To feel like we are only just surviving feed to feed- 3 week old twins

[coralpig]

I’ll try and keep this brief (have posted before) we are really really struggling to build up any semblance of a routine and I am totally knocked for six:

Context:

• planned pregnancy although nobody plans twins. They were due to be born at 37+1 by ELCS but I only made it to 36+5. Went into labour- was having very intense contractions in the operating theatre and had an EMCS - outcome was two healthy and beautiful boys.
• end of pregnancy I developed severe obstetric cholestasis and was getting little to no sleep from horrific itching and burning hands and feet. This last about 3 weeks. Both my allocated midwives were on leave at the same time. I felt alone.
• they were very sleepy at birth and didn’t latch or do anything useful on the breast. I had pre expressed a lot of colostrum and this meant my milk came in very early and there was lots of it! I was told to express at every feed and they had lots of breast milk top ups but still lost quite a lot of weight. We ended up having nearly daily midwife visits at home and I found them super stressful. Due to lockdown and difficult pregnancy I hadn’t left the house in my many many weeks and wanted to go for a walk but they didn’t give us a time slot so I had to wait in all day. We got discharged from midwives at day 17.
• one midwife suggested an intensive formula programme with huge quantities and they couldn’t cope- went floppy and sleepy and we ended up in hospital for the night. They had still lost weight- I couldn’t believe it.
• eventually they started to gain but I started to really struggle- when one twin cries and gets something wants it too. So difficult.
• my bleeding also massively increased and I called the hospital and the gp who told me I was probably just doing too much and it was normal. I had an allergic reaction to my section dressing and came out in a skin rash and I got a uti but put this down to the twins and the breastfeeding cycle. They were cluster feeding and I struggled to tandem. I was knackered but didn’t think much of it. I also started getting shivers.
• DH and I weren’t getting on and at each other all the time.
• last week I suddenly got very shivery and couldn’t get out of bed- suspected covid- temperature was very high 38.5. Booked covid test but friend recommended calling maternity who invited me in when I shared my other symptoms. My heart rate was sky high -144- and I was clearly not well. It was sepsis. They admitted me straight away and put me on a drip and iv antibiotics. I was back on postnatal and too unwell to have babies there. It was a traumatic stay and there was an empty cot in the room. The staff were lovely but I wish I’d asked them to remove the cot- I was very poorly and they were unsure of the source of infection- my body was not responding to the antibiotics and I felt terrible- shivery- couldn’t even have the radio on. I’m normally quite fit and well. I cried a lot missing babies. They found a blood clot in my womb that they suspect was infected or that I had a lining infection. They consented me for a D&C and then cancelled it. Next day took me for an MVA then sent me home on tablets. I’m better than I was physically but get very very tired and also still quite traumatised.
• one thing that really affected me is being so weak I couldn’t get out of bed or brush my teeth but having to express milk or leaking milk all over my bed and hospital gain while talking to the doctors. I’ve decided to stop breastfeeding and think it’s right though it’s sad to do it like this.
• I am trying to tail of my supply- I am soaking through my clothes with milk it’s horrible
• I’m on the list to be seen my talking therapies
• an incomplete root canal due to lockdown means I need a tooth extracted. It was meant to be this week but I was in hospital and there are no appointments for weeks.

——— Issue now is that after this shaky start, we are really struggling to establish any sort of routine. Boys are formal fed and thriving but we are just surviving feed to feed and we don’t do anything but feed, change and sleep. When they are down I have a choice to do jobs in the house, shower or sleep. There’s often only a few minutes respite as they’re not in sync and are both demanding and sicky. Now they’re getting more alert I’m desperate to introduce playmat time (tried this last night and they enjoyed) and also some semblance of a routine. When does it get easier? Hubby has them downstairs for hours or in the nursery while I try and rest as I’m still recovering but they are so wide awake at night.

In my desperation I contacted a twin specialist sleep nanny but she is so expensive we could afford one night at a push when we need support with routine which takes longer.

The babies are nearly 4 weeks old. Does anyone have a good twin routine for this age that works? I hate the feeling of just surviving feed to feed and doing nothing else and need to protect myself..

Regarding meals my church does a scheme called Meals for Mums where someone cooks and delivers fresh home cooked dinners for you to freeze when you have a newborn. You don’t need to be a churchgoer to use this. There might well be a community scheme like this near you.

