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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Biden our time until Inauguration Day! (Trump #121) 🙂🕊

984 replies

Roussette · 15/01/2021 16:01

Previous thread...
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4134370-Impeachment-of-Trump-and-Inauguration-of-Biden-120?watched=1&msgid=103674623#103674623

With thanks to @FridayNightAtTheBronzer for thread title Smile

OP posts:
Thread gallery
30
Sleipnirthewonderhorse · 16/01/2021 09:30

Donald Trump appeal says government should defend E Jean Carroll lawsuit
The US justice department has said Donald Trump should not be forced to defend himself against a defamation lawsuit by the author E Jean Carroll, who accused him of raping her, and that the government itself should be substituted as the defendant.
In a filing with the 2nd US circuit court of appeals in Manhattan, the department said Trump qualified as a typical “employee of the government” entitled to immunity under federal law from Carroll’s claims, and was also shielded because he spoke about her in his capacity as president.
www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/jan/16/donald-trump-appeal-says-government-should-defend-e-jean-carroll-lawsuit

I take they're arguing that employees of the government are immune from accusations of defamation rather than rape?

RedToothBrush · 16/01/2021 09:49

www.scotsman.com/news/politics/leading-qc-says-scottish-ministers-can-seek-mcmafia-order-donald-trumps-finances-3102713

News
Politics
Leading QC says Scottish ministers can seek 'McMafia' order into Donald Trump's finances
One of Scotland’s leading QCs has directly contradicted First Minister Nicola Sturgeon's claims that the Scottish Government is not responsible for the decision on whether to seek an Unexplained Wealth Order, amid renewed calls for ministers to investigate how Donald Trump financed the multimillion pound acquisition of his flagship international property

cyclingmad · 16/01/2021 09:57

@Tellmetruth4

Just came on to say that I’ve read most of the posts and it looks as though Cyclingmad’s having a slow moving breakdown. It’s cringe to watch. Hope this is her/his social media job and she’s/he’s being paid well.
Ah yes ghat old line where anyone who has a different way of thinking is now being classes as having a breakdown or mentally ill.

On what evidence are you saying I'm having a breakdown? I'd love to see it? Do you know me to know that with certainty?

Do you think its okay to go round accusing someone of having a mental breakdown?

Rather than engage in the conversation and the points I've made its easier for you to personally attack me, says alot about you then.

TheNorthWestPawsage · 16/01/2021 09:57

More golf woes. (Probably won't happen tho')

Palm Beach County seeks way to end lease with Trump golf course.
thehill.com/homenews/administration/534397-palm-beach-county-seeks-way-to-end-lease-with-trump-golf-course

"My initial reaction is it would be a stretch," said Falcon, according to the Post. The Trump Organization pays $88,338 a month to rent the property in Florida.

A lawyer for Trump's golf course said there would be "no basis for canceling the lease," according to the news source.

The contract between President Trump and the county does not contain a "bad boy" clause, according to Falcon. Such a clause allows a contract to be canceled if there is bad behavior from the tenet that is laid out in the contract. This behavior normally includes fraud or criminal matters, according to the Post.

Lweji · 16/01/2021 10:12

[quote chomalungma]This is the original Trump thread that led to Thread 121.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/2823906-to-think-you-should-ignore-people-having-a-go-at-you-if-you-are-the-President-Elect-of-the-USA?[/quote]
It all started with claig, though.
And the original thread would have been something like "isn't Trump so wonderful?

BTW, prophetic words in that thread, intended as suggestion for next thread title. Wink

16/01/2017 19:57 Lweji

Countdown to the 46th POTUS?

DrBlackbird · 16/01/2021 10:13

In the US, it seems like the “ordinary man” supports Trump, yet the “rich’ support democrats

That may be the impression from the news. Whilst there are of course some very wealthy Democrat supporters like Bloomberg, you don't have to dig too far to find the 1% fully support, and have done so for decades, the Republican Party.

