Is anyone applying actual LOGIC to Christmas or just blindly following covid rules??

[Christmasisallaroundus]

I’m not changing my Christmas plans. I’m due to go to my parents 50 mins drive away. Myself & DH WFH full time. No DC. We’ve been isolating for 2 weeks in advance of Christmas. We are getting private covid tests on 21st - waiting for presumably negative results on 23rd then will travel home. Parents also not working and have been isolating pretty much since March. Will be home 24th-27th. No plans to leave the house. Then straight back to our house to isolate again for the foreseeable as no plans to see anyone.

Why would we change our plans and not go just because ‘it’s against the rules’. I don’t understand those saying they can’t go how due to rules changing.

If you are working out and about you shouldn’t have been mixing in the 1st place as you’re higher risk! Why are the rules influencing what you do - surely you should be using common sense!

Because society relies on people complying with rules that aren't about the individual.

Because not everyone is in the same situation as you.

Others haven't been fully isolating and aren't able to afford private tests so should be sticking to the new rules.

Surely thats just common sense

You're brave to post but fwiw I completely agree with you. The rules are there to stop people catching and spreading covid so if you aren't doing that and you're sure about it then I reckon fill your boots. This is true on an individual level. People however will say things like - yes but if everyone thought that then there'd be a problem, you're setting a bad example etc, which is also true...

@DifficultPifcultLemonDifficult Others haven't been fully isolating and aren't able to afford private tests so should be sticking to the new rules.

Those people shouldn’t have been planning to see family in the first place - that would be common sense.

A simple check - can I guarantee I’m not going to pass it on - if answer is no they shouldn’t have been planning to mix in the 1st place.

I’m not saying it’s fair - it’s absolutely not. I am aware I’m very privileged to be in the position on in.

I just don’t understand people who are like me and WFH and safe changing their plans now that ‘the rules’ are different and on the flip side that those who are obviously risky were planning to see family and mix until ‘the rules’ told them they couldn’t.

Following the rules

Dh works in a school - a complete Covid hotbed

We'd be right cunts if we didn't follow the rules considering what we may be carrying

Everyone should behave as if they have the virus said Vallance today

What is law is not always morally right.
What is morally right is not always law.

I'n with you op.

The premise that we are all part of a society which relies on following rules designed to benefit others is a monumental assumption. There is no evidence that everyone is willing to make indefinite sacrifices to their personal freedom in order to benefit others. Its misguided to believe in it.

I can't believe this post

Those people shouldn’t have been planning to see family in the first place - that would be common sense.

So nurses, supermarket workers, taxi drivers etc shouldn't have planned to see family as per the rules at the time?

Or do you think socialising and family is only for those who can afford to 100% self isolate and get private tests done.

We are getting private covid tests on 21st - waiting for presumably negative results on 23rd then will travel home

Will these be PCR tests or rapid lateral flow? Presumably because of the 2 day wait for results they are PCR tests.

If you have really been completely isolating for 2 weeks and are getting PCR tests then the risk of passing anything on is extremely low.

BUT how are you doing the tests? If you have to travel somewhere to take the test then that's your isolation over. Unless it's a drive through (which private ones aren't) you are going to have to walk into a building full of people.

You've admitted that you're in a privileged position.
Suggest you walk away now.
I've not seen my very frail mum since June. Before that, last Christmas.
I work in a school, no PPE, so I can't see my mum. She's 200 miles away. I'm now in Tier 4.

@LaurieFairyCake Dh works in a school - a complete Covid hotbed

So your Christmas plans should be staying at home in your immediate family - regardless of what the rules are.

This is my point. Why on earth were people in your DH position planning to see family before ‘the rules’ said they couldn’t.

It’s unsafe and logic and common sense should have told you that.

If you are working out and about you shouldn’t have been mixing in the 1st place as you’re higher risk!

Well I'm not mixing. But thanks for the total lack of empathy for those of us who have worked the entire pandemic out of the home, keeping the world running. Happy to help.

