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AIBU?

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Original poster

living off savings for 16months

233 replies

wheresmymillionaire · 26/12/2020 13:06

Just wondering what the general feeling is….
Is it fair that a self employed workers who used to earn £51k have to live off savings for 16months, whilst paye workers who earn £51k get £2.5k a month.
how can this be right? A family member used to work in the West End and is self employed. They're really struggling now. They can't even claim Universal credit as they have some online coaching work they do, but this doesn't cover their bills apparently, but stops them from getting the benefits. As I understand this, it must be wrong. What am I missing? Theatre was closed down, so why can't the actors etc be furloughed and get some money to see them through?

OP posts:
jillypill · 27/12/2020 09:45

But why aren't furloughed workers who earn over £50k asked to live off their savings?

Why would they not need to use their savings though? Take home for 50k is 3.1k, on furlough they might receive 2k. That's still a shortfall they may not be immediately able to adjust too.

vanillandhoney · 27/12/2020 09:59

@jillypill

But why aren't furloughed workers who earn over £50k asked to live off their savings?

Why would they not need to use their savings though? Take home for 50k is 3.1k, on furlough they might receive 2k. That's still a shortfall they may not be immediately able to adjust too.

You're totally missing the point.

Yes, they might need to dip into their savings, but they still get 2.5k per month through the furlough scheme, the self-employed get nothing.

jillypill · 27/12/2020 10:01

How am I missing the point?

I responded to a point about why furloughed workers aren't asked to live off savings.

jillypill · 27/12/2020 10:02

Not all SE get nothing, it depends on criteria. Plenty of employed people also have bills to pay based on previous income.

loveisagirlnameddaisy · 27/12/2020 10:03

@jillypill

How am I missing the point?

I responded to a point about why furloughed workers aren't asked to live off savings.

I don't think you are. Many people on £50k plus salaries will struggle to pay all outgoings on furlough money and will inevitably need to dip into savings.
Butchyrestingface · 27/12/2020 10:04

Not all SE get nothing, it depends on criteria

But those who earn over £51k and are self employed get nothing. And there are posters on the thread arguing the self-employed as a group should get nothing, irrespective of earnings.

Coconutmeg · 27/12/2020 10:04

There are enough gaps in support that 3 million tax payers have had nothing since March
It’s a desperately sad mess
See ExcludedUK

jillypill · 27/12/2020 10:07

But those who earn over £51k and are self employed get nothing.

And I've not said that was right however I don't think taking more away from those who are employed is the right answer & the narrative that you can't struggle because you are receiving furlough is wrong.

CuriousaboutSamphire · 27/12/2020 10:22

Huh? I think you've really missed the point there, Jilly!

Jangle33 · 27/12/2020 10:26

@wbeezer you’re a small business owner. Aren’t you eligible for grants? Owning your own business is a risk, hence the different tax treatment.If you were being paid PAYE as an employee, which is perfectly legitimate, then you would have been eligible for furlough. The tax benefits of paying via dividends at small business stage seem to have been eroded slightly as you identify.

jillypill · 27/12/2020 10:29

@CuriousaboutSamphire so all furloughed workers are not being asked to live off savings?

Coconutmeg · 27/12/2020 10:32

There are people who earn nothing like £51,000 unable to get any support

CuriousaboutSamphire · 27/12/2020 10:46

Jilly the answer to that has nothing to do with the question OP asked.

OxfordwillsaveusbyFebruary · 27/12/2020 10:46

[quote Jangle33]@wbeezer you’re a small business owner. Aren’t you eligible for grants? Owning your own business is a risk, hence the different tax treatment.If you were being paid PAYE as an employee, which is perfectly legitimate, then you would have been eligible for furlough. The tax benefits of paying via dividends at small business stage seem to have been eroded slightly as you identify.[/quote]
You are only eligible for grants here is you have bricks and mortar premises

Some councils bent the rules slightly but not many. Here they sent cash back to central government.

No other grants available. You may be able to claim CJRS if you have salaried employees on furlough.

jillypill · 27/12/2020 10:47

@CuriousaboutSamphire but I was answering that post wasn't I?

CuriousaboutSamphire · 27/12/2020 10:51

Yes. And oddly were also answering the second part of the OP.

So many trying to explain why being self employed means you are worth less than a 'properly' employed person!

jillypill · 27/12/2020 10:53

So what point did I miss?

CuriousaboutSamphire · 27/12/2020 11:01

The question

Why is it acceptable for someone who is employed, earning more than £51k to get furloughed but not a self employed person?

Many of the answers, the distractions here illustrate the thinking behind it quite nicely!

vanillandhoney · 27/12/2020 11:05

@jillypill

So what point did I miss?
That furloughed workers who earn 51k still get 2.5k per month, and self-employed workers who earn 51k are eligible for absolutely nothing.

So again, if the self-employed earn 'too much to qualify for help' why does that not apply to employed workers?

vanillandhoney · 27/12/2020 11:07

you’re a small business owner. Aren’t you eligible for grants?

In my area, you're only eligible for grants if you own a bricks and mortar business. So if you work outside the home as say, a dog walker, a mobile hairdresser or similar, you can't apply for any grants.

LoveMyKidsAndCats · 27/12/2020 11:13

If they are not eligable it's because they earn too much / have plenty of savings that they could use to support themself.

vanillandhoney · 27/12/2020 11:20

@LoveMyKidsAndCats

If they are not eligable it's because they earn too much / have plenty of savings that they could use to support themself.
Why doesn't the same restriction apply to employed workers then?

Why does an employed worker on 100k (plus) still get 2.5k a month on furlough, but someone who earns the same on a self-employed basis gets nothing?

Is the self-employed person not worth the same amount of help for some reason?

CuriousaboutSamphire · 27/12/2020 11:23

So... an employee cannot earn too much but a self employed person can?

jillypill · 27/12/2020 11:26

So you can only comment on the OP and not other points? I never said it was acceptable.

jillypill · 27/12/2020 11:28

That furloughed workers who earn 51k still get 2.5k per month, and self-employed workers who earn 51k are eligible for absolutely nothing.

Nope, I didn't miss that. The point I responded too was about using savings. And again not every furloughed employer is accessing the 100% figure so you can't state that as fact.