To want to know a benefit of brexit?

[Dishwashersaurous]

I know that brexit has been done to death. But as we crash into a no deal and inevitable queues at the border my children are asking what is the benefit of brexit.

Could someone please tell me a tangible benefit that I can tell them- as I am struggling to think of anything

The depressing thing is that, just imagine how the opposite argument could have gone.

It's 2016 again, and we're voting whether or not to join the EU. You'll get to travel Europe without any visa nonsense! You can join those quick passport queues! You can bring your dog with you! Your phone costs will be the same as if you were at home! We'll get better trade deals as we're joining the largest trading block in the world! Stuff will be cheaper! You'll have less paperwork to fill out if you export stuff! Kent will no longer be a lorry park! All those food and drug shortages we've been going through will end! You won't have to drink English wine! Your elderly mother will have better care due to Paul from Poland being willing to work for minimum wage!

And to top it off, we wouldn't have to give up the pound, we'd have a say at the top table and a veto.

@randomchap

The depressing thing is that, just imagine how the opposite argument could have gone.

It's 2016 again, and we're voting whether or not to join the EU. You'll get to travel Europe without any visa nonsense! You can join those quick passport queues! You can bring your dog with you! Your phone costs will be the same as if you were at home! We'll get better trade deals as we're joining the largest trading block in the world! Stuff will be cheaper! You'll have less paperwork to fill out if you export stuff! Kent will no longer be a lorry park! All those food and drug shortages we've been going through will end! You won't have to drink English wine! Your elderly mother will have better care due to Paul from Poland being willing to work for minimum wage!

And to top it off, we wouldn't have to give up the pound, we'd have a say at the top table and a veto.

Yes but at least we've got our sovereignty to fall back on...

Yes but at least we've got our sovereignty to fall back on...

...and we've 'got our country back' of course. And 'got back control of our borders.'

And let's not forget all of the countries lining up to make trade deals. We'll pick and choose, and dictate really, really excellent trade terms. Really, it's all good. The future is bright af.

Oh yeah, sovereignty. Did anyone figure out what that actually is yet? 😆

I’m Intrigued by the yacht VAT thing but can’t face reading the rest of the thread just to see if there’s more information 😂

Oh yeah, sovereignty. Did anyone figure out what that actually is yet?

No, but I THINK it's a little bit to do with 'Britishing.' As in 'let's just British our way out of this fucking mess.'

See also our early Covid response.

Stuff we think makes us all special, but no other person/country/trading bloc/pandemic on the planet gives a shit about.

I have a very solid benefit to us leaving the EU if you’d like. Although it’s a moral one. We did extremely well out of it economically back when we were a member state maybe not quite as well as Germany, and maybe France, but we were certainly up there.

However the big three economies achieved these benefits very much at the expense of the smaller economies, think Greece and latterly Italy although there are many others, and I simply don’t believe we have the moral right to bolster our own economy in this way. It’s not quite imperialistic mercantilism, but it has features of it that are similar. It’s basically a crony capitalists dream.

We did do well out of it, but so did a lot of smaller countries. Ireland has done tremendously well out of it.

And, actually, overall I think Greece has done well since it joined as well. I'm in two minds over the whole EU and Greece thing. I really didn't think it was unreasonable to put conditions on bailing out Greece, when the Greek government was refusing to tackle the rampant tax evasion there. I'm aware I'm in a minority on that, though. I think the EU has been far more culpable in failing to act effectively on the refugee crisis. But God I'd so much rather be in and dealing with these things together.

Yup I’ll give you Ireland, but EU economic policy has decimated social mobility in a lot of these smaller countries unless you are willing to up sticks entirely and move to one of the more affluent ones.

The aspect of Greece that annoys me is how we scapegoat them over issues we are just as culpable on. We can’t claim moral superiority when we’ve been enablers of their spiralling into debt at almost every step, but because it transfers a lot of wealth into the hands of large companies we have turned a blind eye.

