I don't want my kids to be vegetarian

[HowToTrainYourTeen]

DC (15 & 13) have decided they want to go vegetarian. I don't want to go vegetarian and neither does DH, so they'd have to have different meals. I/DH don't want to be wasting time making 2 different meals whenever we want meat or fish, and we don't really have space for 2 people to be cooking at once. WIBU to say no?

We need carbon pricing, so that meat become prohibitively expensive

It won't though , there will be a gap in the market for "Cheap Meat"

DD and I use Alpro which is between £1-£1.55 a litre depending on offers
A 2 pint of dairy milk is far cheaper because it is subsidised . It costs the farmers more to produce but there are subsidies to make it viable .

And cheap leather shoes, cheap leather coats , cheap cashmere ,cheap fur ( I don't use any ) are cheap because somewhere along the lines , costs are cut and usually at the expense of the employee or the animal.

There's a well known saying that if Abatoirs had glass walls we'd al be vegetarian !

@NoPainNoTartine Well done for establishing I have asserted an opinion. 💯
Mumsnet is full of opinions. That's what we are here to offer.

But the facts also support vegetarianism as a better option for health and the environment.

@ladyvimes

Lots of veggies on the thread methinks.

It’s easy to make moral choices when someone else is doing all the work for you. Evidently I’m in the minority but I’d be paying for their food at that age and would not be cooking separate meals at all. I appreciate that some dinners are easy to do veggie and then add meat at the end for the meat eaters so would do this as much as possible but if I fancied steak and chips one night then I’d expect the kids to do something for themselves! If you have to respect their choice not to eat meat they have to respect your choice to eat it!

People generally click on thread titles that interest them, so there will be a lot of veggies here. Many of them have said something similar to you, i.e. adapt as much as is convenient, then ask your veggie children to cook for themselves some of the time. So most would agree that it's fine to ask your veggie children to cook for themselves on the days you fancy steak and chips.

But the respect thing isn't quite equal is it? I do respect your choice to eat meat, but most meat eaters eat meat because it's their default, they like the taste, they know how to cook it, they think that veggie food is boring/lacking in nutrients/rabbit food, etc.

I've never heard of anyone eating meat for ethical reasons, whereas that's exactly why most vegetarians choose their diet. Ethics is about right and wrong, and we can't teach children to understand that some things are wrong unless we accept that they will think about the reasons behind these choices and maybe make a few of their own too. I can't understand why some pps would want to ride roughshod over their children's beliefs just because they have the power to do so.

I don't disagree that we should pay a fair price for meat coming from healthy and well treated and decently killed animals. I have no problem going to the local farms and seeing the animals in the field that will end up in my plate.

It's also pretty obvious what vegetables are not grown locally! It's England, there's only so much that survive here in the middle of January...

Reading some of these comments are making me realise how lucky I am to have grown up with such supportive parents.
Both are meat eaters, my whole family are but I stopped eating meat at 10 years old - 15 years ago.
Bloody grateful I didn’t have some of these bigoted parents on this thread.

@generallynot Totally agree.

Teenagers are showing a moral conscience and the response could be 'sorry not convenient'

I believe that it's in my kids best health interest to eat a varied diet, fish, seafood, meat, cheese, yogurts, omelettes etc. And it's absolutely not in their best interest to have a exclusively plant-based diet.

Neither is it in my dogs interest to become a vegetarian.

@NoPainNoTartine

I believe that it's in my kids best health interest to eat a varied diet, fish, seafood, meat, cheese, yogurts, omelettes etc. And it's absolutely not in their best interest to have a exclusively plant-based diet.

Neither is it in my dogs interest to become a vegetarian.

The children haven’t asked for a plant based diet.

So on your list... they could have omelettes, yoghurts, cheese

@NoPainNoTartine
*I believe that it's in my kids best health interest to eat a varied diet, fish, seafood, meat, cheese, yogurts, omelettes etc. And it's absolutely not in their best interest to have a exclusively plant-based diet.”
They haven’t asked to have a plant-based diet, get your facts correct, they’ve asked for a vegetarian duet which includes cheese, eggs, yoghurts, milk etc. It’s not that restrictive.

I love the hypocrisis on this thread. For anything else, threads encourage parents to be parents and not let the house ruled by children.

When it's about being a vegetarian, OF COURSE vegetarian will pretend that's it's the only reasonable choice and the only right decision to make.
Most of them (on this thread) refuse to consider that anything else than their own choice is a valid one.

I honestly can't think of a single person who eat meat and animal products who refuse to eat vegetarian options as well. You have to laugh at the insistence that a meat-eater would eat meat in every single dish,

So on your list... they could have omelettes, yoghurts, cheese

if they are becoming vegetarian for ethical reasons, surely they would absolutely refuse any egg or milk produce coming from battery farm too?

As an aside, I don't buy mine in supermarkets, I have seen chicken farms, nothing healthy is coming from these hell holes.

I became veggie at 13 having wanted to since I realised meat was meat. The deal was I helped out with the cooking without complaint. Sometimes this was prepping something for all of use, other times doing a vat of ratatouille at the weekend to have with whatever the others were eating in the week. I stopped being veggie when I did a gap.year volunteering and staying with local families (UK and a meat eating part of Asia!). My parents later became veggie!
My family didn't know much about vegetarianism and the internet hadn't reached my town yet so I became anaemic. If your kids are girls please we aware of the need for iron!