I feel so much for you, as due to Covid there are so many informal support networks that are not available. When my friend had twins I used to pop round at lunchtime and give her a hand with a feed and a change and help her get ready if she wanted to get out of the house. I think that might be permitted under the rules as it is providing care?

If family or friends are able take any help on offer, you really need to rest as much as you can.

If you have the choice of chores, shower or sleep...choose sleep always.

Hi OP my twins will be 3 soon and I remember that feedingfeedingfeeding. It's relentless but it is what they need to grow right now.

We had a routine then bc mine had nasogastric tubes and needed feeding every so often - 3 and then after a bit 4 hours - so I felt like I was on a treadmill of routine. I still remember 3-7-11-3-7-11 was our rhythm, right through the 24!

But it gets easier. They will grow and start to sleep. Mine started to settle down somewhat from about 4 mos and although they have had phases of disrupted sleep, sometimes quite bad, it has got easier and easier.

You just hang in there.

Try to go for a coffee when you. Sounds mad, but I used to bundle mine the buggy for a walk, go round the streets till they were asleep, and slip into our local Costa. I usually got about 25 mins to myself and a hot drink that was actually hot. It was an effort but always made me feel so much better!

Our twins turn 16 next month. The first weeks were fucking horrendous, frankly - and I didn't have a fraction of the time you've had (had oc and an induction as a result, but otherwise all went well). I'm not going to advise on routines (for me, as for a pp, it was necessary, so they ate whenever the hungrier of the two wanted to be fed, and they went down for naps at the same time - but I'm not going to claim that this is either right for everyone, or even desirable).... but just to reassure you, it will get better. Gradually, in stages, but definitely. And importantly, nothing you do now is setting anything in stone for a week's time, or two months' time - or 16 years' time.

Try and be kind to yourself. This bit IS about survival, for all four of you x

They probably don't know the difference between day and night. Our community nurse (when ours were about same age but ours had some health issues) recommended we have them downstairs for 12 hours during the day then take them up to the bedroom (with subdued lighting, no noise or stimulation etc) at a set time each night. Once they're asleep pop them in their cot and put a monitor on and come downstairs. I felt uncomfortable doing it as all advice said to keep them with you at all times but I was on my knees.

At first it's a nightmare because you're constantly up and down to settle, feed (check because you're paranoid) etc but gradually (it didn't take as long as I thought) the time between having to go up to them lengthens. We'd often go to bed not long after them but having even half an hour, downstairs, with no babies, as a couple, having a cup of tea and watching the news, was bliss.

direct.asda.com/george/baby/baby-feeding/breastfeeding/kinder-valley-twin-nursing-pillow/050297557,default,pd.html

These feeding pillows are great. You can also leave them in there (not alone, smothering risk) after feeding. It keeps them slightly raised so less likely to be sick. With 2 babies it's hard to keep them both upright by yourself after feeds!

Also for their cots/cribs you can get wedgehogs which help keep them raised when asleep so again helps the reflux.

wedgehog.co.uk/?cmp_id=1585890172&adg_id=61508389124&kwd=baby%20reflux%20wedge&device=m&gclid=Cj0KCQiAzsz-BRCCARIsANotFgMyI5liTSIF2GUzjKKB6P6aXZhj6rDf10-26OrgiyraZmOk9ieFbhgaAg5sEALw_wcB

You could also speak to GP about adding carobel to feeds to thicken it.

It's easy to get disheartened and give up if something doesn't seem to work but stick with it. It'll come naturally xx

My goodness, I saw teh title and came on to say that with twins at 3-4 weeks surviving feed to feed is actually a pretty big acomplishment, and then I saw all you'd been through.

To be still standing and keeping yourself and two tiny humans alive is remakable.

I know it's tough, there's a reason sleep deprivation is used as torture, but you've got this - you're doing great.

On a more practical level (apologies if I've missed this) but if you're formula feeding can you get a perfect prep machine, to make it as hassle free as possible.

And as others before me have said, if the choice is chores or sleep, always choose sleep. Dust reaccumulates, plates can only get so dirty, but everything is easier after a nap.

@coralpig you've had a horrific time of it

I was lucky that my planned C Sec was fine, babies were good and after no milk coming in were fine on bottles. DH does his share. I can tell you at 4 weeks we were on our knees and I cried at night that they cried when it was dark to punish me for not being good enough.

