To think London commute towns are no better than Edinburgh for raising a family?

[JenXG]

So basically DH and I are having a debate on whether to leave Edinburgh and move to a commute town outside London. (we have to stick with Edinburgh / London as working in financial sector but both of us would avoid London because of traffic/pollution/crowded streets).

The main reason for DH favouring those commute towns is that they seem to have loads of good schools for DS (4mo) to choose from compared to Edinburgh where there are only a few (or hardly any if his standard). He has high hope for DS. Also the A-level system is widely recognised across different countries (so potential for studying overseas) but the same cant be said for the Scotland system.

My worry is that we are giving up preferred lifestyle for a very small difference in schooling. I grew up in a big city and always need busy streets nearby. I understand some places such as Guildford will have its own town centre but there are still fewer things going on compared to Edinburgh. For example, there are a wide range of fine restuarants, several theatres & cinemas, pubs, etc in Edinburgh but living in Guildford we'd still have to go to London for a night out? I'd assume activities for young kids are more available in Edinburgh than in Guildford? E.g. Edinburgh has a zoo, lots of museums, and a coastline where you can do kayaking. Also Guildford is one of the busier towns as I understand. Some other commute towns are even quieter. So we'd highly likely end up travelling to London a lot which is not fun (I'm far more used to walking or driving a little bit to favourite places than hours of trains/tubes).

What do people think? I haven't been to many places in the southern area. Maybe I have misunderstood what life would be like there? Would you relocate if you were us?

I used to teach in Guildford and surrounding towns.
It's very nice- there is a theatre in Guildford and nearby towns.Lots of nice places to eat, good shops etc. There is countryside on the doorstep and it's not too far to the coast (Brighton) and of course you can go to London. It is pricy so have you looked at house prices?

There are two very good schools in Guildford and Charterhouse nearby if you have oodles of cash.

I think you need to look at the lifestyle you want now and in the foreseeable future and forget about your little Einstein.

Haven’t read the entire thread but this is an odd one. IMO

I think you need to consider that uni is free in Scotland, we have 5 children between us step children live in Edinburgh my eldest is at uni in London and the other two are much younger. The eldest 2 won't have the huge debts the others will have.

The main reason for DH favouring those commute towns is that they seem to have loads of good schools for DS (4mo) to choose from compared to Edinburgh where there are only a few (or hardly any if his standard)

Also the A-level system is widely recognised across different countries (so potential for studying overseas) but the same cant be said for the Scotland system.

Oh dear goodness. Your DH is one of those people, isn't he?

@Lily193

Considering the massive issues we have here in commuter belts with county lines drugs, i'd stay put...

Scotland has the highest rate of DRDs in the whole of Europe so however massive your issues, they are not comparable.

Interestingly I just mentioned this discussion to DH and the first thing he mentioned was drugs.

I would only move there if Scotland got independence. The only real benefit I can see is the weather being better.

I wouldn't stay for the free universities though as there is a good chance that fees wont still be free in 17 years. It is still a huge gamble to take though, what if your child isn't academic or interested in University, you will have uprooted your whole life for nothing.

Scottish students have always tended to study in Scotland because they are much less willing than the rest of the world to actually leave home and prefer to be insular. So many students don't even want to travel to another Scottish university because it means leaving home, and this has always traditionally been the case

Well, when you live in the best place in the world, why would you chose to leave?

@FelicityPike

That’s a lot of pressure to put on a four MONTH old! What Fettes and the like not good enough for this as yet undiscovered child genius? Your husband’s an idiot.

That pretty much sums up my feelings 😂

Edinburgh...has an ever so slightly snobby and parochial vibe 'ever so slightly'? It's genuinely the only place I've ever known where I have found the stereotype of what the people are like to hold true.

Cheetas I am at a total loss as to how your husband could be supposedly well educated/from an academic background and think things like “students with Scottish qualifications will have problems studying abroad”.

I would agree with the DH's viewpoint. I'm a lecturer at a Scottish university and the lack of ambition and curiosity to see other parts of the world is mind-numbing. I've worked and studied at Dutch and French universities too and I have never come across another Scot. Scant few English too, but there are some. I do find academia in Scotland quite dumbed down these days - this "thing" of having to gain the Principal's approval to send academic articles off to journals for publication is clearly politically motivated, and I can't write about my topic correctly as a result (because it involves criticising the Scottish Government). I'm actively looking for a job back at one of my previous employers because as I said, it is mind numbing and not really what I consider university standard a lot of the time.

My Latin teacher (yes, we weirdly had Latin in a Scottish state school) told me she was really disappointed in me for applying to Cambridge when there were world class universities on my doorstep.

My parents removed me from a Scottish state school part way through fourth year because the careers advisor told me not to aim for university because I might end up disappointing myself . The headmaster supported this viewpoint when my mother went up to complain, so she came back, grim-faced but determined that night and said "I hope you've said goodbye to your friends because you're not going back to that place".

