party has Crispin Blunt, Sue Pascoe, Christopher Chope and Ben Bradley pushing an anti woman agenda is beyond me.

No main party is free from gender politics.

Because I’m not a piece of shit.

Hear that everyone?

Anyone who objects to a male rapist being housed in a female prison because he identifies as a woman is a 'piece of shit'.

These threads are an eye opener aren't they?

Justanotherposter00 And before you go too far down the 'women defending their rights sounds like racism' line, do note that virtually all the legal cases against gender ideology in this country have been/are being brought about by brave women of colour: Alison Bailey, Keira Bell, Sonia Appleby, Maya Forstate, Raquel Rosaria Sanchez.

No main party is free from gender politics

Has Boris Johnson ever been asked his views on TWAW?

Or does he get a pass on that and that question is only reserved for Labour politicians?

Why are you shocked? Biden was clear about his intentions.

These threads are an eye opener aren't they?

Yeah, very much so.

The fact that all the parties are compromised by this just shows how well the lobbyists have done their jobs. Here's the link to Labour's campaign for women, https://labourwomensdeclaration.org.uk, for those interested.

Because I’m not a piece of shit.

Someone needs to tell the democrats "negging" doesn't work.

Not to worry though they have a plan to deal with anyone who disagrees with them using anti terrorism legislation. Libertarians are apparently a threat to democracy! I wish the women of America good luck fighting erasure as a sex class.

Tanith I hadnt actually but I will do further reading, thank you

Funny how people never talk about the Conservative party's view

www.lgbtconservatives.org.uk/news/statement-response-gra-announcement

Or does he get a pass on that and that question is only reserved for Labour politicians?

He gets a pass because his honest answer (of course TW aren’t literally women; they identify as women) would only gain him votes.

Miranda Yardley is another, though I don't know if he (his choice of pronouns) is a Labour member.

He (his choice as you correctly said) was kicked out of the Labour Party for his views on self ID.

The executive committee from Battle and Bexhill CLP resigned a few years ago because of the harassment and abuse they received about trans issues. My post would probably be deleted if I said more about it.

@AStudyinPink

examples of official UK crime statistics no longer including sex but ‘gender’

I was asked by a website for my “gender” yesterday. I was given the opportunity to “customise” it, so I said “fruit”.

At this point I would refuse to answer. We need to stand up to this, it is discrinination by another name (albeit originally motivated by genuine motived to include those people feeling trapped in the wrong body).

Even JKR called the comp. that Harry was going to go to in Philosopher's Stone if he was with the Dursleys "Stonewall High".

Original, liberal attitudescabd beliefs, like hers, have been taken too far. JKR is thankfully rich enough to be hard to cancel.

At this point I would refuse to answer.

You can choose ‘rather not say’ but that doesn’t cause them quite enough inconvenience for me.

@FOJN

I'm surprised you are so shocked by this. The dems position on this issue has been very clear. The women of the USA had a very difficult choice, vote Republican and risk Roe vs Wade being overturned, particularly worrying given the make up of the SC, or vote Democrat and have women as a legally recognised entity erased.

Campaigners in the UK have been making this point for several years and yet it is only the Conservative party who still seem to know what a woman is. I have never voted for them but feel I might have to be pragmatic and do just that at the next election.

Censorship by social media will only serve to continue to silence dissenting voices.

What shocks me more is thinking that Janice Turner is brave for speaking up for women. How did we get here?

She is brave becauae of the legal and societal backlash, which lasts forever in our digital world.

Though, maybe we should embrace it. If everything is to be sexless, then maybe the sexist UK schools policy of improving boys' attainment in relation to girls' attainment should go (it's not just the noble ambition of just raising boys' attainment in general, it us compared to girsl).

Then anyone can flourish to be their best no matter their sex, and those who were once classified as girls can get the higher grades, out perform boys without being judged, better paid jobs. Silver lining?

Then there will be no such thing as a sex gap (they call it a gender gap, but as we have just been "educated" to know, gender is how you feel about your body, not what your genes are...

Stop talking about trans rights like trans people don’t already have equal rights.

