AIBU to be upset about what DH said about c section

[MsFrog]

Last night I was feeling really anxious about my impending ELCS. My last birth was long and difficult and ended in quite a traumatic EMCS. It was scary for both of us, obviously. Last night, I was saying how anxious I feel about going in now that it's getting closer, imagining the specifics and remembering last time (I know an ELCS will be different).

DH was being generally sympathetic, but then he said he might not come in with me, unless I want him to. He said if I'm "not bothered", then he maybe won't come in. I was a bit shocked. I said I was surprised that he wouldn't want to be there with me, as I couldn't imagine leaving him to go through something that big alone. He said "I know it's much worse for you, but it was hard for me as well."

I feel really upset by this. I can't believe he doesn't want to be there when the baby is born, but more than that, I'm so surprised he could hear me saying how anxious I was and then say he might not come in with me. And I being unfair to be upset? I know it must be hard for him to be there, but I feel like now I can't rely on his support at all. I had a quick look on Mumsnet, and I've seen other people's DH have felt the same and posters have said not to force the DH to be there, which makes me feel like I'm being pathetic and unreasonable.

Also I think it's a case of -

Baby delivered without complications - why wouldn't he want to be there to support you and share the joy?

Baby delivered with some complications - does he really want you to go through that alone? Not being there doesn't prevent anything going wrong (obviously let's hope that doesn't happen, but it's not uncommon for mother or baby to need a bit of help)

One factor to consider is whether you have someone else you wouldn't mind having in the theatre with you. I have had 2 cs and I would have been fine with my sister being with me. However if I didn't have anyone that was available/wanting to do it/I was comfortable with, I'm afraid I'd say to DH you have to be there.

Once he knows he is going to be doing it, he might find it easier to get used to the idea. Maybe the idea that he could get out of it, kidding himself that "you don't mind", is making it harder.

Sorry but getting cut open is way worse than being the DH in this situation. Contrary to what pp said, the screen blocks everything for both of you, he won't see a thing.

Would watching some gentle c section videos on YouTube be helpful? Might show him how different it is to an emcs and help prepare you both.

Perhaps you could also choose not to be there?

Oh yeah, not an option for you

But it is for him....

Honestly I'd be torn between raging mad, and deeply deeply disappointed that he can just choose not to be with you.

I would be asking him who he thinks should be with you, during the birth of his baby

I think he found the first birth a whole lot more traumatic than you realise. I know my DH was more aware when things were going wrong with my first birth than I was as I was in a lot of pain and not 100% with it. Crucially he has said he will go if you want him too.

Hmm I had an EMCS too and I know my DH was pretty traumatised by it (probably as much as me but in a different way). I was exhausted and then given a GA as DS needed coming out Immediately so I don't think I was aware of how scary and dangerous things were for DS and me.

I think you should speak to DH though and explain why you need him. I only have 1 DC but aren't ELCS a million miles away from EMCS?

How long do you have, OP?

He did say only if you were okay with it. So tell him you aren't and you need him there.

It's an emotional fraught time for you both. I understand your upset, completely, but try look at the positive, it wasn't an "I'm not going at all".

This birth can be a positive and calm one for you both.

I feel like a really awful person now because I read each post and think "yes that's true", but then my selfish emotions go "but what about me?! It was much more traumatic for me! And I'm the one who's been through two full pregnancies, c section recovery, as well as 7 painful miscarriages before that. Can't he be strong for 45 minutes". Which makes me feel like a completely shit person.

I don’t think you should feel shit and selfish for that. And if you should, then surely he should feel shit and selfish for suggesting he opts out when you’ve just told him how anxious you are?

I mean, either you acknowledge that both of you might be traumatised and you both have an equal right to support from the other, in which case he’s let you down a bit with that conversation. Or you decide that one person’s fear about this overrides the other’s, in which case why on earth should it be his?

I would revisit the conversation and be very clear with him about how you want him there BECAUSE you’re scared, and then suggest that if he’s really scared about it himself he takes some time to look into the difference between an ELCS and EMCS to see if that helps him feel any more reassured.

