To find drag queens offensive?

[MrsMummy500]

AIBU to find drag queens really bloody offensive?

I hate the term offensive, it’s bandied around far too often at far too insignificant things (am aware this may be one of them). BUT, men dressing up as some fetishised version of a man made ideal of a woman really pisses me off. Hyper hair, max make up, drink in hand, revealing clothes.

I do not know a single woman like that. It riles me and I feel like I’m unable to express it as women have lost so much of their space to LGBTQ+ community (I perceive this, I don’t say it as a fact).
potential bomb drop alert but if white people are taken down (rightly IMO) for ‘blacking up’ should it be acceptable for men to parody women in the form of drag queens.

Ps- I do not buy for one minute that they are celebrating the female form with balloon breasts. It feels more like a piss take.

Men wearing dressed and heels is not enforcing a gender stereotype.

Of course it's not. When they refer to themselves as men. Which drag queens dont.

Men wearing dressed and heels is not enforcing a gender stereotype.

It is when they are saying they are a woman whilst doing so.

*But how does that work?

The vibe on this thread is far more that as PP have dictated that it's offensive , going as far as to say that all women must be against it , the two of us who said we don't find it as offensive as other stereotypes are wrong.

You're defending the wrong group here
*

Heres how it works. As you rightly pointed out, lots of PP have said they find it offensive, a small minority said they don't find it offensive. I'm not saying all women must find it offensive for it to be offensive, simply a majority.

So therefore, by going off opinions on this thread, Drag should be seen as offensive, as should homophobia and racism.

It doesnt matter if it's not as offensive. That wasnt the OPs question. She asked if it was offensive. I mean if I saw homophobia as less offensive than racism, does that make homophobia OK? No. It would just be my opinion.

I've taught gender stereotypes as part of my subject.

Thats very worrying considering you seems to have either no knowledge of what gender stereotypes are or chose to deny them at your own discretion. Not that there's really a need to qualify 'gender' with 'stereotypes', gender is the personification of sex-based stereotypes.

I find it offensive. Always have even as a kid didn’t like the pantomime dame vibe. Seems obvious to me from a young age it’s men taking the piss out of women and all the rationalising I have read doesn’t change my view. Also don’t see why it’s different to blackface it’s obviously the same. .

@BrumBoo

I've taught gender stereotypes as part of my subject.

Thats very worrying considering you seems to have either no knowledge of what gender stereotypes are or chose to deny them at your own discretion. Not that there's really a need to qualify 'gender' with 'stereotypes', gender is the personification of sex-based stereotypes.

You will excuse me if I don't worry myself daft over my abilities based on a comment on a stranger over the internet.

And that's not what gender is.

In regards to your first point I never actually answered the OPs question. This debate in recent pages has been about whether it is as offensive as blackface and I don't believe it is. My opinion. And you might not have said all women must find it offensive , but PP did.

And that's not what gender is.

You're the expert, please explain what it is then.

Sorry @BananasBananas I misread that. The second part of my post is to you. The first part is to @BrumBoo.

'I've taught gender stereotypes as part of my subject.'

'Thats very worrying considering you seems to have either no knowledge of what gender stereotypes are or chose to deny them at your own discretion'

Yes how on earth does one teach something they clearly know nothing about.

@BrumBoo

And that's not what gender is.

You're the expert, please explain what it is then.

How can I when I have no knowledge or deny it at discretion? Too big an ask for an idiot like me im afraid.

@GetOffYourHighHorse

'I've taught gender stereotypes as part of my subject.'

'Thats very worrying considering you seems to have either no knowledge of what gender stereotypes are or chose to deny them at your own discretion'

Yes how on earth does one teach something they clearly know nothing about.

How on earth indeed. Il pop my resignation in the post instantly.

@MsTSwift

I find it offensive. Always have even as a kid didn’t like the pantomime dame vibe. Seems obvious to me from a young age it’s men taking the piss out of women and all the rationalising I have read doesn’t change my view. Also don’t see why it’s different to blackface it’s obviously the same. .

