Is it okay for parents to call teachers by first name?

[thisisnot]

Hi,

At my child's previous school we referred to all the teachers by their first name, and they signed off with the same (in emails etc.).

But in this new school, despite the email address including the first name, the teacher always signs off as Mrs last name - even when I have sent the initial email with her first name.

I also sign off with my first name and she responds "hi mrs last name".

What is going on here? Is it wrong for me to call her by her first name? I don't want to be rude so I will stop if I am being unreasonable.

It just feels odd calling them mrs, but I understand there may be some etiquette I have missed.

I also don't like being referred to as mrs, but not to the degree that I would bother correcting anyone. Just not something I would use myself.

Please let me know what you think!

Plus I hate Miss/Mrs in a professional context - it should always be Ms to be professional, your marital status has nothing to do work!

But not everyone likes Ms for themselves or chooses to use it. Many people are happy to go with Mrs and Miss.

It's not up to you to select their preferred title I'm afraid. I have never been a Ms and don't intend to become one to suit other people.

I’m a teacher and I like to use my last name, so I’ll sign off ‘Mrs Jones’.

My reason is to maintain a professional relationship with the parent and so there are boundaries.

I also don’t want to become overly friendly with parents, as in my experience some will later expect special treatment for their children.

I would address all professionals by their title and surname, unless asked otherwise.

It’s not because I think they are better than me. It’s because I am engaging with them in a professional capacity. I would generally expect them to call me by my title and surname too.

It’s the starting point for professional communication. People can move on from there if they choose. Call centre workers have on their script to sometimes say ‘can I call you Sarah’ which is no doubt because modern research shows some people find titles stuffy. However, you will usually find the Doctor, optician, vet, bank manager, etc etc calls you by title and surname. They are showing your respect. I would always call them by their surname too.

See it as a thing about respect and professionalism. That’s all it is.

As a lawyer, when I'd first contact clients I would always introduce myself with my full name, and use their title/surname. I was quite happy for them to use my first name in fact I preferred it, but I only used their first names if they said 'no need to call me Mr X, just call me John'. Some preferred title/ surname and I completely respected that.

I wouldn’t sign off Mrs Wombat, even as a teacher.

I think that is a little crass and lacking awareness of professional correspondence norms and etiquette. I do understand though why you do it. In the past, you could use the correct sign-off if first name, surname , title in brackets and expect people to reply to you as Mrs.... and that professional distance would be maintained. However, these days, some parents have no sense of a professional distance and would see the first name in the sign-off and immediately start using it.....but that’s their mistake to be honest. Professionalism and respect certainly doesn’t allow trying to teach adults the correct way to address people in writing or in person. The gracious response to minor errors is to ignore it. It really isn’t something to be cross about. There are much bigger things to worry about.

Always use Mrs/mr last name as it keeps that professional distance.
Very odd and hard to remember when you've know said teacher since you were drunken teens together!!!

[quote wonderstuff]@Nanny0gg exactly, highly skilled actual medical doctors use Mr but this guy with a PhD in Geography got really upset if anyone addressed him as Mr instead of Dr. Seemed odd.[/quote]
It would take longer to become a geography teacher with a PhD than to become a doctor actually. I wonder why you don't think he was "highly skilled"?

[quote wonderstuff]@Nanny0gg exactly, highly skilled actual medical doctors use Mr but this guy with a PhD in Geography got really upset if anyone addressed him as Mr instead of Dr. Seemed odd.[/quote]
When I was at grammar school any teacher with a degree (not cert ed) wore their gowns and if they had a doctorate they did use Dr. (They'd not long stopped wearing mortar boards!)

My thinking is that Katie or Maurice Surname distinguishes them from all the other Katies and Maurices that are around.

It is not professional, or a professional distance, to use a particular form of address, it's a convention, and it may be a convention in a particular environment, but there's no moral superiority to one, nor is one safer than the other, they're just different for different people. Most work places today specifically avoid titles (because they're really difficult and a pain in the arse and potentially much more insulting than a name could ever be.)

Many people really dislike titles, particularly wrong ones - and schools rarely have the systems in place to manage it - they rarely even collect the information on preferred title, let alone have ready access for that data when a teacher might want it.

Personally I get very irritated if someone uses any title for me (although strangely not here, when someone just saying sir is fine), but I do appreciate it's just easier for them and they likely even did it out of positive thought, I will always ask people to use my name - hell I don't even like pronouns.

