We’re going to lose everything..

[Worriednow77]

Are we going to end up with nothing, as a country? No businesses will be left and where will the money come from to fund us all?
Wuhan and other countries look practically back to normal, with no vaccine. Why are we having the vaccine but also being told social distancing etc won’t end? What’s the point?! What’s the plan...I feel like we’re all just drifting into something

And how is Wuhan back to normal with no vaccine?

Because they had a serious, long lockdown which drove numbers down to a very low number and established a proper system to make sure they didn't creep back up.

If we didn't bother with social distancing it wouldn't be a magic pill to get businesses going again. As soon as hospitals got full and people started dying in corridors people wouldn't be piling into pubs anymore.

I know someone who works at a large UNI and all the Chinese students have come back saying they had a vaccine and cant understand why the UK is as it is.

But we have to sell something or we won't actually have an income as a country.

But we will still be selling stuff, it will be more expensive to import from the EU if we are operating under WTO terms which will make home produced stuff seem more reasonably priced and it will be shit particularly for low income families but we're certainly not going to 'lose everything' as the OP is saying. I have great sympathy for people who have lost their jobs/businesses this year but to imply that everybody is in that position is just mad.

Anyway, as Marsha says this is basically a doom monger thread so I'll get my coat.

The biggest issue for us is that we do not seek to drive cases down into single digits before releasing a lockdown so all we do is reduce the numbers a bit. Look at how quickly the effects of the most recent lockdown have faded away.

If you still have thousands of cases a day and they then go back into circulation then, not surprisingly, cases tick up again. The government knows this (or ought to) but has to walk a tightrope trying to balance keeping some sort of control on numbers with placating the "wanna go shopping/visit my relatives/go on holiday/have fewer restrictions" crowd.

I do believe that by the end of 2021 things will look different as we should have a good chunk of the population vaccinated by then.

Whilst some businesses are struggling, some businesses are undoubtedly doing very well. Have you tried to get a builder or plumber or tradesman of any kind recently? I'm trying to organise a house move and had to ring over a dozen removal firms to find one which was not fully booked even with plenty of notice. We see the newsworthy problems in the press, we don't see the businesses which are largely unaffected.

wait until Brexit kicks in

The most pessimist projections didn't take Covid into account (obviously).

Let's wait and see what eye watering levels of contributions will be required from Germany, France and the UK in order to right covid stricken European economies, before we declare this timing of Brexit a disaster...for the UK.

a PP got me excited 75% off John Lewis clothing - the world is coming to an end. Well I went on and couldnt see anything at 75% at Sweaty Betty? There are a few 10-15% some beauty products but I wish people will stop dramatising things.

We will hopefully get the Oxford vaccine approved but some wont take it and presumably will take their chances with Cv19. I will take it when offered but that wont be until well into next year.

Yes, the media is doing its usual scaremongering and putting the fear of God into some people but we will get through it, holidays will return, schools will go back to normal and masks will become a thing of the past

I'm more worried about Brexit, which our wonderful government is forcing on us in the worst way possible so that their pals can asset strip the country. The effects of Brexit will be way worse than the effects of Covid.
The pals of the government are making a packet out of Covid too. According to some American research, £11 billion has gone to friends of the Tories - solely because they are friends of the Tories. They had no previous experience of producing PPE and were expressly allowed to overcharge.

Apologies, definitely not trying to be pessimistic, but genuinely cannot see how lockdowns etc are being allowed to continue with what this is doing to the country

But if lockdowns had been done properly the country wouldn’t be in this mess.

TooManyDogs - I agree. Having just had an extension built and trades in and out for the last 6 months. They have never been busier and are now able to pick and choose who they do work for.

I think are there some people who are just never happy, even when good things happen they still moan and complain about their lot in life.

Well, was life perfect before- the disparity between rich and poor, north and south, drug issues, knife crime, immigration allowed to have a detrimental effect on the poor whilst rich got their cheap staff, racism, misogyny, people trafficking, left wing bias ( or right wing bias if you are left wing, obesity, 0 hour contracts , not caring for the environment - a perfect world
We have a chance to reset the balance on much of this, British people are entrepreneurial, well enough educated, imaginative - if we stop squabbling for long enough we could make a go of this - ok maybe less disposable income, fewer hols abroad but it needs to be could be a more caring inclusive country if we worked at it.

