To be amazed they've released Mairead Philpott?

[MarylinMonrue]

After serving half her sentence for the arson attack? Apparently even a source from the prison was a shocked at the leniency and the fact she's going to get a new identity and protection. Six children in that fire - is there such a thing as justice in this country anymore?

@AuntieStella

After what I read about Mick, I am amazed that she was not deemed to be under coercive control. Her circumstances were awful, she was vulnerable and it had so many hallmarks of abuse.

But the Courts found otherwise, and they will have heard more than I have read. And of course having mild learning difficulties does not in itself make you incapable of distinguishing right from wrong (though it's quite likely it makes you more vulnerable to control, and less able to navigate a way out)

What I don't understand is why someone like Mick was not sent down for much longer much earlier in his history of violence to women

The same reason people are calling for Mairead to be released so we can support her. People wanting to be kind and understanding and supportive until oops...

.

I imagine if she got pregnant again any children would be removed from her at birth. I wouldn’t be so sure of that.

My DP was removed from his parents following abuse by both of them. Including sexual abuse by his mother. He and two of his siblings were removed into permanent foster care and his other sibling was adopted at birth. Oh and my DP also has a permanent disability because of the abuse he suffered.

It could be said she was a “victim” of abuse by the father, but she still abused her children.

They split up and the father buggered off to God-knows-where. The mother on the other hand moved counties and had three more children which she was allowed to keep. And they say their upbringing was everything but perfect.

They also said that she flatly denies that anything ever happened to her former DC and that it was the evil social services (isn’t it always?) never mind that DP has actual physical evidence of her and her partner’s abuse towards him and his siblings.

And the fact that this woman is claiming to be a victim will likely mean that SS will deem her competent to have more children because he isn’t in the picture any more....

Oh my god. I watched crimes that shook Britain on YouTube and I watched the philpott episode. Evil beyond words. How on earth can they have released her.

And I was wondering if reason for the new identity is not just for her own general protection, but more specifically to prevent Mick finding her again one day - he got a life sentence with tariff of 15 years

@Grapewrath

She clearly has some level of learning need and was the victim of an abusive husband. I don’t condone her actions but I don’t think she odd threat to society

what 'level of learning need' then?

@AuntieStella

And I was wondering if reason for the new identity is not just for her own general protection, but more specifically to prevent Mick finding her again one day - he got a life sentence with tariff of 15 years

Is the third pal in or our?

they should have kept her there until she was no longer capable of having children.

The same reason people are calling for Mairead to be released so we can support her. People wanting to be kind and understanding and supportive until oops...

Is it? There's no sign he had learning difficulties or was living someone with a violent who was abusing him.

Mental health resources are stretched in this country. The suicide rate is sky high . She murdered her children. She should be left in prison im not saying forever but certainly for an amount of time. I cannot comprehend people thinking she should be let out and supported. She killed her children!

Your posts are so contradictory @Wheresmykimchi - she has been in prison for an amount of time. You were arguing a minute ago that she shouldn’t be in prison, or free to roam to the streets. You also don’t think she’s a victim, so shouldn’t be in any kind of care facility or supported. So what’s left?

@7Days

Imagine having to live in her head though.

Poor her!

@Pumperthepumper

Mental health resources are stretched in this country. The suicide rate is sky high . She murdered her children. She should be left in prison im not saying forever but certainly for an amount of time. I cannot comprehend people thinking she should be let out and supported. She killed her children!

Your posts are so contradictory @Wheresmykimchi - she has been in prison for an amount of time. You were arguing a minute ago that she shouldn’t be in prison, or free to roam to the streets. You also don’t think she’s a victim, so shouldn’t be in any kind of care facility or supported. So what’s left?

I didn't say that.

I said I don't agree with jail as a form of punishment. I don't. But I do agree with it to keep society safe (you just replied to this with the questions about how she is a danger to society ). She should be in jail . End of.

And for people saying that we should learn from these cases to stop more children coming to this kind of harm.

What would people propose then? The women who are being abused are adults. They are free to make their own decisions. So perhaps if women are in abusive relationships SS should remove their children just in case? No didn’t think so....

