Page 5 | To find many of the Mental Health champions, such as Bryony Gordon, actually not good for mental health!

Mankyfruitbowl · 16/01/2021 18:31

@XenoBitch

YANBU, I hate this too. Social media is either full of people blaming others for the pandemic because they had a takeaway coffee, or toxic positivity such as what you mentioned. My therapist hated the phrase "it is okay not to be okay".... said if you are struggling then seek some support/help.

I know this phrase has become a bit of a cliché but it sounds like your therapist was missing the point a bit - surely the whole idea is that it's not shameful to ask for help if you need it.

parallax80 · 16/01/2021 18:35

I’m a single parent, work full time and am a care leaver.

I believe in self care, because if I don’t look after myself and end up being unable to cope then my kids would end up being 3rd generation care leavers. There is no safety net.

Sometimes people end up so unwell that they cannot cope despite their best efforts. Tehima I am so sorry that people give the impression of thinking you lazy. It sounds like you are far from it, and work very hard to manage despite being dealt a hugely difficult hand.

I am lucky that while I have capacity I do everything I can to avoid those consequences.

Sometimes self care does mean forcing myself to eat wash and sleep properly, and sometimes it means accepting that I cannot do X or Y as well as I’d like or people expect, sometimes it means doing boring admin when I want to be doom scrolling. I don’t think it would make a good blog.

sixthtimelucky · 16/01/2021 18:44

I've found my tribe!

I have all the sympathy in the world for people going through MH problems (I have, my children do, it's very very difficult).

But a) people like Bryony Gordon are professional over sharers/exaggerators/rentagobs because that's how they make their considerable money b) she and other writers from incredibly privileged backgrounds (privileged in many senses of the word) really do NOT understand the challenges of 90% of the population let alone a single mum with MH on £15k a year and c) yes it's very confusing all the messages about being strong/weak/talking/taking time for yourself - just SHUT UP

Thisisworsethananticpated · 16/01/2021 18:52

But my illness is not the kind of thing you can tell people about

That’s really sad to read also totally understandable
I do appreciate what you have is way more severe than what I have ever experienced
But by the very fact of working 8 hour shifts you are actually cracking on
You might not realise that
The two people I know with severe MH issues ( similar terms to what you say) can’t work

So I am very impressed by your self
Awareness and strength in your post

Guineapigbridge · 16/01/2021 19:07

Attraction theory innit. You attract more of the thing into your life that you spend most time focussing on.
Focus on "I'm having a MH crisis" and that's what you'll get.

LouJ85 · 16/01/2021 19:34

@Lovestonap

I don't know who BG is, so can't comment on her specifically, but I think that I disagree with what you're saying and the examples you give.

The self-care, indulge in a cry etc advice is there to help to you manage your stress levels, like a pressure valve. It may not be great for your kids to see you having a cry but if it means you can continue to be there and care for them then it's the best. 'soldiering on' without making any material change might work for some people. Others will become completely overwhelmed and commit suicide.

I think the message is that if you're struggling, be it depression, panic disorder, whatever, that's it's ok for you to seek support or show your distress without shame. Mental health first aiders are there to offer that support if required. They are not forced upon you and nothing is written in an 'accident book'.
It's great that the people on this thread know what helps them in their own distress -some people are yet to find ways to cope and I think that people being open about their own ways of managing, however diverse, can only be a good thing.

I don't know BG either.

But as a mental health professional myself I entirely agree with what you say.

bluegovan · 16/01/2021 19:56

It's surely good that MH is now more widely talked about, and people like BG probably help. But what doesn't seem to change is government policy to address the things that would really make a difference, but are also expensive, difficult and long term. Things like very long NHS waiting times for psych assessments, sorting out the shambolic underprovision for children, and poor availability of NHS one to one counselling services. It feels like a cheap sticking plaster to get us all to be 'MH aware', but have very little help available if that awareness makes you realise you need help beyond antidepressants and online CBT.

sevencontinents · 16/01/2021 20:08

I also think on this thread lots of people are conflating mental health advocacy with Briony Gordon. As a member of the OCD community, I have seen so many advocates changing peoples lives, not by plastering their experiences over twitter but starting podcasts, writing GOOD blogs, speaking at conferences.
OCD is a very shameful condition and if it weren't for Rose Bretecher writing the below article, more people would be suffering in silence. Surely we can all agree that her type of advocacy is very much needed...

