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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be amazed they've released Mairead Philpott?

874 replies

MarylinMonrue · 29/11/2020 17:02

After serving half her sentence for the arson attack? Apparently even a source from the prison was a shocked at the leniency and the fact she's going to get a new identity and protection. Six children in that fire - is there such a thing as justice in this country anymore?

OP posts:
RandomUser18282 · 08/12/2020 10:30

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ at the poster's request.

Wheresmykimchi · 08/12/2020 17:55

@mathanxiety

Because of all your posts on the topic on this thread.

You seem to be gleefully using the phrase in order to question the fact that it exists.

Nope sorry you've lost me. I haven't got a bloody clue what you're talking about.
mathanxiety · 12/12/2020 09:14

You seem to think that because Mick Philpott is now serving a longer sentence than Mairead there is no such thing as male privilege.

Wheresmykimchi · 12/12/2020 11:03

@mathanxiety

You seem to think that because Mick Philpott is now serving a longer sentence than Mairead there is no such thing as male privilege.
I didn't say that. You are making a lot of assumptions here.

My point was nothing to do with the length of the sentence.

It was to do with the fact that there is a lot of sympathy and apologising for Mairead in this thread and not one for Mick. They committed the same crime. I don't know if you've seen the other long running thread absolutely slating men and tearing apart anyone who dares to defend men.

Yet people bandy around male privilege when time and time again, women are given a lighter treatment.

stairway · 12/12/2020 16:31

Wheresmykimchi they didn’t commit the same crime though, nor does she have his criminal record on which sentences are based on. She committed the same crime as Mosley. Do you think that no one has shown sympathy for men who have committed serious crimes? Particularly crimes involving women.

Wheresmykimchi · 12/12/2020 16:51

@stairway

Wheresmykimchi they didn’t commit the same crime though, nor does she have his criminal record on which sentences are based on. She committed the same crime as Mosley. Do you think that no one has shown sympathy for men who have committed serious crimes? Particularly crimes involving women.
It's not about the sentences. And she absolutely is not equatable to Mosley . These were her own children!

I can't think of an example where a man has committed something as serious as murdering his child or allowing his child to be murdered and been shown sympathy.

stairway · 12/12/2020 17:05

Wheresmykimchi you can read the judges sentencing remarks to see why she gave the sentences she did. It will give and insight into why she gave the sentences she did and why Mairead has the same sentence as Mosley. I don’t think it’s worse killing your own kids or other people kids personally, I think they are both just as bad. Though I think mothers will always be judged by society more but legally this isn’t always the case. I can’t see any female privilege displayed. If she is genuinely heartbroken that her kids have died then I suppose some people may feel a bit of sympathy even though she is partially responsible. As earlier there is often slot of sympathy for male killers, maybe not on Mumsnet but in the wider society.

susandelgado · 12/12/2020 17:12

@Autumnblooms

She isn’t very sharp and she was under complete control of the husband.

Living with it won’t be a problem as she probably doesn’t fully get what she’s done as how dense can you be to let your husband set fire to your house with your kids inside.

She should be locked up forever.

Then kids never stood a chance anyway. Shame.

Agree. In the picture, the children don't look very well nourished. They were probably neglected Sad
Wheresmykimchi · 12/12/2020 17:40

@stairway

Wheresmykimchi you can read the judges sentencing remarks to see why she gave the sentences she did. It will give and insight into why she gave the sentences she did and why Mairead has the same sentence as Mosley. I don’t think it’s worse killing your own kids or other people kids personally, I think they are both just as bad. Though I think mothers will always be judged by society more but legally this isn’t always the case. I can’t see any female privilege displayed. If she is genuinely heartbroken that her kids have died then I suppose some people may feel a bit of sympathy even though she is partially responsible. As earlier there is often slot of sympathy for male killers, maybe not on Mumsnet but in the wider society.
But this thread has shown that as a mother she hasn't been judged more.
MaelyssQ · 12/12/2020 17:43

Is this woman still of child bearing age? Is it possible she could have another family with someone ignorant of her past?

x2boys · 12/12/2020 17:44

On the back of this thread ,i started reading some of the Karen Matthews threads ,exactly the same excuses were made for her too ,that it wasn't really her fault and she had a low IQ etc .

stairway · 12/12/2020 20:00

I think IQ can make a difference though, if she had been more intelligent she would have realised how stupid and dangerous Philpott’s plan was.

WiseOwlWan · 12/12/2020 20:06

Yes, absolutely. To be able to argue with a more forceful person u need intelligence.

x2boys · 12/12/2020 20:10

But Mick Phillpot clearly wasent intelligent either to think his plan would have worked ,I don't doubt he was forceful and abusive but she went along with it .

Dongdingdong · 12/12/2020 21:05

As earlier there is often slot of sympathy for male killers, maybe not on Mumsnet but in the wider society.

Errr... no there isn’t. There really isn’t.

stairway · 12/12/2020 21:35

I think Mike just didn’t care whether it worked or not he just wanted revenge on his ex. I think there was enough evidence that he was abusive, however the judge did note that Mairead had disagreed with him in the past and was capable of doing that when it suited her.

stairway · 12/12/2020 21:45

There is a lot of sympathy for male killers. Look at the Yorkshire ripper, the police were sympathetic to the fact that he didn’t like prostitutes they only seemed bothered that he started to kill ‘innocent women’. look how serial killers are often sympathetically portrayed in films and Netflix. Even the judge who sentenced Ted Bundy appeared sympathetic towards him. Femicide in many countries is often not even prosecuted or investigated properly. There is a lot of sympathy honour killings in many communities. Not to mention crimes of passion.

Sandals19 · 12/12/2020 22:03

Errr... no there isn’t. There really isn’t.

