To think if she is entitled to make her choice then she needs to accept that I can make my choice and neither is selfish.

[PinkShimmerSparkle]

My mum has decided she isn’t going to have a COVID jab, she is in the vulnerable category as she has COPD and diabetes. She has said she doesn’t know enough about the effects that is has on those conditions. I am disappointed that she doesn’t want to have the jab but I know this is her body and her choice. Her COPD is bad and if she catches COVID she might not survive it.
I have decided that my family (DH, DC and myself) won’t be seeing her until COVID is more under control. My reasons for this are that I am a 1:1 teaching assistant, it is impossible to do my job without getting close to the children that I work with. My DC are teenagers and although they currently aren’t at school, when they are there social distancing isn’t observed. My DH is going out to work where is mixes with external guests, social distancing and procedures are in place to keep people safe it isn’t a guarantee that he isn’t being exposed.
When my mum called to tell me her decision at the weekend, I then told her that we wouldn’t be seeing her, the reasons why and that ultimately I didn’t want to be the one to give it to her. She massively kicked off saying I was using emotional blackmail to force her to have the jab and I was selfish. When I asked her why my decision was selfish and her wasn’t, she hung up on me. I have not attempted to contact her since and she hasn’t contacted me.
AIBU to think neither me or my mum are being selfish?
So not to drip feed a child in my school bubble was found positive today after having no symptoms, child was tested after their parent tested positive during a routine test at work. I feel this shows the higher risk I have of being exposed/catching it and strengthens my point. I do wear a mask all day to try and reduce the risk.

I agree that neither of you are selfish

Neither of you is in the wrong.

Your mum is angry at the wrong thing. She should be directing her anger at the ‘unfairness’ of being at risk of both Covid and (she believes) the vaccine.

Your and anybody else’s response to her choice is not the point.

"AIBU to think neither me or my mum are being selfish?"

OP I think I'd actually say you are both being selfish, but I think you both have a right to be selfish. You don't want to be responsible for giving this to your mum. That's totally understandable.

If your mum doesn't want the vaccine, that's her call.

I'm desperate to get it so I feel it is a real shame people who are ahead of me in the line are not making the most of it.

You are both equally right in your decisions but don't let your relationship break down because of it.
Call her, tell her you love her and are not trying to blackmail her but would not survive the guilt if you passed anything on to her.
Do you think she is just frightened and once she sees friends of a similar age have the vaccine might change her mind?

@Sinful8

Meh you're obviously doing it to punish her.

Just remember shes got a lot less time to forgive than you will have to regret

What a ridiculous comment

YANBU.

We’re in a “if we visit we might kill you” situation with my 75yo DF and his partner who has COPD. They understand and are hoping to get the vaccine soon.

Haven’t really read any of the fake vaccine scare stories, but can you ask her which potential effects she is worried about? Surely not her fertility?! And, sorry to be blunt, any long term side effects will probably not show up before she died naturally anyway.

@MaskingForIt

They’re not handing out proof of vaccine certificates. Don’t be ridiculous.
Maybe they are trialling the rollout of them:
www.thesun.co.uk/news/uknews/13725069/brits-covid-jab-vaccine-passport/

My in laws are the same. Mil refusing because of her many allergies (bullsh*t). Fil refusing because he has a needle phobia.

We have seen them 3 times since March 2020, never indoors. We used to see them every Sunday! Husband and I have talked about it and decided that this will be how it is now. We won't be visiting them indoors again until this goes away because we have two school age kids that could easily give it to them. Even through we used to see them regularly, we are not close to them, and since covid they don't even call us. We call them. We are currently not calling and waiting to see how long it will be until we speak again!

I have a similar dilemma with my elderly FIL who lives alone. He has chosen not to have the vaccne. I am CV. I have said to my OH that if he goes to see his father I don't want him coming home until the rates are much reduced or I have had both vaccines (I am NHS worker in a more front line role - when I can go in, at the moment I am unable to do all of my role as risks mean I need to stay at home - so will be small number of months prob). FIL lives 6 hours away. I am not happy to expose myself to greater risk due to his choices and think he needs to think beyond the impact for him. I know vaccine does not guarantee you won't spread it but it does seem to reduce likelihood. FIL lives by himself and is very elderly and has seen no-one indoors since first lockdown so if he became poorly (again - he is not in the best of health) then DH might otherwise have gone to support him. For context even before Covid DH worked from home so he can work at FILs so this would have less impact than it would on some. I think you are absolutely within your rights to do this and hopefully as your DM calms down she will be able to understand your concerns.

Has she actually been offered it yet?

When the vaccine first came out my Dad muttered about 'waiting a couple of months' in case there were any issues. We told him not to be daft but didn't press the point. When he was offered it before Christmas he had decided for himself to have it done.....which was lucky as 20 days later he had to have a stay in hospital unexpectedly.

I know vaccine does not guarantee you won't spread it but it does seem to reduce likelihood.
Does it? Everything I have read states it is believed that, despite having the vaccine, it only prevents severe illness in the vaccinated and doesn't stop you transmitting it.