Matching what someone else does is not unreasonable if you're not bothered, but nor is carrying on with whatever you find most convenient, tbh stop reading the email as soon as the sign off starts, it'll save minutes of your life anyway, you already know who it was from.

Well, it’s rather petty and not very gracious to be outwardly cross about this kind of thing if you’re dealing with adults.

I suspect the getting cross was a geography teacher dealing with children. The relationship between pupil and teacher is a bit different and not equivalent to the parent and teacher relationship. Some people probably think it’s stuffy and old fashioned for pupils to call teacher by their surname or to expect to be called Dr if that’s their title, but here it is about maintaining some distance and it is enforced in the same way lots of school rules are enforced, because children would struggle to make the judgement for themselves and a simple system which is the same for all works better when hundreds or thousands of children are involved.

Some adults remember their teachers and their teacher behaviour from the viewpoint of their teenage or younger self. They still sting from a telling off or remember a comment which was made. I think teachers these days are more respectful to children than in the past, but their role still involves correcting them and teaching them a range of things which might include the title to call particular people.

Most parents call me mrs Lastname.

However, with about 10 kids in my tutor group by the end of the year they call me by my first name
as we’ve corresponded most weeks.

I address the parent/adult how they sign off their email...
I wouldn’t mind being called first name

My children's teachers always address me as 'Mrs X' whether in person or on emails. I always sign off with my first name, or first name and surname, as it feels strange to do otherwise. In no other area of life do I call myself Mrs X.

PTA meetings sometimes use first names, but otherwise it's all titles.

I’m a qualified solicitor who’s worked in a law firm and in-house for various companies - in my experience people using last names is really rare except for the very first introduction - that includes colleagues, clients, lawyers working for the other side. The idea that you have to use last names “as you’re not friends” seems absurd to me. I’m not friends with lots of people in my professional life but that doesn’t stop us using each other’s first names.

I’ve not heard any convincing argument as to why teachers are special in this regard, it just seems to be what some people are used to.

One of my sons teachers rang my work today to say my son didn't feel well and just say 'oh hi it's Lucy'. I was thinking who the hell is Lucy 😂😂 quick check of the number and recognised it was the school.

Just said*

If you were emailing a police officer, would you use their first name? And would you ask them to use yours? And would they?

Within the first couple of minutes I am asked by professionals, call centres and more what I would be prefered to be called. I also ask them their preference.

I always have to think what my gp and consultants last names are when they need to go on forms and stuff. And it's not because I rarely see them.

I will call people what they want to be referred to, and if they don't do the same back I remind them.
I have no real connection to either of my surnames. Haven't found one I like yet to get it changed.

@Fluffyowl00

I hope parents don’t see teachers as police officers!

I use Mr/Mrs and the school uses Mrs for me. I can't imagine calling the head Chris

@lazylinguist

Surely you don't sign yourself off as Mr/Mrs, though. That's hardly correct form.

What do you mean? Correct form is whatever is correct according to the convention of your workplace. But no, I sign off as First Name Surname, as do my dc's teachers when they email me. But we would still address each other as Mr Surname/Mrs Surname at the beginning of the email.

I'm also used to thinking of my dc's teachers in terms of their surname, because that's how my dc refer to them. I'm assuming your child is at primary school, OP? Once they are at secondary you're unlikely to even know the first names of the many different teachers who will teach your child, unless you deliberately try and find out.

You put Mr Fred Smith (or Mr F Smith) on the envelope but you write Dear Mr Smith or Dear Fred, Not Dear Mr Fred Smith or Dear Fred Smith. Similarly, you don't sign off Mr Smith.

It comes across as a bit insecure and old fashioned, especially when a teacher signs themselves off as Mr/Mrs/Ms to a parent, I always think, one of those ones then. 😏
I notice our HT has the good sense to sign herself off with her first name - no insecurities flying around her.
I've noticed many Doctors have stopped with this old fashioned title nonsense too. Schools are always behind the times though - give them 30 years, they might catch up!😂

@Bluegrass in my experience it differs between professional and lay clients, for example Greg Smith at ABC Plc will invariably be happy to be on first name terms; Fred Jones who is instructing me personally may prefer Mr Jones. I can't think of the last time a professional client insisted on using title/ surname, with lay clients it's always been at most 50/50.

@Fluffyowl00

If you were emailing a police officer, would you use their first name? And would you ask them to use yours? And would they?

Well no, but PC relates to their profession. Like sister for a nurse of that rank.

Orangeboots

I understand preferring first names, but to start getting into armchair psychology and decide someone is insecure because they use an established convention for their line of work is quite bizarre.