We’re going to lose everything..

[Worriednow77]

Are we going to end up with nothing, as a country? No businesses will be left and where will the money come from to fund us all?
Wuhan and other countries look practically back to normal, with no vaccine. Why are we having the vaccine but also being told social distancing etc won’t end? What’s the point?! What’s the plan...I feel like we’re all just drifting into something

@RedToothBrush We could pay our low paid workers to stay at home. The fact we never did is a mystery. Singapore did that from the start.

@RedToothBrush a lot of our lowest paid workers don't qualify for furlough. my SIL who was doing tutoring certainly didn't. Thankfully she can do it via webcam but for those uber drivers, many would be forced to choose between eating and isolating...

@Worriednow77

And how is Wuhan back to normal with no vaccine?

Considering they took months to tell us about it in the first place, and only stopped hushing it up when it was so out of hand they couldn't control it any more, are we to believe everything they say without question?

@RedToothBrush www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/17/uber-driver-dies-from-covid-19-after-hiding-it-over-fear-of-eviction

Stuff like this is utterly sad and ridiculous and one of the reasons why covid rates are so high. They are always higher in the poorer areas where there are more people who have such precarious finances and then of course they spread it to all the people they come into contact with.

The government covered a lot of middle class households with the furlough scheme and that helped save the housing market, but they forgot about the poor who are the most risky as many are in high contact roles. And most of them are self employed.

It may surprise a lot of you but not everyone is China is unhappily oppressed and hate their lives under a "dictatorial" government. People enjoy the same things like going out to eat, shopping, internet memes, meeting friends and family. Many hated lockdown just as much as anyone else but accepted the high level of surveillance and got on with it. There's a Chinese concept called "eating bitterness" which roughly equates to noble suffering, and people learn to endure tough times and withhold complaints even if the suffering seems unjust or makes no sense. And now that life is back to normal, people see it as a collective triumph even if they didn't enjoy or agree with the government's measures.

The white saviour complex makes it so easy to trot out half-truths that you read somewhere online without proof (like the one about people getting their doors welded shut) to make it seem like you're still living in the better place. Look around at the "best" countries in the world right now. USA, UK, Europe. Everything is out of control, people have lost trust in their government, almost every country is entering a third lockdown over Christmas and the economy is collapsing. No-deal Brexit will be the final nail in the coffin. If I could have a choice I would definitely prefer living in China right now.

What does spouting insults about other countries help at this point in time? Does the moral reassurance that you're a better person living in a better country make you feel satisfied while your fellow citizens are dying in astronomical numbers, losing their jobs & homes, healthcare overwhelmed and helpless governments unable to control anything anymore?

Here's good article on the topic: eand.co/its-not-vaccine-nationalism-it-s-vaccine-racism-9d3dbb9160fe

they forgot about the poor
I don't they forgot more likely deliberately overlooked them because those who are already struggling and oppressed have less energy to complain and make their voices heard

Eating bitterness sounds a lot like do as you're told and trust the authoritarian government?
Id probably eat bitterness if the alternative was a concentration camp!

Considering they took months to tell us about it in the first place, and only stopped hushing it up when it was so out of hand they couldn't control it any more, are we to believe everything they say without question?

That’s not true. China notified the WHO very early on. When there had only been a few deaths and less than two dozen cases. You forget this virus presents very similar to numerous other already known corona viruses.

@PlanDeRaccordement

Considering they took months to tell us about it in the first place, and only stopped hushing it up when it was so out of hand they couldn't control it any more, are we to believe everything they say without question?

That’s not true. China notified the WHO very early on. When there had only been a few deaths and less than two dozen cases. You forget this virus presents very similar to numerous other already known corona viruses.

What was the situation with the Dr that did the video? Was he suppressed I can’t recall do you know?

Look around at the "best" countries in the world right now. USA, UK, Europe. Everything is out of control, people have lost trust in their government, almost every country is entering a third lockdown over Christmas and the economy is collapsing. No-deal Brexit will be the final nail in the coffin. If I could have a choice I would definitely prefer living in China right now.

And that’s fine. Can you move? I prefer here warts and all but some will feel so negatively towards where they live it’s best to emigrate.

@CrystalPuff
Good post. Many posters on here are just repeating fake news hoaxes that circulated widely on social media as if it were fact. These posters obviously have never even set foot in China and think they know how life was/is there.

@thriftyhen

I run an online business and sales are phenomenal. My DH is an expert in his field and this is his busiest year ever. My eldest DS has taken on an extra job with a wine distributor and they are run off their feet. So while many businesses have suffered, others have boomed.

This is nice to hear and I am happy for you.

I often feel very down, in the style of OP. I don’t see an end to social distancing for the foreseeable, which is depressing. Theatres, the opera, ballet etc are all suffering immensely along with so many other industries. The high street will die and taxes are going to go through the roof. This generation of children will be missing out on so many opportunities within competitive sports, dance and art, not to mention social events. None of this can go ahead as long as social distancing is imposed on us.