You're right; it's more like glamourising and mythologising of male killers.

x2boys · 12/12/2020 22:12

Whilst I do agree Mick Phillpot was probably more culpable than .Mairead given his history etc she went along with it whilst she might have had a low IQ there were no apparent learning disabilities even people with low ish iq,s know that fire equals danger ,btw my oldest son has an iq of 74 he's fully aware of this

HillaryWhitney · 12/12/2020 23:09

The kids were absolutely neglected. Three of the five were wearing their school uniforms in bed.

mathanxiety · 13/12/2020 01:25

It was to do with the fact that there is a lot of sympathy and apologising for Mairead in this thread and not one for Mick.

And that is not Male Privilege, @Wheresmykimchi.

I can't think of an example where a man has committed something as serious as murdering his child or allowing his child to be murdered and been shown sympathy.

That is not male privilege either. It has nothing whatsoever to do with sympathy for child killers.

Male privilege is the pattern of discounting by the courts of the impact of male violence in families and relationships, the difficulty women face in custody disputes in the family courts convincing judges that abuse has occurred and is likely to occur in the future, the ease with which men can walk away from financial responsibility for children, throwing their former partners and children into poverty and requiring state support, the basic assumption that a father - any father, no matter how damaging - has a cast iron right of access to his children but not necessarily any financial responsibility.

Heather Kehoe had a long drawn out fight to gain custody of her sons from a man who had groomed her from age 14 and had already been convicted of a heinous crime against his first girlfriend. The basic advantage accorded to men in family courts and in cases of domestic violence in the criminal courts constitutes male privilege.

I am talking about the bedrock assumptions about the importance of a father to children regardless of the character and behaviour of the father, and the corresponding disparagement of the role of mothers, the refusal to join the dots in cases of abusive men and look in a clear-eyed way at patterns of abusive behaviour; the refusal to see a continuum and a wider pattern, the refusal to see that abuse is on a spectrum, and that all of it has a hugely negative impact on women and children, with resulting inability to deal with it either in the criminal courts or the family courts. Women have to fight the assumption that any father no matter how violent or inadequate is better for children than none and the corresponding implication that they are inadequate as lone parents just by dint of being women. The damaging impact of violence and abuse against a mother witnessed by a child in the home is ignored.

A women has to prove egregious violence against a child in order to prevent that child form being put in danger again from his own father in a visitation regime. It is incredibly hard to prove that sort of violence - it's not at all the given that most people might believe it is that an abusive man will be denied the chance to hurt his children or his ex partner again.

I do not know what it will take for society to change its mind about the impact of abusive men on their children. We are apparently willing to pay the huge price tag of male entitlement that is codified into the distinct legal advantage men enjoy over their partners and children. We pay for school disruption, crime both petty and major, the cost of underachievement in school, and prisons with revolving doors.

Emeraldshamrock · 13/12/2020 01:47

Karen Matthews is a vile character too, wasn't Shannon drugged for years after testing her hair strands.
It is really sad thinking about the DC living in dysfunctional crisis families.

Emeraldshamrock · 13/12/2020 01:49

@mathanxiety well said. 👏

Wheresmykimchi · 13/12/2020 11:01

@mathanxiety

It was to do with the fact that there is a lot of sympathy and apologising for Mairead in this thread and not one for Mick.

And that is not Male Privilege, @Wheresmykimchi.

I can't think of an example where a man has committed something as serious as murdering his child or allowing his child to be murdered and been shown sympathy.

That is not male privilege either. It has nothing whatsoever to do with sympathy for child killers.

Male privilege is the pattern of discounting by the courts of the impact of male violence in families and relationships, the difficulty women face in custody disputes in the family courts convincing judges that abuse has occurred and is likely to occur in the future, the ease with which men can walk away from financial responsibility for children, throwing their former partners and children into poverty and requiring state support, the basic assumption that a father - any father, no matter how damaging - has a cast iron right of access to his children but not necessarily any financial responsibility.

Heather Kehoe had a long drawn out fight to gain custody of her sons from a man who had groomed her from age 14 and had already been convicted of a heinous crime against his first girlfriend. The basic advantage accorded to men in family courts and in cases of domestic violence in the criminal courts constitutes male privilege.

I am talking about the bedrock assumptions about the importance of a father to children regardless of the character and behaviour of the father, and the corresponding disparagement of the role of mothers, the refusal to join the dots in cases of abusive men and look in a clear-eyed way at patterns of abusive behaviour; the refusal to see a continuum and a wider pattern, the refusal to see that abuse is on a spectrum, and that all of it has a hugely negative impact on women and children, with resulting inability to deal with it either in the criminal courts or the family courts. Women have to fight the assumption that any father no matter how violent or inadequate is better for children than none and the corresponding implication that they are inadequate as lone parents just by dint of being women. The damaging impact of violence and abuse against a mother witnessed by a child in the home is ignored.

A women has to prove egregious violence against a child in order to prevent that child form being put in danger again from his own father in a visitation regime. It is incredibly hard to prove that sort of violence - it's not at all the given that most people might believe it is that an abusive man will be denied the chance to hurt his children or his ex partner again.

I do not know what it will take for society to change its mind about the impact of abusive men on their children. We are apparently willing to pay the huge price tag of male entitlement that is codified into the distinct legal advantage men enjoy over their partners and children. We pay for school disruption, crime both petty and major, the cost of underachievement in school, and prisons with revolving doors.

I don't know why you keep explaining to me what male privelege is. I'm well aware. My male privelege Hmm comment was in direct relation to that term being thrown about when day in day out on MN we see thread after thread of men being hammered and women having sympathy and compassion and understanding.

Appreciate the rest of your post though.

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