To hope these parents are ashamed of their boys tonight?

[Dilbertian]

Today my Y9 ds was taunted by boys making the Nazi salute at him. This, after a couple of weeks of 'Dirty Jew'.

If these are your sons, is this what you want for them? Is this the attitude you would like them to have to their fellow human beings? Do you feel proud of them? Would you like them to be treated this way? What are you saying to them tonight? What do you think the Head of Year should say to them tomorrow?

What do you think your sons should do next?

Or maybe - meh, it's just bantz, boys will be boys.

I would be beyond disgusted and would probably (funds permitting) be cancelling their christmas presents and using the money to take them to visit a concentration camp museum site and explaining to them how a little bit of racial slurring quickly grows in to murder and atrocities.

I spoke to my son about this (same school year as your son), he was horrified and said that if he ever witnessed anything like that, he would intervene (peacefully) to ensure the victim was safe/not hurt and then report it straight away. He said that he/his mates would be horrified to hear such things. At his school, the Head would report it to the police and the boys would be suspended at the very least.

Would my son do this or engage in this sort of hate crime? No. Our family are indigenous Christians from the Middle East. Many family members have been persecuted/"disappeared". He has been fully educated as to what happens when this sort of hatred/intolerance happens, and I've taught him to always stand up and speak up against this sort of behaviour.

I really hope that the school (and police) deal with this awful behaviour appropriately. I'm so sorry that this has happened to your poor son xx

I'm really sorry op. When my son received vile racist abuse in the classroom the school tried to punish but the perpetrator left. I reported it to the police and they took it very seriously. A visit from the police with the street looking at their car and parents feeling shame will have an impact. Happy to do it as many times as it takes. Bullying is bad. Racist bullying is a crime

But it’s probably where I live to be honest. I wasn’t denying that it happens as obviously people don’t lie about it. Just that the only places I see it talked about is where I stated earlier.

To be fair if you’re not Jewish and you don’t live where there’s a Jewish community you’re hardly likely to hear or see anti semitism. It’s a big of a silly statement to make

@Atrixie

But it’s probably where I live to be honest. I wasn’t denying that it happens as obviously people don’t lie about it. Just that the only places I see it talked about is where I stated earlier.

To be fair if you’re not Jewish and you don’t live where there’s a Jewish community you’re hardly likely to hear or see anti semitism. It’s a big of a silly statement to make

I'm not Jewish and I don't live near a Jewish community but I am aware of anti-Semitism because I watch TV, listen to the Radio and read newspapers.

If they were in uniform I would ring up the head teacher today. Are they same school as son or another school. That is unacceptable and needs to be dealt with plus the parents of the boys should be told. I would absolutely want to know.

That's awful.

My DS is only 7 but I can't even imagine how furious I'd be if he ever engages in this behaviour in future. There will be severe consequences.

@sashagabadon

If they were in uniform I would ring up the head teacher today. Are they same school as son or another school. That is unacceptable and needs to be dealt with plus the parents of the boys should be told. I would absolutely want to know.

The OP's first post has a 'see all' button so you can see all her posts at once and keep up with events.

@CheltenhamLady

The school should bring in the police. This is a hate crime as has already been said. Please report it to the school or directly to the police.

Exactly that. These youngsters need a real fright and a recognition that their behaviour is never going to be accepted without punishment

Ah thanks Captain. Never knew that was a thing

If these were my sons, I don't know whose wrath they should fear the most

Yep. Same here. I would be absolutely appalled, as would their Dad. They'd soon be regretting it once they realised we'd found out.

The only thing that worries me in this day and age is there seems to be more and more parents who think their little darlings can't do anything wrong.

That's horrendous and a hate crime how awful, I'm sorry OP

thanks @StoneofDestiny

wow thats not a punishment really is it-being put in another room they'll just think theyre being hard oh we got isolated

not good enough

I know this goes on in schools and there’s a new emboldening around this sort of anti Semitism. A Muslim mum I know told me she was really struggling to keep her boys away from this sort of talk as it was so prevalent at their school (London). She’s a brilliant person by the way so I know she was horrified at how common it was among the friends. She thought it was a sort of identity for their friends

No it’s not a punishment for this at all - it’s only a way of letting teachers teach without disruption to learning. Those in internal exclusion only get miffed because they can’t be with their mates.
Anti Semitic bullying needs a much bigger response. I’d be very interested to read that schools anti bullying policy and specific reference to racial/ethnic/religious bullying

I think my DH might hit him. (Yes. I know, that would be wrong).