I think your allusion to being better able to steer the ship from within the EU than outside of it is a solid one, but my only reservation with that is whenever I have asked the question of a remainer to give me roadmap on how to make those changes they invariably can’t give me any. Well almost never one or two have given it a stab.

I hope Scotland never gets independence as a result of all this. It would be one disaster after another.

I hope Scotland never gets independence as a result of all this. It would be one disaster after another.

Ok, look at it the other way round. England gets independence and can become the money-laundering, tax haven the Tory party and their Russian oligarch backers want without us messing things up for them.

Indyrefef 2 for English independence. Bring it on!

@TheSandman

I hope Scotland never gets independence as a result of all this. It would be one disaster after another.

Ok, look at it the other way round. England gets independence and can become the money-laundering, tax haven the Tory party and their Russian oligarch backers want without us messing things up for them.

Indyrefef 2 for English independence. Bring it on!

You think it's all a bit of a laugh but I'm deadly serious.

The media is talking about something other than Covid...

That's about the only benefit I can think of

but my only reservation with that is whenever I have asked the question of a remainer to give me roadmap on how to make those changes they invariably can’t give me any

To be fair, most members of the cabinet would struggle. But it matters not now. Our days of being any kind of meaningful voice on the world/European stage are behind us.

Some xenophobic gammons can say we are sovereign, despite never not being sovereign?

The EU is becoming increasingly militarised although with NATO membership Brexit doesn't make that much difference. Ultimately you don't want your citizens in Africa fighting for France's financial benefit, or in the Baltic and Balkans fighting for German interests. Not that the UK is squeaky clean in that regard.

@ReadyFreddy

Some xenophobic gammons can say we are sovereign, despite never not being sovereign?

Bit ironic of you to use a racist slur in the same sentence as the word 'xenophobic'. 😂

As the country is fucked over by an elite minority, to the detriment of all of us, it's good you can find some humour.

Imagine thinking 'gammon' is a racist term

The stupidity on MN knows no bounds

‘ The 'gammon' meme, however, is both sexist, racist, and ageist as it's used specifically against white men of a certain age who have acquired that ruddy 'gammon' face’

And also of a particularly ignorant political persuasion. Doesn’t have to apply to older people, plenty of red faced far right activists. Racist?! Well!🤦🏽‍♀️ That’s hilarious. Can you be racist about a racist?😂

How can a pejorative term referencing the colour of somebody's skin not be racist?

Oh no, come on.

Gammon is racist? We are through the looking glass now

@ReadyFreddy I still disagree, that research doesn't necessarily say people ARE more racist as they get older more that if they are they're more likely to express it and it's really difficult to allow for things like Alzheimer's.

@DdraigGoch my concern is those were different conservative govts that enacted those laws. I really don't see the current shower as particularly enlightened or in touch with the general public at all

I'm usually not a fan of the House of Lords but this current govt are being reined in by them! I think that really says something!

@wonkylegs Totally agree with your post at 0947

I also hope we will continue to be protected by workers rights. They have said we will.

Yea I wouldn't hold your breath on that! I suspect they'd do away with many workers rights if they can possibly get away with it. I would urge as many people as possible to join a union if you're not in one already ASAP! Particularly given workers have already had access to legal aid for employment matters bloody hard to access if at all! People forget that this is exactly the kind of thing unions are good for!

@TheSunIsStillShining yes it's worrying about the lack of commentary on service industries isn't it? A major industry here in Scotland and people are very worried what's going to happen there.

I think a vast majority of those stating it as their reason don't even understand what "sovereignty" means!

@Beeeees I'm also loving the yacht vat thing! my lottery win/windfall fantasy spend absolutely involves buying and living on a gorgeous luxury yacht and just chasing sun (but nowhere too hot I'm a scot we don't cope well in tropical conditions ) around the world. Summer in Uk, autumn in Southern Europe, winter in New Zealand, spring in New York... ahh a girl can dream eh?