@MsFrog I'm going to go against the grain here and say that if your husband doesn't want to be in there with you please don't make him feel guilty for it. You will be looked after properly by some lovely people.

I had 3 C sections. First was a big emergency with a GA so H wasn't allowed in but did get to spend a bit of time alone with our son until I came round. Second was an emergency but I had an epidural so he was allowed in. He seemed Ok but saw around the screen what the surgeons were doing to me. It traumatised him so much that when I got home he took to his bed with 'flu' leaving me to look after our 20 month old and a 5 day old baby. Luckily for me my mum dropped everything, came over, packed him off to his mums for three days and looked after us but I don't think I ever forgave him for that. So much so that when our 3rd child was due they insisted on a C Section and we agreed he would see me down to the epidural stage then go and wait. I was distraught about having another C section and could have done with some support but as I never said anything he buggered off even before they started with the epidural stuff and I found the midwives and medical staff way more comforting. The plus side for me was getting to be the first one to see our daughter but I think he would have hated me if I had forced him to stay by my side.

I had a terrible experience for my first C Section. Although an emergency C section it was pretty laid back, until I was having the spinal when baby started experiencing severe problems and became a crash section. Normally DH wouldn’t have been allowed in for that situation, and I’d have had a general, but as the spinal was already in they deemed it quicker to proceed with that. Due to the urgency baby was out before the screen was put up. It was terrifying, but it wasn’t until much later that I realised how much it’d affected DH who had seen everything, standing around with no role think he was going to lose both of us. He was apprehensive about my planned c section for number two, but wanted to be there, and it does sound like yours is saying he will be there.
The experience of the elective section was amazing, complete opposite of my first. Relaxed and with humour.

Should add I had the similar arguments with my dh prior to my elective so it is common. I too was getting annoyed at how anxious/ self absorbed in his own worries as it was me going through it not him but i didn't take time to consider the impact of the first birth had on him and how helpless he must of felt watching me go through not being able to do anything.

Yanbu.
They put a screen up over you, he can stay top end and not see a thing. Just get him to be clear with the medical staff that he doesn't want to see the procedure.

You both must be really scared and anxious. Try to be loving and supportive to each other, but it is not a competition - who is more scared, or who is more brave. Respect and understand that it is hard for you both. You don't have a choice to attend the birth, he does. But that doesn't mean he won't, it means he has been brave enough to voice his fear

Are you kidding me??

Too bloody right it's not a competition - the OP is the one who went through labour and emergency surgery and is now contemplating the prospect of surgery again, not her DH!!! There is no comparison.

I also had a traumatic long labour ending in EMCS and it was bloody horrible for my DH - more so because he has anxiety issues and needs to be in control and in his own space to feel OK, and instead he was trapped in a hospital room with me for this unending unspecified period of time. We were both traumatised.

But I was in intense physical pain for days and then cut open. I had to heal from a major abdominal injury whilst trying to breastfeed a tiny baby. His child had to endure the strains of a long labour and then an abrupt and violent birth.

The idea that his suffering in any way excused him from taking care of us and supporting us would not have occurred to him BECAUSE HE'S NOT AN ARSEHOLE.

The OP's partner clearly agreed to have another baby; so he's had 9 months to get his head around the idea that he will need to support her in theatre. And tbh for him, an ELCS involves putting on some daft clothes and holding her hand. That's it. It's not exactly traumatic. Whereas the OP has to contemplate surgery and recovery all over again, not to mention revisiting her past physical and emotional trauma.

Too bloody right it's not a competition.

There is no excuse at this late stage for him to raise the possibility of him ducking out of his support role, especially in the context of the OP reaching out for his support due to how anxious she is! I mean what is the OP supposed to do now - ask someone else to be her birth partner at short notice because her DP doesn't want to support her?? I'd be so humiliated having to do that. Or just go through that all by herself?