I said I don't agree with jail as a form of punishment. I don't. But I do agree with it to keep society safe (you just replied to this with the questions about how she is a danger to society ). She should be in jail . End of

Well, not ‘end of’ because you also said ‘ She should be left in prison im not saying forever but certainly for an amount of time’ - so again, which is it?

@TheAdventuresoftheWishingChair

Mick Philpott's record on violence towards women is horrifying

See this is what we should be focusing 99% of our attention on in this debate. A man was that disgustingly violent and abusive and yet he had his freedom. He had care of multiple children. What the hell is wrong with society? If you had taken him out of the equation many years before the crime was committed, I guarantee that woman would never have burnt her children to death. She wouldn't have thought to do it.

This

@Pumperthepumper

I said I don't agree with jail as a form of punishment. I don't. But I do agree with it to keep society safe (you just replied to this with the questions about how she is a danger to society ). She should be in jail . End of

Well, not ‘end of’ because you also said ‘ She should be left in prison im not saying forever but certainly for an amount of time’ - so again, which is it?

The 17 years she was sentenced to.

@AlternativePerspective

And for people saying that we should learn from these cases to stop more children coming to this kind of harm.

What would people propose then? The women who are being abused are adults. They are free to make their own decisions. So perhaps if women are in abusive relationships SS should remove their children just in case? No didn’t think so....

This is going to absolutely blow your mind @AlternativePerspective

We should hold men to account instead of punishing the women.

The 17 years she was sentenced to.

Fine. And the abuse she suffered? Any help getting over that?

@Pumperthepumper

The 17 years she was sentenced to.

Fine. And the abuse she suffered? Any help getting over that?

Difficult question.

The resources are stretched thin as is. Do I think she should be shunted up to priority just because she's been released from a sentence she hasn't completed? No.

@Pumperthepumper, Mick is being held to account. It's Mairead who isn't.

But if the women are choosing to stay then they are the ones responsible for any harm that comes to their children.

We can’t think of the women as so weak that they shouldn’t be held responsible for their children. So while the men should be being held to account, if the women refuse to leave then they are responsible, and the children should be removed.

In fact in many cases this is exactly what does happen if a woman refuses to leave a violent partner.

The children have to come first.

The resources are stretched thin as is. Do I think she should be shunted up to priority just because she's been released from a sentence she hasn't completed? No.

Or maybe we could start looking into help for abused women and actually put some money and effort behind it? So that she was the last women who was abused to the point of murdering her own children?

@AlternativePerspective

But if the women are choosing to stay then they are the ones responsible for any harm that comes to their children.

We can’t think of the women as so weak that they shouldn’t be held responsible for their children. So while the men should be being held to account, if the women refuse to leave then they are responsible, and the children should be removed.

In fact in many cases this is exactly what does happen if a woman refuses to leave a violent partner.

The children have to come first.

This is victim blaming in its purist form. How do you prove which ones refuse to leave over are too scared to leave? Or have nowhere to go?

Do we know that those kids were well cared for? I have wondered before if there was social services involvement. The kids were still in uniform, isn’t that an indicator of a poor home life?

His history of abusing women is horrific. It’s probable that Miread was also a victim. However, I think she should spend more time in prison, those poor poor children deserve proper justice.

@Pumperthepumper

The resources are stretched thin as is. Do I think she should be shunted up to priority just because she's been released from a sentence she hasn't completed? No.

Or maybe we could start looking into help for abused women and actually put some money and effort behind it? So that she was the last women who was abused to the point of murdering her own children?

But again you are directly linking the murder of her children to the abuse from Mick and absolving her of responsibility.

Lots of women are abused. Lots of women die at the hands of men. Lots of women can't access support.

The priority reason for funding abused women should not be by using the Philpott case as a 'look what will happen if we don't '. The two women a day murdered should be doing that.

But all of this is semantics. She has already murdered her children . So what.do you propose now? That we release her, give her lots of support for her abuse and (mild) learning difficulties so she can live a relatively normal life? After seven years in jail for murdering six children and then asking to be let out because she was a victim (indicating that she takes no responsibility. Any mother worth their salt would have taken the 17 years and spent each one knowing they deserved it).

But again you are directly linking the murder of her children to the abuse from Mick and absolving her of responsibility.

I think it’s very relevant that she was abused. Do you think she would have done it had she never met him?