Right now it's just time to batten down the hatches and fight through. Get all the rest you can so you are fit and well for them, feed on demand. At 4 weeks old they're happy just stating at black and white shapes and gear Ng your voices. Don't stress yourself out about whether they're adequately simulated and developing.

Please be kind to yourself

Another recommendation here for wedgehogs.

And Def speak to GP about either carobel or gaviscon and possibly omeprazole. Reflux is a shit.

The previous comment is just lovely and just what I would have said but more eloquently. You are surviving. And you will thrive again. Hold on.

It's so tough what you've been through. Throughout history mothers have had many other people around to help. Our small families in which everyone is under pressure and you feel under pressure to do jobs is so tough. Lockdown makes it worse.

Do you have anyone who could come into your bubble to support you with this? Even a nanny for a week from an agency who could just come and help and give you time to rest your own body.

Stay strong.

Oh yes please note op that as the owner of an under 1 you can form a vibe with another household so of there is anyone around who'd come and help, use it

Forget about tidying the house! Keep the kitchen and bathrooms hygienic and ignore the rest. Sleep and food (for you and the babies) is all that matters right now. Let the rest go.

Oh OP you have been through the wringer. You are doing absolutely amazingly. The first 12 weeks - especially the first six of those - are just for survival. You won't get a routine yet. Don't do house jobs unless they are essential essential essential. Ideally get someone else to do them, Im sure you have friends who would be happy to come for a couple of hours and power through some laundry loads for you for example if you just asked. Prioritise your babies and your rest, your recovery, your nutrition and hydration. It starts to get easier and that is when you can start to put the house to rights again.

Sounds like you are doing amazingly.

Sending you huge hugs OP. Fellow twin mum and the first few months are just brutal. I can barely even remember them but what I do remember is being tired to my bones and literally surviving feed to feed. Poor you being so unwell on top of it. Do you have anyone who can help out and give you a break? My mum came and stayed with us for 2 weeks and it was so good to have another pair of hands to hold a baby or do a feed. It’s really tricky to get them into a routine this early and we just followed their leads.

Do anything to make life easier. We didn’t cook for months and just ate cook or M&S meals. Very minimal cleaning. Just cut yourself some slack and do whatever you can to get through. You can do it.

Also recommend your local twins group for advice and solidarity. They’ll have been there and understand. It’s very hard for people without twins to get it

Twin mum here and I had 3 under 3 and a husband was wasn’t much help.
Can you get a homestart volunteer ? Sleep is definitely the priority so forget cleaning. Mine started sleeping more consistently at 11 weeks but it felt like forever. Twin club was a godsend.
Honestly it will get easier but you’ve been through a hell of a time so please look after yourself and get as much support and practical help as you can xx

Ooh and top tip that changed everything for me at about two weeks - the midwife showed me the 'kitten hold', where you pick up baby by scrunching a bunch of babygro in your fist over his chest and move him, prone, on his back, with no support needed under the head... Game changer!

You are doing an amazing job, you've been through so much. I definitely agree with pp to choose sleep over shower and shower over chores every time. Getting a routine takes time, even with one.

Take all the help you can get - if you can bubble, do, but also visits are allowed for care and support needs, which I am sure you qualify for. I'm a Mum of one but remember my friend having twins and she had her Mum round every day and friends to help as much as possible in the early days.

This is, by far, physically the toughest time of the whole thing, but you will get through it @coralpig. I snatched 15-min snippets of sleep for nearly six months -- it was awful and we both aged about 10 years.

Here are out tips:

1. Sleep is your priority. When you can grab any time, set your alarm so you wake after 45 min. Do not sleep longer as you will be more tired. 45 minutes is a full cycle and will refresh you. Of course, if you can grab 90 min, that's even better, but probably unlikely for some time! I learnt this from a Norland nanny.

1. Invest in two (not one) bottle sterilisers. So you always have one ready to go. Use the dishwasher for washing bottles, then sterilise in the microwave. We had cracked, bleeding hands from all the bottle washing so learn to cut corners where you can.

1. Buy a catering microwave. We blew two Bosches, until we looked into catering microwaves, which can take all the sterilising.

1. I know it's difficult to do right now, but if you can afford it, try to get a cleaner, so you don't need to think about that side of things and someone can clean up the sticky trails of milk everywhere.

I tried to get help with establishing a routine, but it didn't work. It took me years to understand that different babies may have different sleep needs. One of ours behaved as if he'd read Gina Ford, but the other never slept, vomited his meals and had insane attachment issues.