Seriously any attempt to justify this just astonishes me. So sorry you're going through this OP, I hope you find someone loving and courageous who will be with you and look after you xx

If hes put the decision on you, and you want him to be there, then tell him. Tell him that you know the last one was traumatic, but you feel like you need his support here, even if its just to be up at the head end.
Its ok that hes let you know he is worried, but its absolutely fine for you to tell him that actually, as much as youd love to be able to say "no, its cool, ill do it on my own", actually you need him, and also remind him that an elective one will be far less traumatic and it will possibly be quite healing to experience it as a calm elective procedure

@Svrider

Perhaps you could also choose not to be there?

Oh yeah, not an option for you

But it is for him....

Honestly I'd be torn between raging mad, and deeply deeply disappointed that he can just choose not to be with you.

I would be asking him who he thinks should be with you, during the birth of his baby

This is a bit unfair. Psychologically, it can be much worse to be the observer in an emergency than the patient. It is incredibly traumatic to watch your loved one go through this, often wondering if they will survive. Partners often see and hear more of what is going on, perhaps seeing the baby rushed away for resus, hearing the staff quietly ask for assistance and equipment etc.

Then they go home and feel they can't talk about their perspective as it is all about the mother and baby, men in particular often think they have to be strong for their partner.

It is very common for this to only come out when it is all happening again.

OP, definitely try talking him through the procedure of an ELCS to see if it helps. ELCS are flipping beautiful! Honestly! Very very rare to hear a negative experience. Staff are relaxed and in good form, there's music on, everyone is smiling and chatty. EMCS are totally different ballgame with staff rushing in, music switched off, formal communication, no chat etc. Rushed. Everyone is stressed waiting to hear the baby cry etc.

If he still isn't keen, is there someone else who could come in? The trouble though with that is he is unlikely to be 'allowed' to swap in after the surgery as visiting is so strict so he may not meet his baby for a few days

Oh my goodness OP just read your other posts. PLEASE don't feel bad or selfish or anything like that. You are absolutely not. I'm all for partners loving and supporting each other, and your DH should definitely receive support for his trauma - but not at your expense because your was, categorically, objectively, much worse. There are other circles of support he can access, or other ways he can get support from you, but trying to duck out of being there for you, AT THIS POINT IN THE PREGNANCY.... no. HIBVVVU and you are not at ALL unreasonable if you feel let down and angry.

Practically - if you still have time is it possible a doula might be useful for you both? She's there to support you, but can also be there for your DH to help him manage his trauma and take the pressure off you to consider his needs whilst you're going through surgery. Only thing is I guess with Covid you're restricted to only one birth partner... Possibly a bit of joint pre-section counselling/birth reflections for both of you to help him get past his trauma to the point you can rely on him in theatre?

@EmilySpinach You know, you’re absolutely right. I’m being unfair. And denial IS a symptom of trauma. Unfortunately, the whole situation is unfair to both OP and her husband - unless they can find a solution, someone is going to come off worse, because he doesn’t want to go and she doesn’t want to go without him.

I think those who have recommended trying to talk to him about his specific fears (that it will not have that “car crash” like quality of an EMCS vs. the calmness of an ELCS) so that hopefully he can be there for it, are on the right track, I hope.

My concern is because this is just a website. OP is saying she feels guilty for wanting him there based on these comments, so I’m afraid she’ll tell him it’s fine but she doesn’t really feel that way. In real life, if a husband misses a birth for any other reason other than he physically cannot be there (and even then sometimes), it can affect a marriage. I’m definitely not claiming that’s fair either (it REALLY isn’t fair at all - most examples I’ve seen the woman feels awful she’s angry, the bloke had no choice about being overseas at the time, but they’re still in counseling for it), but for many if not most women, it will be one of the hardest and most painful things they go through, and it’s very difficult to not hold either a conscious or subconscious grudge if your husband isn’t there. I’ve had to watch this so many times now, and if a couple, like this one, has any chance to avoid it, I would really hope maybe they can.