www.theguardian.com/society/2013/aug/31/pure-ocd-the-naked-truth

Bringonthebloodydrama · 16/01/2021 20:12

Bryony Gordon's level of narcissism makes me uncomfortable. Putting that incident in her book (about the man performing a sex act on her as her husband and child lay a few hundred ft away) made me think of her poor daughter when she's older. 😕

SuperPug · 16/01/2021 20:19

Agreed - if something is wrong with your physical health, you go and see a qualified professional. I’d do the same for my mental health, not listen to twaddle from Fearne Cotton and the like.
It reminds me of people I’ve known who desperately latch on to the latest thing e.g. be kind but it essentially means very little and (in my experience) is spouted by people who can be quite toxic.
Having said that, I do find Lorraine Pascale more authentic and she seems to make the time to respond to people as well. She posts a few things about mental health etc.

kerstina · 16/01/2021 22:03

I haven't read anything Bryony Gordon but I do find some mental health campaigners helpful such as Alistair Campbell and Andrea MacLaine. Simon Reeves book also highlights depression .
Having had a psychotic breakdown 3 years ago and painfully aware of feeling selfish as I wanted to commit suicide . Months of not sleeping and being unable to calm down pushed me to that point . I have recovered to a certain extent in that I am off medicine but as a reformed people pleaser it seems people with mental health issues often can be , I still struggle with self care and feeling selfish . At my lowest I had never felt so worthless so all those saying just grit your teeth and get on with it are missing the point . Yes the answer to mental illness sometimes lies outside of your self I guess this is where religion and spirituality helps . To focus on being a positive force in the world.To focus on yourself will lead to hell but looking after yourself is healthy.

bluegovan · 17/01/2021 19:11

I agree about Alistair Campbell. I think he's in a demographic (60+ male) who are less likely to discuss MH with their mates, colleagues, etc, so very helpful to have people like him writing about their experiences. DH has read one of his books about depression and I think found it helpful, but only picked it up because he'd enjoyed AC's political diaries. I doubt he'd have picked up a Ferne Cotton self-help book

Original poster

Sethy38 · 18/01/2021 20:14

Just read this from one of the celeb MH campaigners. One of the more prolific... just take time out, self-care etc campaigners

And literally all I thought was f*ck.off.

It was actually quite good for me MH!

To find many of the Mental Health champions, such as Bryony Gordon, actually not good for mental health!

OP posts:

Nettleskeins · 18/01/2021 20:33

But it.is all true surely? Tone.a.bit.schmaltzy but most of us will.do Some of those things in years to come??
Aged 18'and.v.low, that might have helped me? Not.in a cheer up.and stop.complaining way.but in a you have no.idea.what is in store way.

Although.it.is also true that.what.lies in store.for most.of.us.is.defnitely going.to be moments of suffering and.desolation, yet.life will still.be.worth.living. maybe that would be.a better way to express it. Shit happens.and there are no fairytales.

Sheleg · 18/01/2021 22:41

Arghh! Use spaces instead of full stops!

Nettleskeins · 19/01/2021 00:00

Sorry; using phone as have no laptop.

Nettleskeins · 19/01/2021 00:01

And it spits out fullstops when I type rapidly.

FenellaVelour · 19/01/2021 00:26

People saying that her husband must love her very much and has the patience of a saint. I’d suggest it might be the good old Fear, Obligation and Guilt. People stay in abusive marriages for all kinds of reasons.

MaskingForIt · 19/01/2021 00:41

@Sheleg

Just how many books is Bryony going to write about her problems? She has the most forgiving DH in the world, from what I can gather after reading her one about alcohol. Tiresome!

This, of course, is after she spent a decade or so being a London party girl publishing articles where she appeared to “have it all” and thus contributed to other people feeling miserable because they weren’t as successful and sociable and beautiful as her. The she cries that it was all a front and she was really miserable. Try being honest, woman!

SophieDahling · 19/01/2021 01:02

I actually can’t stand BG and feel very sad for her husband and child.

Doubtless that little girl will be a writer herself in 20 years and we will read articles about her life with her out of control alcoholic mother. It’s all media fodder for these people.

umpteennamechanges · 19/01/2021 01:03

Okay...so I see what you mean but I also disagree.