Try to look after each other, this is a common time for twin parents to separate, so it's really important you look out for each other. Good luck to you both. It will get better, but at different times for everyone.

Oh OP. I dont have any advice re twins but that all sounds so hard.
Giving birth and the early days can be so brutal. I understand why you want a routine but many people just let a routine evolve at this point and I would go with the flow.

Do you have any family or friends who can help? Don't be afraid to ask for help. I'd happily cuddle a newborn for a friend while she slept or rested.

Get a cleaner if you can and just rest. Totally normal not to like your husband at this point!
Sleep deprivation does strange things.

Breast feeding didn't work out with mine and in the long run it was a blessing.

Sounds like you've been quite poorly so do take care. It will get better!

Also, just when you think you have established a semblance of a pattern, everything changes. They have a growth spurt or teeth, or get sick, or their needs change. You will be fighting fires for the first few months.

I, too, thought routine would sort everything, but it didn't. If you can, write down the feeds (times and amounts) and sleep times, so you can look back and see what you can tweak if they are unhappy. It's also useful when you start weaning.

Although it never felt like we succeeded in establishing a proper routine, just trying to establish it did wonders in the long run. Ours never fought with going to bed, always slept with lights off, and the bath, story and music before bed helped too (they still have it and they are 9!)

A previous poster said try to get out. This is a good idea. I was scared to do so (pre-Covid!) but having a hot drink and a snack will do wonders, and it will make things feel a little more sane. Even if it does take a couple of hours to get out of the front door!

Wow what a time you've had! I have twins, they were born after a horrendous high risk pregnancy and I breast fed them. It is soo hard and previous posters are right it is so early that you just need to go with the flow. I eventually managed to express enough for oh to give a bottle at night and once feeding was established I also used formula when I didn't have enough expressed milk. I also used the Gina Ford twins book later on but not religiously. Hang in there and also remember hardly anyone exclusively breast feeds their twins and of you have to give formula or stop it isn't the end of the world. I strongly believe it was combination feeding that saw us through to 9months.

Sounds like you've had a rough ride.

I had premature twins (31 weeks) and a wound infection and can confirm - life is very hard for the first year after twins. It's hard on you. Your relationship. Your finances.

Routines are never established within weeks of birth. Ever. For singletons or twins.

We got our twins into a routine at 10 months. Before the we fed on demand and they slept when they slept. We had lots of takeaways and both felt like death. That's the reality I'm afraid.

They slept when they were 1 and are good boys and life is easier now (they are 2).

Life will be hard now for a while, you won't get along because you're both pressured, stressed, resentful and tired. Some counselling may help though to process the trauma around it all, because twin pregnancy, birth and childcare can be traumatic.

What you're experiencing is normal and don't feel bad if you need to reach out for help. It's a tough task especially being a new mum as well.

Another twin Mum here... Mine have just turned 4 and I remember those early weeks well... It was hell!!!

Like you I had a difficult start, was in intensive care for a week so when I came out of hospital I was incredibly weak and looking after 2 babies.

Firstly... Well done, you're all alive and that's the first thing to focus on!

Routine isn't really a thing at this age, as hard as that is to hear. Genuinely the first 6-8 weeks are just about surviving and you are over half way there!!

As others have suggested try contacting Twins Trust.

And sorry I've not read the full thread so this may be a very "cancel the cheque" thing I'm about to say but contact your health visitor or midwife and see if home start is running in your area at the minute. You can access someone to come to your home to help out for a couoke hours a week.

Or maybe contact one of the local colleges and see if there are students on the appropriate courses who would be available for paid work.... A couple courts to come sit with the babies one day so you could sleep for example.

There's also a very good breastfeeding Facebook group called Breastfeeding Twins and Triplets that you may want to join. There's some really lovely women on there who can help with breastfeeding questions and general multiple birth support.

I EBF mine until 2 and it definitely made it harder on me but ultimately I'm glad I did it.

Keep strong (but also know when you need support) x

Oh OP this sounds so ridiculously hard! I think any sort of routine is difficult to establish this early let alone with twins. Would a better investment be a cleaner once/twice per week so that the down time you have can be resting time? I had my little boy led on a jungle gym at 4 weeks. Meant I could at least have a cup of tea. Rather than focus on a routine for the boys... why don't you agree with hubby that 7am (or whatever time) is your shower time and then make the bed? Something really small which might make you feel more human. Wishing you all the luck and a speedy recovery xxx