Prediction is a mug's game.

We are going through a massive change, lots of people are hurting now. For every grim prediction that I have read on this thread I have thought: well, yes, but then again....

We still have lots of advantages to build on. Despite the shock of 2020, lots of UK businesses are booming right now and will bring new employment.

Comparisons with other countries is also a mug's game.

So Germany or China seem to be managing better. Wotcha gonna do about it? It's too early to call who had a "good war". A different UK government could have made different mistakes, who knows? Don't waste your energy with what ifs.

There is no crystal ball. It remains possible that we will pull ourselves out of this hole and fare better in the future.

There may be all sorts of good indirect consequences: great medical advances, cooperation between nations, better preparation for climate change, new drugs for wide ranging conditions, vaccine programmes for developing nations, alleviation of global suffering.

If that sounds ridiculously optimistic, consider it a riposte to the ridiculously apocalyptic predictions of gloom and doom. Let's just see. Take each day as it comes.

So you want us to work more like China yes? I suggest you research China and their human rights records and then come back to the thread. There is a reason the people listen and obey the government.

It's lovely if you can afford an extension, but loads of people have lost their homes.

But if lockdowns had been done properly the country wouldn’t be in this mess.

Define ‘properly’? Spain had a very harsh lockdown, didn’t do them any good in the longer term.

The difference with some Asian countries was their track and trace capabilities. But EU data protection laws don’t lend themselves to the kind of surveillance of the population that would make this properly effective.

The best thing the UK can do now is concentrate on fast, smart rollout of the vaccine. The measures that worked elsewhere were never going to be a particularly good fit for our society and in most cases it’s too late now anyway.

loads of people have lost their homes

Really?

This time next year we will be a Third World country.

Things aren’t great but I’d suggest anyone saying this is as thick as the super pro Brexit types. Get a grip.

@Justcallmebebes

"And how is Wuhan back to normal with no vaccine"?

Because when they had lockdown they had a proper, no messing about lockdown. We had lockdown unless you wanted to go shopping, or for a walk or fancied a trip to Spain. That's the difference

And they also kept very quiet, deliberately in my opinion, to allow the infection to get into other countries. I think their stance was "If we suffer, everyone is going to suffer". This is an attack upon the economies of the west. I don't think it was deliberately engineered, but it was certainly facilitated by silence.

@macaroniinapot

*This time next year we will be a Third World country.*

Things aren’t great but I’d suggest anyone saying this is as thick as the super pro Brexit types. Get a grip.

I wish people would think before typing the hyperbole in the above quote.

It’s just smashing extremes into a keyboard.

@GoWokeGoBroke - do you have any of the risk factors for Covid-19? Elderly, Obese or on the official vulnerable list? If you don't why are you announcing that you won't take the vaccine? Nobody is even offering it to you. You are so far down the list of being offered it that announcing it on a thread is bizarre. I probably won't have a flu vaccine next year. I don't announce that. If you are vulnerable to Covid then best of luck and I hope you don't try to shield when the UK gets back to normal.

I would suggest anyone who is praising China’s approach and asking why Wuhan are back to normal, do some reading about life in China, politics, human rights and how the Wuhan lockdown compared to ours.

@Worriednow77

And how is Wuhan back to normal with no vaccine?

Well I imagine living in a country where everything is completely controlled by the state helps.

But we have to sell something or we won't actually have an income as a country.

I fell down an internet rabbit hole because I’ve been watching The Crown and was intrigued by season 2 episode 6 where the character Tommy is showing to Queen Elizabeth this massive table top which has the battle of Salamanca laid out on it with literally a thousand miniature soldiers.
Anyway, according to the rabbit hole, apparently the U.K. is the world leader/centre for table top war gaming and only one of its many companies, Games Workshop, brings in more money to the U.K. than the entire U.K. fishing industry! I was shocked to read that and it got me wondering why on earth does the media constantly talk about U.K. fishing rights, waters and industry when it is a teeny tiny fish relatively speaking in terms of its contribution to the U.K. economy.

‘Well enough educated’ are you sure?

I work with a researcher at a local uni. We’ve done lots on Brexit.

The defining factor in the whole remain/ leave thing was educational level. The higher the education the more likelihood of voting remain.