  • Blackstone Group Inc. founder Stephen Schwarzman contributed more money to Trump’s re-election bid than anyone else in high finance.
  • Sheldon Adelson donated more than $200m to Republican Party for the 2020 election cycle
  • Richard and Liz Uihlein, owners of Uline Inc. have poured tens of millions into conservative causes.
  • Peter Thiel (PayPal) supported Trump.
  • Ronald Lauder, the billionaire chairman of Estee Lauder Cos. was a Trump donor.
  • The Koch brothers for decades have supported the Republican Party
  • Of donors giving more than $100,000 to a candidate or party, 37.50% favored Democrats and 62.04% gave to Republicans.

www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/sep/26/koch-brothers-americans-for-prosperity-rightwing-political-group
www.opensecrets.org/news/2018/11/2017-financials-of-the-kochs-dark-money-network/

My aunt's simplistic, but nevertheless helpful, summary of why people vote Tory and why the ultra wealthy men support the Republicans is that both these parties are - in principle - opposed to redistribution of wealth of any kind via taxes, capital gains, worker's rights, inheritance etc etc. except when it comes to redistributing wealth from lower socio economic groups to higher ones

So the ordinary American man supporting Trump is the equivalent of how UKIP's political base of poor white working class men would've the most to lose if Nige had ever become PM. Sad really.

Jaichangecentfoisdenom · 16/01/2021 10:13

Thank you, @chomalungma. Interesting to see exactly the same themes under discussion as then, only now with added Captiol riots and domestic terrorism.

CaveMum · 16/01/2021 10:13

Apologies, I didn’t mean to cause offence through my simplistic comparisons of US/UK politics. I was more trying to point out that politics leans more to the right in general in the US, there is no real “left” as we would see it. At least not in the mainstream.

TheOneTheOnlyPedroPony · 16/01/2021 10:22

"My initial reaction is it would be a stretch," said Falcon, according to the Post. The Trump Organization pays $88,338 a month to rent the property in Florida.

This is based on the assumption TTO has any money to pay the rent though!

AdventureIsWaiting · 16/01/2021 10:22

@cyclingmad

I'm a long-time lurker on these threads. I think many posters have been happy to engage with you, and have shared links and evidence to back up what they're saying. In response your tone (and you may not mean it like this - it's a difficult medium within which to convey tone) seems increasingly aggressive and it's coming across, to a bystander, as though you are making a concerted attempt to derail the - very informative - threads rather than partake in reasoned discussion.

FWIW, I agree that you can criticise anyone for rioting (or whatever), regardless of their political affiliations, and I think a balanced centrist approach is sorely lacking in society and politics over the past few years and that's why we've ended up in this place with Trump, Boris, Brexit etc. but it seems wilfully obtuse to say 'both sides are just as bad' on this specific issue. I don't see how it's a problem to agree the facts: there was a left-wing anarchist, there were several thousand Trump supporters / right-wing anarchists and Trump clearly incited some form of insurrection, an activity which wasn't confined to 06 January, but started prior to the November election when he began to think he was going to lose (see: pretty much the entirety of Seth Abramson's Twitter feed). I don't like a lot of what the Democratic Party does and believes in, same for the Republicans, for Labour, Tories, Conservatives, Greens etc. There's also far too much corruption in politics. Unfortunately, as much discussed in previous threads, power attracts the wrong kind of people, whether that be in politics, business or religion, and our societal structures amply reward those who don't abide by Utilitarian principles (greatest good for the greatest number).

I'll get off my soapbox now Grin

TheOneTheOnlyPedroPony · 16/01/2021 10:22

Bold fail Hmm

Biden our time until Inauguration Day!  (Trump #121) 🙂🕊
Roussette · 16/01/2021 10:28

Just glanced at that thread and read my posts to see what I was thinking at the time. Bloody hell... it's all coming back, his first presser with the mountains of empty files signifying he was giving up his business interests.

Anyway.... one thing I posted which I'm glad to say came true...

