AIBU to be upset about what DH said about c section

[MsFrog]

Last night I was feeling really anxious about my impending ELCS. My last birth was long and difficult and ended in quite a traumatic EMCS. It was scary for both of us, obviously. Last night, I was saying how anxious I feel about going in now that it's getting closer, imagining the specifics and remembering last time (I know an ELCS will be different).

DH was being generally sympathetic, but then he said he might not come in with me, unless I want him to. He said if I'm "not bothered", then he maybe won't come in. I was a bit shocked. I said I was surprised that he wouldn't want to be there with me, as I couldn't imagine leaving him to go through something that big alone. He said "I know it's much worse for you, but it was hard for me as well."

I feel really upset by this. I can't believe he doesn't want to be there when the baby is born, but more than that, I'm so surprised he could hear me saying how anxious I was and then say he might not come in with me. And I being unfair to be upset? I know it must be hard for him to be there, but I feel like now I can't rely on his support at all. I had a quick look on Mumsnet, and I've seen other people's DH have felt the same and posters have said not to force the DH to be there, which makes me feel like I'm being pathetic and unreasonable.

@MsFrog

Thank you all so much for your kind and balanced responses. I know he was really traumatised by my last birth, which also came after years of quite traumatic recurrent pregnancy losses as well, which I know he found hard. He's also really bad with illness/blood/hospitals etc. So I don't want to force him to be there, I understand his fears.

I suppose I just feel even more worried now that I might have to do it alone, or not be able to 'rely' on him in the operating room. PP is right to say it was brave of him to admit how he feels but I suppose a selfish part of me wishes he'd kept it to himself to reduce my anxiety and just support me through it, which is very unfair of me.

To be honest I feel your stress and his too. Just cut yourselves both some slack.

Just say firmly, I need you there for moral support. I am fearful like you but I need and value your support.

I got rushed into surgery for ventouse and episiotomy after a long labour and DS got stuck, I remember looking at DH and he looked as pale as I've ever seen him. I've said to him since it must've been hard for him, he said it was scary to see but it wasn't him going through it, and actually that's the bottom line isn't it, if it's that hard for him he must recognise how hard it is for you and a loving equal partner should put the more vulnerable one first in those kinds of circumstances.

I think it's fine to express how he feels but not ok to not manage it and make you go through it alone, I bet he didn't say that before you got pregnant for the second time, oh by the way next birth I'm opting out....

I felt upset for you having read this. I have been in a similar situation with sections and my dh admitted he was nervous the second time around but we have a very frank relationship. I explained to him that I needed an advocate in there with me, it took ages for them to give me the epidural the fast time, it was on the 13th attempt that they managed it ( the second time took 19 times but when they hit a nerve I had a sharp pain in my knee, dh spoke up for me).

I would expect him as your dh and partner to remember that no matter how scared, nervous and worried he is it will be worse for you. If you can't rely on your partner when at your most vulnerable, who can you? Yes you decided to get pregnant but you weren't alone in the process to get there.

My dh watched them pull both kids out but otherwise stood by my head and focused all his energy on me. If you are upset you need to talk to him, you can't force him yo be there of course but I would not want to be with someone who couldn't put me in front of themselves.

It doesn't help anyone to encourage OP to rage at her husband.

OP, depending on how long you have I suggest finding a doula or antenatal teacher who is supportive of and knowledgeable about caesarean birth to talk you both through what you can expect and how different an ELCS will be to the EMCS. There are resources available but given the previous trauma I think you need to be guided through them and I do NOT recommend simply watching CS videos without additional support. Even if you only have a matter of days there may be someone who can see you over Zoom. PM me if you're in the West Midlands as I can recommend someone. Your local NCT secretary might also be able to help.

My DH fainted on the floor at my first delivery, but would never have even considered ducking out of my second.
The second was much more traumatic as DD arrived barely alive, underwent resuscitation by the crash team and was rushed off ventilated and fitting, for a week in ITU. I really needed DH’s presence and support to cope with that. And neither delivery was even a section.
OP, your DH has said he will come if you want him to. Just tell him that, yes, you do want him. He can spend the rest of your pregnancy coming to terms with that and preparing himself to be a proper support to his wife in her hour of need.

This is difficult.

I have been a support person in two CS (one EMCS and one ELCS that I ended up not in the room for), and one vaginal birth. Also had two children, one forceps and one natural.

Of these five experiences, the worst by far was as support for ELCS waiting outside as the Dad decided last minute that he could cope with going in. This was probably the most terrifying time of my life. I feel for you and your DP but I think he will be far better in the room than out.