I would feel failure like I have never felt before, I think. This to me would be worse than anything our eldest son has ever done, and he is a child well known to services. I would feel burning shame.

I don't know where I would start, but mentioning my grandfather's agonising recollection of the liberation of Belsen and the way that for the rest of his life he could not go down the road in my mum's home town that had an abbatoir on because the smell made him cry would definitely be part of whatever I said.

My son got told Hitler was a great man by some Muslim boys previously. I have told him not to tell people he is Jewish (unless they are good friends who he trusts well) as it's not worth the harrassment and we are not religious.

I want them educated. I want them horrified by the depths of depravity to which people can sink. I want them to make a personal commitment to themselves never to become like that.

I think this is a bit naive. A lot of people know what happened to Jews and not only don't care but actively support it. If they are making Nazi salutes why do you think educating them is going to magically make them do a 180 degree turn. It is just going to make them even more angry and racist.

Perhaps I am naïve. Perhaps these boys learned from their parents. There is no doubt that plenty of people would agree with them. But that's not a reason to give up. I'm sure many of us have entirely different attitudes to our parents about equality, race, religion, sexuality - and that's because of our educations.

In spite of everything I still believe that people are really good at heart. I simply can’t build up my hopes on a foundation consisting of confusion, misery, and death.

Anne Frank

I think that people like this are beyond the reach of routine, child appropriate education about the Holocaust. But I doubt many of them could watch Night Will Fall or the German Concentration Camps Factual Survey and genuinely not feel anything at all.

They didn't necessarily have to learn from parents, though it's a good chance. We had a guy expelled from college at 15, just after a start, for writing anti jewish thing and drawing swastika on bus stop next to the school. No tolerance. Immediately expelled. I saw his parents when they came in and mum wss crying and dad was the most furious person I've ever seen screaming at him "Why the fuck do you think that's ok!?". Whole college heard that.

OP, one of the best things you can do for your son is to get him to learn self defence (preferably Krav Maga) so that he can physically defend himself and doesn't have to rely on knuckle-dragging racists changing their attitudes or incompetent schools dealing with Jew hate (which often seems to be taken less seriously than other forms of hate for some reason).

@backwardforward

OP, one of the best things you can do for your son is to get him to learn self defence (preferably Krav Maga) so that he can physically defend himself and doesn't have to rely on knuckle-dragging racists changing their attitudes or incompetent schools dealing with Jew hate (which often seems to be taken less seriously than other forms of hate for some reason).

That's ridiculous! So the OP 's son is being abused by half a dozen thugs and he lays them all out with his martial arts skills. Righto.

Kids can be a?seholes but Nazi salutes? Expulsion on the spot. It's that simple. And referral to social services as kids who think this is in ANY way acceptable need help.

No, backwardforward's suggestion is correct.

Having the ability to defend themself does not mean a person will respond with violence. It means they will have greater self-confidence and be less vulnerable in every way.

Martial arts such as Krav Maga are not about getting into fights, are not about beating up people. When taught well, students learn de-escalation behaviour and how to use the minimum response to achieve maximum safety.

This was exactly why ds started learning Judo this time last year, but Covid suspended the clubs. If KM was taught anywhere near us, I would enrol ds and his siblings.

@Dilbertian

No, backwardforward's suggestion is correct.

Having the ability to defend themself does not mean a person will respond with violence. It means they will have greater self-confidence and be less vulnerable in every way.

Martial arts such as Krav Maga are not about getting into fights, are not about beating up people. When taught well, students learn de-escalation behaviour and how to use the minimum response to achieve maximum safety.

This was exactly why ds started learning Judo this time last year, but Covid suspended the clubs. If KM was taught anywhere near us, I would enrol ds and his siblings.

This is a very sensible idea op. All my dc do Jiu Jitsu and wrestling. It’s not about teaching them to be violent. It gives them confidence, discipline and self-defence skills. I feel safer knowing they can defend themselves, should anything happen. Unfortunately, we don’t live in the best area and there are quite a lot of violent incidents amongst teens.