It really depends how severe your issues are.

After gritting my teeth and carrying on for years (with a similar outlook to yours) I had a total psychiatric breakdown that involved staying in a psychiatric hospital for three months and being diagnosed with bipolar disorder.

There is no one size fits all approach.

Talking about grit and resilience would not really help people in my situation. I tried that. It worked until it didn't. And when it didn't work it was catastrophic.

So I guess that's why those of us who have been through that kind of level of breakdown want other people to know that grit and pushing on through isn't the answer.

Because we've been there and wish someone had told us that if we just carried on we were, eventually, going to break ourselves.

And yes, even single mothers have to take a break in these kind of circumstances....

umpteennamechanges · 19/01/2021 01:05

@Fairyliz

Yes it’s just self indulgent twaddle for people who are too self absorbed. Just been researching about my grandad who was nominated for a Victoria cross after the Zeebrugge raid. I didn’t know about this until after his death because he didn’t keep going on about seeing his friends being killed as a 20 year old. Instead he just gritted his teeth worked hard and got on with his life. A fabulous grandad he was too although he would have been embarrassed if you had said that to him.

This is so fucking offensive actually.

Some of us have severe diagnosed mental health issues like bipolar disorder.

Do you think I can just click my fingers and make that go away because you think that's how it should work?

umpteennamechanges · 19/01/2021 01:32

@Bringonthebloodydrama

Bryony Gordon's level of narcissism makes me uncomfortable. Putting that incident in her book (about the man performing a sex act on her as her husband and child lay a few hundred ft away) made me think of her poor daughter when she's older. 😕

I can't really get into the debate about BG that much because I don't follow her and haven't read the books.

Perhaps because I haven't read it I'm missing the context but....alcoholism/addiction and sometimes mental health issues can mean that you do things that are horrible.

I have bipolar disorder and did all kinds of stupid and horrible things when hypomanic.

Surely being able to talk about these aspects honestly is part of removing the stigma around these issues?

Why should I (for example, if I started a blog) not be able to talk about some of the things I did which were unsavoury?

Do we just have to pretend that it didn't happen? Gloss over any horrible behaviour?

Surely that would be worse, if BG wrote about her experiences and left out the bits where she did things that hurt other people or were repulsive to a 'normal' person in 'normal circumstances?

umpteennamechanges · 19/01/2021 01:45

@Sethy38

Just read this from one of the celeb MH campaigners. One of the more prolific... just take time out, self-care etc campaigners

And literally all I thought was f*ck.off.

It was actually quite good for me MH!

Sorry, I know this is way too many posts in one go but obviously it's something I feel strongly about.

This wouldn't help me on days I'm just feeling somewhat depressed or somewhat anxious.

But when I was in absolute suicidal despair and considering how to kill myself it would have.

When I was so suicidal that I genuinely thought I would never laugh or smile again. That my whole life was over, that nothing was worth living for, that I was so completely worthless and life was so totally devoid of the hope of anything other than a yawning black hole of hell.

Then it would have helped.

I just think, instead of being so scathing you might be humble enough to see that things that might not help you when you have good enough MH to function might be useful for people who don't have that.

It feels a little bit like you're someone on crutches taking the piss out of a wheelchair and telling people who use wheelchairs that they just need to have a bit more grit and get on with things.

I mean, would you tell someone in a wheelchair that you don't have time as a single mother not to be able to use your legs?

Because honestly, as someone with a severe mental health issue that's how your posts are coming across to me...

Sinful8 · 19/01/2021 02:44

@Sethy38

It’s relentless....

Be kind to yourself
Say no
Self care
It’s ok to feel shit
Love yourself
Be yourself
The power of positive thinking
You go girl
You got this

And so on. And on.

I actually find it quite stressful! And then interjected with “sorry I didn’t post yesterday, I cried for four hours straight on my bedroom floor but I got through it and now I’m ok. And YOU WILL BE TOO”.

Having mini breakdowns aren’t really an option for single working parents.

There’s a heck of a lot to be said to be gritting your teeth, head down, ploughing on, but to so many of the Mental Health campaigners that approach is something to be scorned!

Anyone else a little by it all?

Do you think maybe its because their readers are the type with a lot of free time and pretty much fuck all to do