I had a ELCS for my first and DH was there and also due another c section soon for twins. No question that he would be there. But neither are an emergency situation - I do know people for whom the c section has been life or death for both the mother and baby and it absolutely traumatised the husbands to the point they were signed off with PTSD/depression after the birth. Just because they are not "putting in the work" or going through it themselves doesn't mean that they aren't effected by it

my selfish emotions go "but what about me?! It was much more traumatic for me!

Definitely don't feel selfish about this, you're absolutely right.

However, getting annoyed about it - as some pp's are - won't help.
Tell him you do want him to be there as you need his support.
Find out as much as you can, to prepare both of you.

Hmm no, he's not absolutely wonderful is he.

What a twat to put that on you. You're actually going through it, and he can't even put his needs to one side enough to simply BE THERE for you and say 'You don't need to worry. I will be there for you, I won't leave your side. No, I could NEVER let you go through that alone'.

That's support. Oh but he's traumatised too? Right, ok, so I'm not really seeing how that isn't simply putting himself first. Because OP will still have to go through it, she doesn't get a choice, but he'd really prefer not to be there because HIS FEELINGS.

It's his job to be there and fuck yes do I judge a father and husband for being like that.

OP are you allowed to have someone sles there? I would feel exactly like you - ten times worse now to have to also deal with the intrusive thought 'He's hating being here... i can't really open up to him' which he's now generously heaped on you.

Of these five experiences, the worst by far was as support for ELCS waiting outside as the Dad decided last minute that he could cope with going in. This was probably the most terrifying time of my life.

What an absolute pig of a man.

Some people seem to place a lot of emphasis on whether their partner wants to do something, rather than whether they actually do it. Personally, I think the important thing is that he is prepared to support you if you ask him to. The fact that he would prefer not to be there isn't the big issue IMO - as long as he's prepared to put his feelings aside and step up.

I'm bloodphobic and couldn't be in there with someone no matter how much I wanted to. It's inescapable fear and tbh I'd most likely faint.

Could your mum or sister come in?

You need him, tell him so.Talk about it, share how hard it was, this is. Could you both use some counselling? Start now if you can.
If he is open and honest, seems like he is, it may help him to work through the anxiety and be there for you. That might be healing for you both.. good luck

No experience of c sections here but I’d be disgusted if my DH said that. What a pussy! Tell him to grow up it’s you who’s been cut open not him!

I think it's extremely selfish of him. I've been through traumatic c sections too. Unfortunately though for the baby to be born you have to be there and experience it again, and as the other parent who helped create this person he should be there too. All he has to do is sit there.

If he is traumatised then he needs to seek counselling, which he should have thought of prior to getting you pregnant and booking in another c section.

Gosh, that's a tough one. Did he have any councelling after the last birth? sounds as though he could do with some. Often people forget that it is traumatic for the birth partner too.

Any chance you could both have a talk through with the process, and what to expect with a medical professional?

Not to minimise your trauma, but do you want to force him to attend if he's still freaked out?

Good luck!

I agree with those that have raised points about what you need in way of support.
For me worse art of both EMCS and a subsequent ELCS was the spinal. I have a slight odd back and first time it took them 40 mins to get needle in. Second time we prewarned them ...husband was there to say that I didn’t want them to prat around for 40 mins and to get senior anaesthetist in immediately. He did this, it was his one job for me.
Second part we needed him to do was be there for the baby once born-to witness weighing, labelling etc and ensure baby was looked after and kept safe. He cut the cord but I know some men are squeamish on this and that’s ok. I did not feel connected to my first born as did not witness birth as such- it was just done ...it was important one of us was with baby and holding him right from the off.
The actual op bit he didn’t do much and frankly I was not bothered if he was there- I was more focusing on not saying I couldn’t feel anything until I was sure I could not feel anything😱
So, how about if you discuss the task and roles he needs to do and then see how it could work so he doesn’t need to witness the surgery. That he’s there if things go wonky but he knows his specific roles and he focuses on that- make it about the baby needing him
I like the comment that you don’t want to be there and witness it either- you don’t get a choice. As the father he doesn’t have a choice at being there for his baby from the first second because you can’t get up and do that.

Oh, and make sure staff know on the day what you’ve agreed and what his role is..don’t get hem to pressurise him on being involved in the surgical bit. Let him sit at back of theatre until he needed for his roles for instance

Do you have a friend who could come with you instead?