Do your parents normally have an annual flu vaccine ?

When 1000+ people per day are dying if Covid in UK alone, why refuse a vaccine ?

I wonder if a person goes into hospital for something else are they automatically given the vaccine ?

@SanguineParadise what a dumb post. The OP is not responsible for what her mother eats or her "lifestyle". If she passes COVID on to her mum she will have to live with that. She doesn't want the guilt, so her mum will have to wait for a visit. She'd have to wait at the moment anyway so she'll just have to get used to it.

You cant argue with stupid but you dont have to assist it in its folly either.

@Calmandmeasured1 what have you read? Do you have any links? All I've read is that transmission potential from vaccinated individuals is unknown.

@Porcupineintherough
It has been written in loads of articles (including tabloid press) talking of us still having to wear masks.

Other articles just say it isn't known. The following article states that neither the Pfizer nor the Moderna vaccine trials tested whether the vaccines prevent people from being infected with the virus.

www.google.com/amp/s/www.sciencenews.org/article/covid-19-coronavirus-vaccines-questions-social-distance-mask-transmission/ampneither*

Okay, so we don't know yet because it hasn't been tested. Does that mean we will only know by experience over a matter of time once a reasonable number of people are vaccinated?

I voted YABU because I can’t see what is the impact on you if she has the vaccine or not.
She is taking a risk which really is HER risk of dying, not yours.

If she was to have the vaccine, she would still be potentially contagious (vaccine might reduce the severity of covid but it doesn’t stop you from catching it and be contagious - that’s why people still need to wear a mask, have a negative covid test if they enter the country etc etc).
So what will be different FOR YOU OR YOUR FAMILY if she has the vaccine?

The potential positive effect of the vaccine is protecting those who have the jab and avoiding high levels of hospitalisation and deaths. Atm there is no proof this will also stop the epidemic and the spread of the virus.

Yep @Calmandmeasured1.

At the moment we DONT KNOW.
That’s also means that putting pressure on people to get it so they can’t infect you is undue.

Okay, so we don't know yet because it hasn't been tested. Does that mean we will only know by experience over a matter of time once a reasonable number of people are vaccinated?

That work has already commenced. Obviously the trials to test the primary purpose of the vaccine - to prevent serious illness and death - were the priority in the circumstances.

Until then, no one is saying that any of the vaccines definitely don’t prevent transmission. They are saying we don’t have data, and they are also saying it is likely (especially from the Oxford results which tested for asymptomatic infection) that all the currently approved vaccines will at least reduce transmission.

Anyone saying the vaccine doesn’t or won’t prevent transmission is talking bollocks.

At the moment we DONT KNOW.
That’s also means that putting pressure on people to get it so they can’t infect you is undue.
I agree. I think it is okay to decide not to see someone if they won't vaccinate and you fundamentally disagree with their stance, but we shouldn't put pressure on people to have it. I know that will probably feel like pressure to some but we all have to accept the decisions of others and accept that there may be consequences as a result of our decisions, as in anything in life.

(I couldn't not see my family because they didn't wish to be vaccinated though).

@JassyRadlett
I haven't read anything to say it is likely that the Oxford vaccine will reduce transmission. Do you have a link to a report?

I must admit that I would prefer the Pfizer jab due to the higher protection it affords with one dose (although appreciate I won't get a choice).

You’re definitely not unreasonable, I would feel the same way as you. Luckily my parents and in-laws are all looking forward to having their vaccines but I would take the same stance as you if one of them refused to.

No reports because, as I said, that work is still being done. There is nothing definitive.

However, here is a view from Stephen Evans from LSHTM on the subject. I’ve seen similar opinions from numerous scientists in news media in various countries over the last few weeks.

The FDA has said: A: Most vaccines that protect from viral illnesses also reduce transmission of the virus that causes the disease by those who are vaccinated. While it is hoped this will be the case, the scientific community does not yet know if the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine will reduce such transmission.

Johns Hopkins says: Although the phase 3 clinical trials are designed to determine whether vaccinated individuals are protected against disease, it will also be important to understand whether vaccinated individuals are less likely to transmit the virus. This is likely but not ensured.

My friend had to fly this week on compassionate grounds. The airline insisted on a private certificate certifying she tested negative for Covid. £360.

Hopefully they'd take proof of vaccine instead as it will be a massive expense for holidays. So I would imagine they'll start providing them. My MIL in another country is just about to have her second jab and will get a certificate stating she has had it.

For what it’s worth, the vaccines have been tested on people with different health conditions. My mum has type 1 diabetes (and numerous other health conditions!) and she was invited to take part in the Astra Zeneca testing specifically due to her diabetes.

If the vaccine is not suitable for someone, the GP will contact them to let them know. Can you persuade your mum to discuss her concerns with the GP? Hopefully they will reassure her that it’s safe for her to have and emphasise the risks if she’s doesn’t accept it.