OP, definitely try talking him through the procedure of an ELCS to see if it helps. ELCS are flipping beautiful! Honestly! Very very rare to hear a negative experience. Staff are relaxed and in good form, there's music on, everyone is smiling and chatty. EMCS are totally different ballgame with staff rushing in, music switched off, formal communication, no chat etc. Rushed. Everyone is stressed waiting to hear the baby cry etc.

Sorry, but WHY is it the OP's job to handhold him into HER surgery?? He clearly isn't supporting her likewise. What she went through and is about to go through again is becoming all about him. There's a lot of clear blue water between repressing his own trauma and being told to 'man up' and her far worse trauma being shunted to one side to make way for his feelings.

Worth checking - many hospitals are only allowing one birthing partner at the mo, and that must always be the same person, so if he didn't come with you for the birth, he might not be able to see you & the baby until you get discharged, if you have someone else with you for the birth. If that's the case, your needs must take precedence i.e. you want someone with you, he has to wait rather than you go alone for the op so he can see you afterwards, if that's what you want

I agree with this, don't feel pressured to give birth alone to ensure he can be your visitor after the birth. If a friend or relative can be with you instead of him then have them there if you want their support.

You are the one giving birth, you're the patient and your needs come first. If that means having your mum there for example then don't sacrifice your need for support just so DH can meet baby sooner.

Finally I agree with others that it's worth you both looking into ELCS vs EMCS. Everyone I know who had an EMCS for DC1 had ELCS for DC2 and beyond and they have all said an ELCS is much calmer and easier to cope with. So hopefully you will find your ELCS a positive experience compared to the EMCS.

Firstly hopefully to help you, my ELC was amazing compared to a previous trauma birth, and much easier to recover from. The atmosphere was much better too (very relaxed). It was very healing emotionally too for both of us.

He can be there and see nothing (hold your hand facing you). Or be like my DP who watched the lot (helloooo! I’m up here! 😂)

Expressing his fears is fine, but he made this baby and to be honest his job now is to be there to support you no matter what his fears or he’s a bit of a dick.

I've had two EMCS myself, with DH present for each of them. My first was a real rush job, very traumatic. My second was a much calmer EMCS, felt so much better (but the recovery was harder).

I wonder how your DH might think he would feel in the future, when telling your DC the story of how they were born. Would he be comfortable saying to DC1 what he was there for their birth, but saying to DC2 that he wasn't there for their birth? Maybe thinking of it from that perspective would help him come to a conclusion that he would like to be there?

I'm 8 weeks pp after an elective section with my second, first was an emergency section.

My husband struggled so much after my first, he felt useless and scared the whole time, then had to go home a 4 in the morning alone. The elective was so much better. We were chatting and joking the whole way through. Was actually quite pleasant in comparison.

I asked my husband and he says its just so much better. Everything is explained so you will both know what to expect. My husband was also more included as he went with the midwife to get baby weighed and cleaned up. Got to hold baby while they finished with ne as well.

This is a bit unfair. Psychologically, it can be much worse to be the observer in an emergency than the patient. It is incredibly traumatic to watch your loved one go through this, often wondering if they will survive. Partners often see and hear more of what is going on, perhaps seeing the baby rushed away for resus, hearing the staff quietly ask for assistance and equipment etc.

Then they go home and feel they can't talk about their perspective as it is all about the mother and baby, men in particular often think they have to be strong for their partner
I was going to say something similar.

In the event of a traumatic experience the mum and her birth partner can both experience trauma for different reasons.

I find it quite saddening that there's people genuinely of the view that he just do the manly thing, suck it up, ignore any trauma he's experiencing because he should be there. It seems to go hand in hand with overall poor attitudes to men's mental health.

OP You are absolutely not being selfish at all. It's totally understandable why you'd like him there. Part of me wonders whether he'd said nothing and buried it because the covid rules in some trusts would make the decision for him, he could avoid going back to the trauma, and then once baby is here he could focus on you and the baby.

It could be worth him speaking to a charity pr support group to clear his thoughts so he can better support you, or it might be that you have a different birthing partner who is with you for the duration. I'd certainly not give birth alone so he can visit after though.