I agree , and I don't like panto dames.

Doesn't change my view that it's not comparable to black face.

@GetOffYourHighHorse

'Too big an ask for an idiot like me im afraid.'

At last, some self awareness.

What can I say, you've inspired me.

How can I when I have no knowledge or deny it at discretion? Too big an ask for an idiot like me im afraid.

@Wheresmykimchi you corrected me on saying that gender is the personification of sex based stereotypes, you can at least explain why I'm wrong after having a go at others for telling you you're wrong without discussing the matter.

@BrumBoo

How can I when I have no knowledge or deny it at discretion? Too big an ask for an idiot like me im afraid.

@Wheresmykimchi you corrected me on saying that gender is the personification of sex based stereotypes, you can at least explain why I'm wrong after having a go at others for telling you you're wrong without discussing the matter.

I could, but I'm not going to to people who have told me it's worrying I'm teaching something I know nothing about. Youl excuse me if I'm not brimming with willingness to engage .

@Wheresmykimchi, its very odd how you've been so defensive on this thread, yet when asking you to clarify something you apparently teach you avoid the question? Do you actually have a explanation as to what gender is or not?

[quote BrumBoo]@Wheresmykimchi, its very odd how you've been so defensive on this thread, yet when asking you to clarify something you apparently teach you avoid the question? Do you actually have a explanation as to what gender is or not?[/quote]
There you go again with your odd and your apparently.

I won't be bullied into answering anything I don't want to when I feel cornered. So think what you like. The answer is no.

I just find it utterly boring 🤷‍♀️

They are enforcing stereotypes! This is the crux of the issue, you say you see why women can find it offensive, then say this!

Or you can see it as breaking stereotypes as in what a man should or shouldn't wear, which I'm pretty sure the poster meant.

@Wheresmykimchi sorry, but it is odd. You have come back to most posts here with your own opinion, using examples of why you disagree and defending your point. The moment a poster asks you to clarify something you apparently actually know about, teach about, you suddenly hide away like it's a big secret you can't divulge? If you have the answer to why gender ideology isnt just borne out of societal stereotypes of how people believe men and women act, perhaps people would get a different view on why men feel they can 'act' like women.

@Quaagars

They are enforcing stereotypes! This is the crux of the issue, you say you see why women can find it offensive, then say this!

Or you can see it as breaking stereotypes as in what a man should or shouldn't wear, which I'm pretty sure the poster meant.

Men can wear whatever they want, dresses, makeup, handbags the lot. It's when they appropriate the idea of 'woman' that the issues arise. They're not doing it as men who are breaking the mould, they're doing it as pretend women.

[quote BrumBoo]@Wheresmykimchi sorry, but it is odd. You have come back to most posts here with your own opinion, using examples of why you disagree and defending your point. The moment a poster asks you to clarify something you apparently actually know about, teach about, you suddenly hide away like it's a big secret you can't divulge? If you have the answer to why gender ideology isnt just borne out of societal stereotypes of how people believe men and women act, perhaps people would get a different view on why men feel they can 'act' like women.[/quote]
It's not a secret ,I just don't want to engage with posters who take it as far as insulting my abilities in my job. I think that's over the line. And as mad as it might sound to the likes of you and @GetOff who use bullying and personal tactics to win an argument , I don't answer to you.

Hate how they use the terms fishy, and names like cheryl hole and Anna Bortion, Malestia Child, Anna B Frank. It's just male entitlement again to say and do as they please.

@Wheresmykimchi, so you don't actually have an answer. OK, I mean it's quite a strange thing to both claim you know/teach then get weirdly angry about when asked to explain futher, but that's entirely your perogative. Anyone who actually does have a sound answer about these things are usually quite happy to explain it, especially if it proves someone wrong.

I dont blame you though, everyone I ask to explain gender without resorting to 'people believe' and 'insert x stereotypes here' usually go quiet very quickly.