There’s a difference between the things you do because you’re worried about the consequences to your immediate family and the things you might do out of a more general sense of obligation to society. I’m probably going to visit a physically and emotionally vulnerable elderly relative, having taken, like you, all conceivable precautions. If I had DC at school, or I was a hospital porter then there’s no way on earth I’d have been going, regardless of the legality.

However if we’d been planning to visit much younger relatives, knowing that none of us were particularly vulnerable, then maybe we wouldn’t have been quite so cautious, maybe we’d have been limited not by our own risk management but by the laws put in place to protect our local shopkeepers/workmates/teachers.

Because rules aren't made with individuals in mind but for the benefit of the collective. Surely it's very logical, say you have three kids you don't make decisions based on one kid but for the overall good of the family as a whole.

It may not make sense to you and your individual circumstances and that's okay, but people talk about logic as though it's obvious but logic requires removing personal feeling and bias and looking at the situation in a purely practical way.

We weren't

We have never been going anywhere

Absolutely in your situation I would go to.

If you have been 100% isolating for 2 weeks then there is no risk

I agree, OP.

I suppose it's the unexpected that we can't plan for. You don't mention tiers. Assuming 'home' is tier 4- If you had emergency plumbers in while you are staying, that's four people exposed instead of two, and two of them potentially taking it to a new area.

I do understand your broad point. I've collected my very elderly mother and brought her home, otherwise she'd have a pretty lonely Christmas fortnight. She's also probably safer here. We've seen- and will see- no one else, one of us works outside the home, we've been to a shop, that's about it.

I'm not totally sure we fall within the rules, mainly because she hasn't self isolated for ten days before coming- but she's already here. I'm worrying now about how to get her home!

[quote Christmasisallaroundus]**@LaurieFairyCake* Dh works in a school - a complete Covid hotbed*

So your Christmas plans should be staying at home in your immediate family - regardless of what the rules are.

This is my point. Why on earth were people in your DH position planning to see family before ‘the rules’ said they couldn’t.

It’s unsafe and logic and common sense should have told you that.[/quote]
On the flip side though, what difference would it make to see one extra family on top of the 100s of families of the children we teach?

@Christmasisallaroundus

So basically you’re happy for others to take the risks on your behalf so you and your parents don’t have to go out and can isolate at home without having to go anywhere and then can have a nice Christmas?

Do you realise how that comes across?

We'll see if the politicians obey Ebenezer Johnson's roolz. Will they all behave impeccably, and stay at home? Will the prime minister sack those who visit their relatives on Christmas Day?

Have a lovely Christmas!

I agree completely with you.

Having been through the Melbourne lockdown, my opinion is following the rules is important even when you know your not at risk or a risk. When people see others out and about, it lessens the effectiveness of the lockdown.

People start justifying breaking the rules, and people start making stupid decisions. Conversely when everyone stays home and the shops are empty it’s harder for people to justify breaking the rules to themselves. It’s less about the risk and more about a unity.

@LaurieFairyCake well there you go - you didn’t need ‘the rules’ to tell you what to do. I know I’m not risking anything going home as I’ve been able to take precautions so again it doesn’t take ‘the rules’ to tell me

I suppose this is a bit of a TAAT which I know is bad but so many threads saying ‘we’ve had to cancel Christmas now because of the rule change’ when really it shouldn’t be impacting on people as those risky should have been staying home anyway and those safe can technically still go ( I know there will be grey areas of safe) but I’m just surprised so many are only doing or not doing something because of this last minute rule change.

Don’t get me wrong I have been following all rules. Isolating wasn’t a hardship as we see no one anyway - just needed to order our shopping instead of the weekly visit to the shop. But I don’t get why people weren’t making decisions based on logic and common sense in general.

Maybe that’s why the rules are needed if those working in risky positions were planning to mix over Christmas even though they know they’re risky!