Trans people are either biologically male, in which case they have male rights as well as all the privilege and power being born male brings. Or they are born female, in which case supporting trans rights erases their sex based rights protections the same way it does all the rest of us women.

This isn’t a trans rights issue, it’s a women’s rights one. Stop letting it get reframed as a trans rights arguement as if there’s any credibility to the line that trans people don’t have rights.

Do trans people need the right to live as the sex role stereotype they feel most comfortable. Sure, they already have that right too. Do they need protection from transphobia? Absolutely if they are being discriminated against because of being trans. Again that’s already law. Self id erases the laws that protect trans people from discrimination or violence based on being trans, as well as all women’s legal rights protections also. There’s no way to prove a person is being discriminated against because they are a male presenting as a woman if people are just a big spectrum of whoever they feel like today. There’s no need to provide medical treatment for transitioning if self id makes anyone a woman by signing a piece of paper.

If the legal definition of women now includes men then there is no way to measure how women vote. There’s no way to assess the disproportionate number of women who are disadvantaged by austerity. There’s no way to record how many women are victims of male violence. There’s no way to measure the sex pay gap. There’s no way to counter the glass ceiling. We could have a Parliament made up of 100% men that is legally 50% women, so we can’t address how under represented women are in decisions that affect us. Women will think what they tell us we think because there’s no way to identify that the 100% of women who voted to criminalise abortion were all male. There will be no way to speak up against 100% of women being pro sex work, because we can’t point out those women are men. 50% of all rapists will be women, because we can’t tell the truth that they are male once self id comes in.

If the legal definition of women includes men then all female sex based protections are gone. As is any chance we can fight to get them back- because there’s no way of measuring women’s needs and women’s views and women’s votes if women includes anyone who feels like it. This puts us back way way before suffragettes, because at least what a woman was wasn’t in dispute then. They could identify women couldn’t vote because they could say who a woman was. If the oppressed class can’t be identified we can’t stand together, we can’t form groups or have any collective voice about our shared needs and shared experiences of being the oppressed class. At least suffragettes could say they were oppressed on the basis of their sex. Now we will be oppressed while having to say we are liberated. They are taking our rights away while selling us the illusion it’s progress. And that means taking away transmens rights too.

We are the chicken sticking it’s neck out to be chopped off.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55774379

Is it coincidence that UK today announces proposals that will make it easier to lock up trans women in women's prisons.

"Up to 500 new prison cells are to be built in women's jails, the Ministry of Justice has announced. These will be built in existing women's prisons to increase the number of single cells available and they will include in-cell showers."

@Jetatyeovilaerodrome

Because I’m not a piece of shit.

Hear that everyone?

Anyone who objects to a male rapist being housed in a female prison because he identifies as a woman is a 'piece of shit'.

These threads are an eye opener aren't they?

Exactly. Because they equate defending womens' rights is identical to transphobia. What we need is the limits to be drawn, legay if necessary (legally, now, as gender protection is in many country's laws now, correctly in my opinion).

And that opinion is not fact - a transperson's opinion/those who advocate such opinions (apologies if my words are poorly chosen) should not be used to silence a group of people's factually correct statements

And how ironic that the people telling us to be kind are generally the same people telling us we are pieces of shit. So kind, right?

I would be interested to know whether Joe Black believes a person can identify into a different racial group and force others to say they are a member of that group (or be labelled ‘pieces of shit’). I would be interested to know whether Joe Black thinks a person can identify in or out of being physically disabled and force others to say they are/are not disabled, because they believe it to be so.

@AStudyinPink

At this point I would refuse to answer.

You can choose ‘rather not say’ but that doesn’t cause them quite enough inconvenience for me.

precisely. Depends what the form's for. If it's an NHS form, they should be saying "sex" anyway as some medication/medical research depends on sex - too many medical trials have been done with men - of the same rafe, age etc women not forthcoming if they were mothers, pregnant etc. This is in a woman's interest, on balance.

Otherwise, send that bit in blank. No-one should be including sex as an option if its irrelevant to the service. If you're buying wifi it's irrelevant

Otherwise, send that bit in blank. No-one should be including sex as an option if its irrelevant to the service. If you're buying wifi it's irrelevant

The trouble is, if it's an online form it often won't let you go ahead unless you choose something.