Can't stand people referring to others as a 'Karen'

[shesellsseashells99]

I'm fed up with seeing it, I really have. it's gone way too far now. I have a friend who is ashamed of her name and won't post on any public forum because of the stick she gets. Constantly seeing stupid memes.

You may think I'm being too serious but I think it's so derogatory to people who have that name.

[quote Sameolesame]@GoldenOmber have you ever heard of Emmitt Till? Have a look at the countless people brutally murder because of certain white women. Any Cooper is a modern day equivalent and let’s not imagine she is an except. Many, many Karens out there. Vladimir describes the issue perfectly. The desire to not see and continuously cry that actually it’s middle aged white women that are perennially the victims simply reinforces the Karen description. There’s no greater victims in society than the poor middle aged white woman. So much misogyny directed only at poor her.[/quote]
Yes of course I’ve heard of Emmett Till. What, exactly, does his murder have to do with women apparently complaining about customer service workers? I don’t think “demanding to speak to the manager” is really the same as lynching, do you?

@MarieIVanArkleStinks

The name Karen is just because it’s a random name that this middle aged ‘character’ might have. It doesn’t mean all women called Karen ARE this character in fact I’m sure most of them are lovely.

The point is that Karen isn't just Karen. She's Laura, she's Nicola, she's Michelle, she's Jane, she's Louise, she's Amanda. In short, she's any woman of a particular generation (X) who is just about reaching that age where peri-menopause begins to kick in and society starts rendering her superfluous. Women are supposed to sink into the predesignated silence and invisibility society has ordained for them, not start shouting the odds and making unreasonable demands dontchya know.

Do otherwise and society will do what it loves to do: invent a new pejorative to shove those upstart fucking harpies well and truly back in their boxes. Of course, the world's full of wankers and some of these wankers will treat shop assistants like shit as a way of asserting their own (precarious) sense of superiority. But as I said, wankers. And those come in both sexes and all age groups.

Maybe listen to someone who is part of the ‘group’ where the Karen ‘character’ came from.

A ‘Karen’ is a customer with an ‘I’m angry at your company and I’m going to make your life hell because I can’ attitude. It’s usually towards younger workers because they have that power over them. I worked at the complaints department of a very upmarket department store and I must have encountered hundreds of this particular ‘character’.

That’s not to say there aren’t wankers in all sexes and age groups, there are.

@DillonPanthersTexas

Haven't heard that nor seen countless memes

This is true, I have not seen it as a meme, more a case of a lazy trope dropped repeatedly into comment pieces and articles as if it some kind of valid argument.

It is awful though, I hope I don't see it around as much!

@Sameolesame

This whataboutery about men is a constant ploy to cry misogyny, turn middle age white women into the victims, and gloss over their abhorrent behaviour.

Let’s talk about the Karen behaviour that is far too prevalent.

Do please feel free to define ‘the Karen behaviour that is far too prevalent’, because it’s sounding a tiny bit like you’re conflating “woman is assertive/unreasonable in a way I don’t like” with “woman is racist” with “woman is guilty by implication of aggression and murder”.

100percentpeachynessa, plenty of us have worked in customer service roles and been yelled at by entitled wankers. Some of us were even in our 20s once!

I can only boggle in envy if you never had to deal with any male customers doing this, and they were only ever polite and reasonable.

Who was murdered because of Amy Cooper? Actual women are murdered every day, by men.

Trying to make murder the fault of women when men commit (I think, open to correction) about 96% of it is the very definition of misogyny.

In the UK, Karen isn't about phoning the police anyway but even if it was, men are responsible for their own actions.

@GoldenOmber The ‘Karen’ behaviour is towards younger retail/hospitality/complaints department workers. Who use aggression as a tool to make someone feel rubbish.

Absolutely it has BECOME used against ANY woman over 30 that someone disagrees with to shut them up and make out as if they’re that ‘character’ that would treat people in that way, even if they’re actually just a normal woman disagreeing with someone.

BUT now you know the origin of the Karen ‘character’ and how it’s originally used to describe an actual hateful person.

[quote 100percentpeachynessa]@GoldenOmber The ‘Karen’ behaviour is towards younger retail/hospitality/complaints department workers. Who use aggression as a tool to make someone feel rubbish.

Absolutely it has BECOME used against ANY woman over 30 that someone disagrees with to shut them up and make out as if they’re that ‘character’ that would treat people in that way, even if they’re actually just a normal woman disagreeing with someone.

BUT now you know the origin of the Karen ‘character’ and how it’s originally used to describe an actual hateful person.[/quote]
There does seem to be some confusion about it's origins in this thread, some other person claim it's origins come from racist women who got people lynched :/

'So why not stop doing it?! All these labels perpetuate social division and that’s not healthy.'

Exactly. Vladmirspoutine's intelligent argument seems to be 'they started it'.

Let's stop labelling and stereotyping people. It isn't big or clever.

BUT now you know the origin of the Karen ‘character’ and how it’s originally used to describe an actual hateful person.

‘now you know’, aye...

I already did know of the (various) origin stories for where it came from. I disagree with you that the misogyny is something that got attached to it after the fact. It was always there.