@Yohoheaveho i am sure people in taiwan, south korea, singapore did not fear being dragged into a concentration camp. the first 2 are democracies, and singapore is so tiny that I am sure we would have noticed if there was a concentration camp.

Eating bitterness is very Confucian. what these countries have in common is confucian ethics, which prioritizes respect for authority. Western societies are more individualistic. Unfortunately, the virus doesn't care about individual rights.

Taiwan did do well but it also implemented infrastructure after SARS. This took time and cost money. So we could have done pre pandemic planning whilst Brexit was going on on the off chance we’d have one.

Indeed.

I think that the government has lost control of pretty much everything and Brexit will simply add to the misery.

There are still too many people believing in the fairy tale that these repeat lockdowns achieve anything beyond killing the economy and driving us all slowly mad....

The UK population has been too passive and it is high time we start questioning what this hapless government is doing. There is no excuse for the fact that our testing and tracking/tracing system are such a shamble months into the epidemic.

Rather than messing about with more lockdowns and useless tiers they need to speed-up mass vaccination and let those of us who are less likely to suffer badly if we get the virus get on with life and business.

As for social distancing, if like me you live in London you would have seen that the last lockdown was barely followed and that a large number of people are done with following many of these nonsensical rules so the rise in cases is not going to stop.

It is nonsensical to think that people are going to live without human contacts for months on end. This is the most basic need that we have as human beings, to touch/speak to/love others...It might be easy on those who have kids/a partner but the majority will just go insane. Humans are not made to be hermits. Certainly not for a virus that as something like a 98% survival rates and an average age for deaths of 82...

@hopingforonlychild I am well aware of this issue.

I've made the same point myself on another thread today myself before your posts...

Authority should be questioned and held accountable not automatically deferred to ....I don't think I agree with confucian ethics

@MarshaBradyo
You are probably referring to the whistleblower, Dr. WenLiang. He was one of first to realise it was a new virus. In December, he went on a group chat with other medics to talk about what appeared to be a new virus. He was then detained by police a few days later and accused of spreading false rumours. He had to sign a document to that effect which was a reprimand. He then went back to work, caught the virus in January and died in February. China then in March investigated the whole situation and exonerated him.

But this reprimand by local police is not a case of the Chinese government doing a cover up for months. As they first notified WHO of Covid in late December, only a week or so after this local police reprimand happened to the Dr. Whistleblowers often are disbelieved and subjected to reprimand, loss of employment, etc. in any country when they first speak out. It’s a shame, but it’s not unheard of.

www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/20/chinese-inquiry-exonerates-coronavirus-whistleblower-doctor-li-wenliang

Plan thanks for your insight that us very sad, especially since he died.

But when you say this can happen anywhere, I don’t think this would happen here?

Li had posted to a group chat with other medics about some patients showing signs of a new Sars-like illness in early December, well before Chinese authorities admitted to the outbreak of a novel coronavirus.

Police detained Li a few days later for “spreading false rumours” and forced him to sign a police document admitting that he had “seriously disrupted social order” and breached the law.

I mean the police detainment part. I see now you meant unemployment so perhaps we agree it differs.

@Yohoheaveho its a balance- they prioritize social harmony. However, from the many dynasties in China and bloody uprisings, it does show that not everyone would submit to authority at a certain point. The CCP has lasted thus far in China despite opening up is because most Chinese people have experienced a huge increase in living standards. and they can see it will continue--- in my lifetime, most British cities and towns will be poorer than Shanghai and any tier 1 or even tier 2 Chinese City perhaps with the exception of London, SE and Edinburgh. & they would rather have that than western style freedoms.

Meanwhile in the UK, we have freedom to pick our own government but at the same time, the government knows that it can lose power at any point so it takes very short term decisions- For example, the tories are always so avid in awarding contracts to their cronies so that they can get donations for the next election. We also only have one of two choices in this country- labour or conservative so in a way, no real change can happen

Pros and cons. I do agree that I prefer a democracy but a flawed democracy like the UK is no picnic either. in some ways, we have the worst of both worlds. we don't have real voter power and we have the stunted economic growth that comes from short termist government.

we have the stunted economic growth that comes from short termist government

We have a good economy considering our relative size. What economic growth do you want?

Which country would you like to be more like in terms of speed of growth?

I think the fall out from this, and a no deal brexit, will be worse than the 2nd world war.

  Amnesia?  or not paying attention in history lessons?

@MarshaBradyo Even the US had higher economic growth than us pre covid; 2.3 % vs 1.4%. Canada and Australia also did better. I think the country is unequal,London and SE has most of the growth. I am not complaining as a londoner but its not good for the rest of the country.

Also with no deal brexit, the future economic projections are not good. Again borne out of a wish by David Cameron to keep short term order in his party which plunged the country into chaos

This country doesn’t feel like a good place to live right now. Covid response has been a joke. And now Brexit - don’t get me started.

Honestly? If I had another passport or a work offer in another country, I’d leave - but I don’t! So I have no choice but to stick it out!