If it's true that meat eaters don't want meat with every dish then surely it's an option to flex around the kids and coming to a compromise?

My daughters are vegetarian (one vegan, one pescatarian) so we have lots of vegetarian meals. If we have meat, I'll make them something from the freezer for vegetarians along with the other sides. It's not a big deal really.

There are plenty of options nowadays, it’s not like when I was a kid and hated most meat so I’d end up with a fried egg with my roast dinner!
I eat more meat now but as DD is veggie there’s so many alternatives. She was an avid meat eater and loved all meat before so wanted to find things that replaced it (I know some veggies don’t like stuff that is pretending to be meat) I’ve got her ‘fake’ steak, quorn chicken nuggets, finally found some bacon that replaces real bacon for her, she was also delighted that Linda McCartney does some Chinese duck so she could finally have ‘duck’ pancakes again. Then other stuff we don’t do the meat alternative and just have veggie lasagne with lots of veg and lentils, or just veg in a curry with paneer etc.
But I always have some frozen veggie things in the freezer so I have an easy option on days I don’t have time/energy to make 2 meals from scratch.

*if they are becoming vegetarian for ethical reasons, surely they would absolutely refuse any egg or milk produce coming from battery farm too?

As an aside, I don't buy mine in supermarkets, I have seen chicken farms, nothing healthy is coming from these hell holes*

So you are allowed to make ethical choices about a small part of your diet, but giving up meat and fish is only permissable if someone adopts a completely ethical lifestyle? What is the tipping point where the full commitment is required? How do you know you 've got it right?

Or is it being a child that is the problem? Should mum and dad make all the ethical decisions for their children until they get to 18? How do they learn to make those decisions themselves if their early attempts are ignored or laughed at?

Leather too - I went full veggie and didn’t use (where possible) anything tested on animals or containing animals or leather.

YANBU. I wouldn’t encourage it and I certainly wouldn’t be cooking for it. If they’re that bothered they can make their own meals.

I'm going to go against the majority and say I agree with OP

I eat a heavily meat based diet and I struggle to cook fresh nutritional meals for the family every day with a full time job and long hours. Even shopping is something I struggle to do at the moment on line due to time.

We do not eat a single vege meal in our house and I would not cook a separate meal for the kids

One of my children dislikes meat - not because of the animals etc but just doesn't like most meat. They also refuse to eat any pulses or many nutritious vege so I have refused to do a meat free meal for them

My 14 year old recently decided to become pescatarian, whilst groaning inside I accommodated her choice and adapted meals for her. It only lasted 6 weeks, she missed meat too much!

Or is it being a child that is the problem? Should mum and dad make all the ethical decisions for their children until they get to 18? How do they learn to make those decisions themselves if their early attempts are ignored or laughed at?

Again, if they are old enough, then they are old enough to cook for themselves.

As a parent, my role is not to let my kids go on a whim and do anything and everything. One of mine would have left school around 12 to work full time in stables if we had let them. It's lazy parenting to give in on every request and every whim.

It's not good for them to remove an entire food group from their diet. It's not my role to be the maid and start offering 4 different meals in this house either.

A woman's place is definitively NOT in the kitchen, that's a better lesson.

And I prefer teaching them the full picture - feeling all superior because you stop eating meat but ignoring all the other elements of the food industry is lazy and hypocritical.

If you come to my house and don't want meat, you don't have to eat it. If you want something specific, there are very good restaurants around.

@NoPainNoTartine why do you think removing a whole food group is a bad idea? What other ethical issues associated with food should vegetarians also pay attention to?

And I prefer teaching them the full picture - feeling all superior because you stop eating meat but ignoring all the other elements of the food industry is lazy and hypocritical

But this is exactly what you ARE doing in choosing ethical eggs and chicken and apparently feeling superior about it, while ignoring other meat, fish and dairy.

I don't feel superior at all, I just make my own ethical choices, as consistently as I can, so that I can feel comfortable with the life I lead. I don't expect others to agree or to follow what I do, any more than I'd expect them to agree with my religious beliefs. I do expect them to respect that they are deeply held beliefs, not just random fads or irrational choices based on a limited understanding of life, like the other examples you mention.

If I go to a meat eater's home for dinner, I am happy to eat a plate of veg or bring something for myself. But I also feel very grateful if someone is caring and thoughtful enough to make me something separate or to cook a veggie meal for everyone. It's nice to make people feel welcomed and respected in your home. I like to include my own children in this too.

Sorry for disappearing, got distracted last night. I'm thinking of letting them go veggie for January (eldest brings up Veganuary every year so this is a compromise - they absolutely will not be going vegan) and then seeing how that works. FWIW, 15yo is already mostly vegetarian, it's the 13yo I'm worried about as I don't really think I can say yes to one and no to the other? I can trust my eldest to eat a balanced diet but the younger one would live off instant noodles if we let her.

It's not good for them to remove an entire food group from their diet.

What food group will they be removing?