I believe this attitude is still relatively prevalent today.

I live in the vicinity of Guildford and in non Covid times commute to London and work in FS. I don’t think it’s a comparison to Edinburgh, especially post Covid. There are theatres and event spaces, great country pubs and the shops are ok, but for more culture or different restaurants I would still go to London for a day/night out.
Schools are generally good, a strong selection of private and state if you live in the right catchment but I think you’d hugely miss the city buzz on a day to day basis, it’s not a very cosmopolitan area but people do adapt!

Thinking again. You have time on your side. None of us know what’s going to happen in relation to independence or the quality of Scottish education (or indeed English) going forward. You can afford to wait until close to secondary school level to make a decision. Another factor will be whether you will be better off down south or in Edinburgh. If higher rate tax payers you already pay more tax here. Following independence I don’t think that there can be much doubt that there will have to be massive personal tax increases for Scottish earners (it’s a numbers game - only 5.5 million people in Scotland (as compared to 9 million in Greater London alone) majority of whom don’t pay tax and only 6-8per cent of whom are higher rate tax payers) to help plug the hole from the loss of the English tax base also supporting our shared cost base / loss of Barnet formula payment. That would have to be set against any advantage you see accruing from independence such as potential European citizenship for you and your child (although that’s looking increasingly unlikely).

I would think you could raise a family anywhere.

I have always lived in a London commute town and managed it. It's nice where I am and I wouldn't want anywhere else. Pleasant places nearby and half an hour into central London. The schools are very good too.

However you have to pick your area carefully, obviously some are better than others.

Housing is expensive.

Ok, it seems to be a bit early to have this conversation but.......As someone who was moved to bloody Surrey for their tween/teen years, do not do it! Honestly, it is so dull. People are obsessed with money and appearances, you have to travel to London for any real excitment and I could not wait to leave. Edinburgh is a proper city and a really nice one at that. I have family there and all have done very well out it the education system (high flying careers) and a great quality of life.

Also there really is a stigma to being English these days due to the bloody mess we are in. Voting in a comedy act for a PM and the general , entitled attitude of some in regards to Europe just giving in to our demands even though we are the ones who voted out, not endearing us to our neighbours. I am embarrassed when I travel and feel the need to apologise. The Scots part of the family gets let off after explaining they are not English as this is not seen as a British thing but an English thing. English people are not as well liked as they think.

I only know Edinburgh as a visitor so can't speak with any authority on what it's like to live there, but the people I know who do love it. I have more than once looked at jobs up there. Commuter-ville is not for me. I grew up in it and hated it.

I am more struck though as many are for your husband's reasons for the move. My kids have two parents with Oxbridge degrees (both from state schools) and would be astonished if any of them ended up going there. They have their own strengths (and two of them have SEND) and I adore them, but I'm pretty sure that their parents have failed to produce a second generation of Oxbridge students. It happens pretty often. Gutting to have uprooted your whole life in the pursuit of something that is very likely indeed not to happen.

He has 'high hopes' for your baby????? Bloody hell. You need to watch that.

The weather is much better in the South East. I lived in a commuter town for 20 years and loved it. London was only 35 minutes on the train but we also had the countryside on our doorstep. Nice houses are very expensive though, and commuting to the City every day is no fun.

Edinburgh is an amazing city and seems to have everything going for it. If I were to live in a city, Edinburgh would be my top choice. I used to work there sometimes and it seems you could walk to the financial district from lots of areas.

Ltb

@GreenlandTheMovie we have trains in to Edinburgh now...from Eskbank.

I have lived ( for a short time) in both Edinburgh and Guilford. I'd choose Edinburgh without hesitation. Guildford is fine, but I'd much prefer to bring up children in Edinburgh.

Olliphant @GreenlandTheMovie we have trains in to Edinburgh now...from Eskbank

Oh, is the train turning up regularly at Eskbank instead of about half of them being cancelled?

I wouldn't. Just because average results may be better doesn't mean your specific child would have done better. I think our kids would have done as well wherever they went, within reason - it's more a function of who they are and who you are than a choice between school a and school b, as long as both schools are good.

@GreenlandTheMovie as OP is considering Fettes I’m fairly certain their means don’t chain them to a “new build” in South Gyle, a cramped flat in Comely Bank, or moving to Musselburgh.

There’s quite a significant amount of options above that in Edinburgh - which OP will know as she lives there. None of them anywhere near Lasswade or sheriff hall rab either.

Stay in Edinburgh

Four months old is a little early to be thinking about university! What if they aren't academic? Or they don't want to go to university?

Some Edinburgh state schools have pupils every year who go to Oxbridge. My son went to an average Edinburgh state school and one of his mates plus his two sisters went to Cambridge.