'I do think Trumper's prediction of 8 years is completely off the mark, I think he will have imploded by 4 minimum'

OP posts:
Roussette · 16/01/2021 10:31

Well said @AdventureIsWaiting. It's all about the numbers as I said on the previous thread. No excuse for even* one anarchist to be there but it pales in comparison to the rest

OP posts:
Roussette · 16/01/2021 10:31

one left wing anarchist, that should say

OP posts:
borntobequiet · 16/01/2021 10:31

One thing that is true in the US, and now in the UK, is that there is no real party of the workers

I think the US concept of “middle-class” is different from ours as well.

merrymouse · 16/01/2021 10:32

thehill.com/opinion/campaign/534213-mcconnell-about-to-school-trump-on-political-power-for-the-last-time

Interesting article on why Republicans might choose to convict Trump.

I tried to understand the US primaries system, but it seems to vary a lot from state to state.

If large states that historically vote for the other party have a lot of influence on candidate choice, doesn’t that make it more likely that a small number of people will choose the ‘wrong’ candidate?

merrymouse · 16/01/2021 10:36

I think the US concept of “middle-class” is different from ours as well.

Agree. It doesn’t seem to have anything to do with supermarket choice!

It seems to be relate to an American post war idea of prosperity at a time when Britain was still living through austerity.

Mittens030869 · 16/01/2021 10:39

*Trump pretends to be a Christian so he can harness the evangelical vote, total hypocrisy on the part of evangelicals. I would've thought Trump would be the moral antithesis of what they would want in a President. Obviously not!
I presume he is just a useful tool to advance their beliefs. *

The problem is that US evangelicals are only bothered about banning abortion. Trump said he would do this so they closed their minds to everything else he was saying. There has also always been strong support of the Republican Party among right wing Evangelicals. They're supporters of the Republican Party rather than Trump himself.

In the UK, evangelical Christianity hasn't been politicised in the same way. It's considered a matter of conscience and you will find Christians supporting both major parties.

I've also hardly ever come across Christians in the UK who like Trump. (Apart from conspiracy theorists.)

merrymouse · 16/01/2021 10:42

Trump aligns with ‘prosperity gospel’ Christians who are very much CINO.

Jaichangecentfoisdenom · 16/01/2021 10:48

I hadn't heard about this Cornish bloke. Seems to have an interesting approach to life. Grin

Biden our time until Inauguration Day!  (Trump #121) 🙂🕊
HoneysuckIejasmine · 16/01/2021 10:53

I'm not even sure "evangelical" has the same connotations in the UK and USA. I attended an evangelical church and the congregation was largely left wing, very big on charity and community outreach, pretty liberal regarding pro choice and gay marriage etc (as in most supported both) and open to all. If anything, it seemed to define a more casual approach to church and a modern style of music as opposed to the CofE or high church styles like Catholicism.

Prosperity gospel is awful. Nothing more than a pyramid scheme with hymns. If you have Sky/NowTV, "The Righteous Gemstones" is an excellent skewering of that type of church.

Mittens030869 · 16/01/2021 11:08

@merrymouse You're quite right, they love Trump for obvious reasons.

The word 'evangelical' was originally used to denote Christians who were 'Bible believing', as opposed to those who were liberal'. But quite obviously, that's impossibly simplistic, as it's possible for two people to genuinely believe in the Bible and disagree strongly on its interpretation.

So I would say that the word 'evangelical' has become meaningless. And it's been highjacked by the religious right in the US in much the same way as the term 'born again' has been.

lifesabitchandthenyoudie · 16/01/2021 11:10

@AdventureIsWaiting I was about to put my two-pennorth in - so glad I waited, your response is better by about 10,000% Smile

going back (way back! sorry I'm struggling to keep up) to the toilet paper - fortunately there isn't any orange on mine... I will report back as to its efficiency in due course Grin

Would love to have a dart board - but would probably prefer one of the Richard Osman ones (his House of Games show on BBC2 weeknights - very entertaining!)

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