@GoldenOmber

100percentpeachynessa, plenty of us have worked in customer service roles and been yelled at by entitled wankers. Some of us were even in our 20s once!

I can only boggle in envy if you never had to deal with any male customers doing this, and they were only ever polite and reasonable.

In my experience men are usually less aggressive, possibly because it’s more widely unacceptable for a man to behave towards aggressively towards a younger woman in public than it would be for a woman to behave in the same way and so a man wouldn’t dare?

Oh goodness, you actually have been lucky. I have dealt with plenty of unreasonable and outright aggressive male customers.

'There does seem to be some confusion about it's origins in this thread, some other person claim it's origins come from racist women who got people lynched '

Yes it's fascinating, then in the next breath oh it's just a certain type of woman (of course) who complains in hospitality silly! I mean wtf, get the story straight.

@GoldenOmber

BUT now you know the origin of the Karen ‘character’ and how it’s originally used to describe an actual hateful person.

‘now you know’, aye...

I already did know of the (various) origin stories for where it came from. I disagree with you that the misogyny is something that got attached to it after the fact. It was always there.

I think you just want an excuse to call everything misogynistic. Just because the character is a woman I mean should we invent a male equivalent to satisfy you?

In bar work and waitressing, women are the ones hassling the low paid service staff?

I've been sexually harrassed by men in every customer facing job I've ever had.

@GetOffYourHighHorse

'There does seem to be some confusion about it's origins in this thread, some other person claim it's origins come from racist women who got people lynched '

Yes it's fascinating, then in the next breath oh it's just a certain type of woman (of course) who complains in hospitality silly! I mean wtf, get the story straight.

I seem to remember a few different videos went around of middle aged American white women calling the police on groups of young black people and so people linked that character to the sort of woman that treats shop workers aggressively. Don’t know where the lynching thing came from though😕

@MorrisZapp

In bar work and waitressing, women are the ones hassling the low paid service staff?

I've been sexually harrassed by men in every customer facing job I've ever had.

Maybe we should come up for a name of a sleazy middle aged man then! I’ve definitely come across many.

But as for my experience I’ve been treated more aggressively by women than I have men, maybe because a woman being aggressive towards another woman is sort of overlooked as opposed to a man being aggressive towards a young woman.

@PimpleMoose

I think the "there's no male equivalent" thing is a red herring. I dont think theres a female name equivalent for a 'Tom' (i.e. Uncle Tom) but that behavior isnt associated with only black males.

Aunt Jemima would be the Uncle Tom equivalent.

I think you just want an excuse to call everything misogynistic. Just because the character is a woman I mean should we invent a male equivalent to satisfy you?

You wouldn’t be able to ‘invent a male equivalent’ that had anything like the same appeal to people. Now why might that be, if you don’t think sexism is the reason?

@GoldenOmber

I think you just want an excuse to call everything misogynistic. Just because the character is a woman I mean should we invent a male equivalent to satisfy you?

You wouldn’t be able to ‘invent a male equivalent’ that had anything like the same appeal to people. Now why might that be, if you don’t think sexism is the reason?

But it’s not anti all woman it’s anti a certain sort of person who happens to be a woman. Perhaps you’re right when men behave in the same way it doesn’t contribute towards a stereotype.

For example would say to a coworker ‘watch out there’s a Karen on table 6’ whereas if it’s a man you’d just say ‘watch out for the arsehole on table 6’

'For example would say to a coworker ‘watch out there’s a Karen on table 6’ whereas if it’s a man you’d just say ‘watch out for the arsehole on table'

I always thought arsehole was a unisex term so I'd use it for both situations.

Stop using women's names to put people down.

@GetOffYourHighHorse

'For example would say to a coworker ‘watch out there’s a Karen on table 6’ whereas if it’s a man you’d just say ‘watch out for the arsehole on table'

I always thought arsehole was a unisex term so I'd use it for both situations.

Stop using women's names to put people down.

No x

So why not stop doing it?! All these labels perpetuate social division and that’s not healthy

Maybe when some white american women stop calling the police when they see black people bird watching in central park, having a barbeque in a permitted area, or black children selling water bottles on a hot day, then the meme will die a natural death? I don't use the term but I can see why black people have to use it sometimes.

But it’s not anti all woman it’s anti a certain sort of person who happens to be a woman. Perhaps you’re right when men behave in the same way it doesn’t contribute towards a stereotype.

For example would say to a coworker ‘watch out there’s a Karen on table 6’ whereas if it’s a man you’d just say ‘watch out for the arsehole on table 6’

Oh this drives me crazy when it comes to bad drivers, I've noticed if I'm in the car with a man and a woman driver does something stupid the man will say "Bloody women drivers" but if a man does something stupid he just an asshole, we might meet an equal number of assholes and bloody women drivers on a journey but the women drive badly because they are women where as the men do it because they are assholes not because they are men and it's to be expected

Get off and Same you know you will be older women yourselves too one day?! (If you are lucky). Then you’ll see (hobbles off cackling)

Oh and a man driver drove into me today on my bike. These fifty something men shouldn’t be on the roads!