When my daughter was born I had a traumatic birth with a significant amount of blood loss. For me it was physically traumatic but emotionally and mentally it was fine. Although not being the first birth DP has witnessed I think he found it more emotionally traumatic than me, though he wouldn't admit it.

I'd actually find it a good thing that your DH has been able to say this, albeit in a cackhanded way. Gives you a chance to talk about it now. Do you think your midwife could talk to him too, to talk him through what happened last time?

Now, IF, on the other hand, he has talked at length about how traumatizing he found the whole thing, and tried to access counseling but was thwarted by this damn pandemic,

and everyone else who has said he should basically STFU and get on with it are completely missing the point that our society, in general, isn't welcoming of a man who has witnessed a traumatic EMCS saying "i need help to come to terms with this". It's difficult enough for a man to admit to having ANY kind of weakness in our society, and some of the replies here are shocking.

Of course he should be able to support his partner in an ELCS, of course he should be able to step up. Frankly he has taken a very difficult step in admitting that he was traumatised by the first birth.

Depending on how long they have, I'd definitely advise OP and her partner to seek help.

Some people seem to place a lot of emphasis on whether their partner wants to do something, rather than whether they actually do it. Personally, I think the important thing is that he is prepared to support you if you ask him to. The fact that he would prefer not to be there isn't the big issue IMO - as long as he's prepared to put his feelings aside and step up.

Except he has chosen to make that her decision instead of engaging his brain a little to see that OF COURSE she needs him there, and doesn't need the emotional baggage of knowing he doesn't want to be and thus censoring her own anxiety and needs because she's worried he's going to fold on her. Attitude matters.

I'm not saying he needs to push aside his feelings, but they are his feelings for him to have dealt with and addressed in the 9 months leading up to birth, not to just spring on her now at her most vulnerable.

My DH was there at my ELCS - he nearly passed out when they put in the spinal block (the nurse had to support him out the room!) but then was in with me for the actual CS - he didn't look down that end, so saw nothing until they had my DS out - they don't HAVE to look!!

He's also really bad with illness/blood/hospitals etc

Many people are. You lose the right to opt out of that stuff when you become a parent or otherwise take responsibility for another human being.

I don't think it should be mandatory for the father to be present at the birth. I think it should be first and foremost the woman's wishes, then the couple's wishes and hopefully both align. I do think if you want him there he has the responsibility to spend some time talking it through with the midwife/other to get used to the idea or alternatively leave you free to choose another birth partner.

If you think your mum/sister/friend would be a better option ask them instead. What matters is that you have someone and feel supported without having to prioritise the feelings of the birthing partner.

People underestimate the impact that medical emergencies have on loved ones who see it. They also have trauma from that experience and sometimes it can be worse for them, because they see it all and all they can do is watch and go through the fear of losing you.

I was seriously ill many years ago and ended up in ICU in a very critical situation. I got through it and recovered but my mum was left so traumatised from that experience that she couldn’t even step into a hospital for years, and when she started needing to because of her own health problems, she would have countless sleepless nights and panic attacks in the run up. When that experience was followed up by 6 months of chemotherapy, my mum couldn’t come to a single session with me. Yet I was the one fighting for my life, tubes coming out of me everywhere, months of recovery and chemo and scars to remind me of it.

I have a friend whose dad was seriously ill with Covid and ended up intubated. Again, even though he was seriously ill (now recovered) and might not have made it, she has really bad PTSD from the day her dad was taken away in an ambulance because of how ill he was and her belief that that was the last time she would see him.

My point is, loved ones have it tough too. They watch it all, they literally see you potentially fading away in front of their eyes, and then have to try and be strong for you.

You DH is traumatised. It’s not that he doesn’t want to support you, he’s too scared after the last time to be there. You are also traumatised and need him.

You need to speak to each other, and you should try and get him to open up about his feelings, so you can understand where his reluctance is coming from. As much as we tell you all this, you will need to hear it from him. You also need to talk about your feelings and how you need him there, and agree a way forward.

You are not unreasonable, but neither is he. I was in the same position as you, first was an emergency, second was planned. My DP is not good with medical stuff, blood, bruises, anything. If I had had anyone else who could have gone in with me then I wouldn't have had him in there. As it was a choice between being alone or DP facing it, he came in with me. We did what we could to make it easier, by keeping him well away from the business area, no one asking him to cut the cord and we had a nurse in there keeping a close eye on him who shuffled him out carefully afterwards so he wouldn't see much. It was fine, we were actually given the baby to hold a few minutes in and then he had eyes for nothing else and was glad he'd been there.