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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

The betrayal of a public sector pay freeze

346 replies

Ori3 · 26/11/2020 11:37

Yes, we're facing the biggest economic crisis since peacetime. Yes money has to be found. But as a first measure, why instantly freeze the pay of teachers, police, firefighters, council staff and civil servants; key-workers who have risked so much during the pandemic.

These are the people holed up in a room looking after 30+ kids per day, supporting vulnerable people in social care, helping businesses access the furlough scheme, supplying universal credit, dealing with household emergencies, and tackling an increase in demand for urgent care services.

And their reward for helping to keep the show going? The certainty of a pay freeze for the next however many years and a conciliatory pat-on-the-head as added bonus. It's a joke.

And the awful irony of it all is that these are the sectors that protect most vulnerable and disadvantaged in our society, alongside looking after the nation's kids. They're the ones gluing it all together. Shut the schools and you've got a crisis. Stop social care and you've got a crisis. Get rid of the police force = crisis. Oh and firefighters? Who needs them? Council workers? Well all they do is push pieces of paper around and refuse to answer calls?! Get rid of them too.

In the words of Fight Club's Chuck Palahniuk:

“Remember this. The people you're trying to step on, we're everyone you depend on. We're the people who do your laundry and cook your food and serve your dinner. We make your bed. We guard you while you're asleep. We drive the ambulances. We direct your call. We are cooks and taxi drivers and we know everything about you. We process your insurance claims and credit card charges. We control every part of your life.

We are the middle children of history, raised by television to believe that someday we'll be millionaires and movie stars and rock stars, but we won't. And we're just learning this fact. So don't fuck with us.”

OP posts:
irregularegular · 26/11/2020 11:43

University staff already have no cost of living increase at the start of this academic year. Zero. And we have been working like absolute crazy. So stressful. Not sure anyone outside noticed though.

shropshire11 · 26/11/2020 11:44

I think most people value front-line workers, but public sector pay has to bear some relation to private sector pay (i.e. the people whose taxes actually cover the costs).

In the private sector, millions have lost their jobs or been furloughed, and very very few will be getting pay rises. They also receive substantially fewer holidays, inferior pensions, etc.

In this context, there has to be some fairness, or else you have a two-tier economy where people working for the government enjoy safe well-paid jobs and everyone else works hard for less money to pay for them. That isn't sustainable.

thatwouldbeanecumenicalmatter · 26/11/2020 11:49

people working for the government enjoy safe well-paid jobs

Lol

StarryFire · 26/11/2020 11:54

To be frank of the economy is closed and people are not working and paying taxes, the government cannot continue to fund everything.

This is what a lot of the lockdown supporters do not seem to understand- there cannot be an NHS or other public services unless there is a successful economy with people in work and funding them.

There will have to be huge cuts to public services to fund these lockdowns- this is just the beginning.

INeedADayOff · 26/11/2020 11:54

Nearly pissed myself at people working for the government have safe well paid jobs...

OverTheRubicon · 26/11/2020 11:57

I agree in principle, but also think that public sector pay rises have to be put in context. If those in the private sector are seeing their incomes fall on average when you take into account furlough and massive redundancies, while benefits are cut, it does seem very disconnected to go through with public sector increases.

GingerAndTheBiscuits · 26/11/2020 11:59

I’d rather keep my public sector job than have a pay rise. The alternative (and probably the reality, eventually) is decimation of the public sector on a bigger scale than 2010

LemonTT · 26/11/2020 12:00

The two tier argument doesn’t hold. We have infinite tiers of disparity in pay. Sorry but those trite comparisons don’t convince me. The public sector had a different 2020 to the private sector. Of course the average is different. This policy is a sop to the Tory right.

We need stimulus right now.

Winederlust · 26/11/2020 12:00

the people whose taxes actually cover the costs
You do know public sector workers pay tax as well right?

The difference between public and private sector is that in the private sector the sky's the limit in general terms of earning potential. That's the trade off against the holidays and pensions of some of the public sector.

I've been a civil servant for 18 years. Not had a payrise for at least 10 of those.

Point is, it's not 'us and them'. We're all being shafted, while the rich just get richer.

SoddingWeddings · 26/11/2020 12:01

I'm public sector. We don't need a payrise. We have been privileged to be in secure jobs, with furlough not possible, so none of us have lost a penny in income this year.

Many were paid to be at home full time, not working, because of childcare.

Many were paid to pick up a lot of extra work for those people and for those who had to shield.

Many agencies had no way for people to work at home so many people sat at home with nothing to do.

No, it wasn't the same for us all, yes, some have had a terrible time, but frankly we suck up a lack of payrise or we wait for the redundancies to kick off in the new year.

The privileges outweigh the downside for me.

thatwouldbeanecumenicalmatter · 26/11/2020 12:01

Public sector workers also pay taxes, think some people forget that.

LemonsYellow · 26/11/2020 12:03

I’m private sector. I haven’t had even a cost of living raise in eight years.

StarryFire · 26/11/2020 12:04

I think it is particularly unfortunate that some teachers are demanding a pay rise when a large number by all accounts did very little for 6 months of the year.

They’d have been furloughed on reduced wages or made redundant in the private sector, but they have not lost a penny despite being sat at home.

GhostPenguin · 26/11/2020 12:05

@OverTheRubicon

I agree in principle, but also think that public sector pay rises have to be put in context. If those in the private sector are seeing their incomes fall on average when you take into account furlough and massive redundancies, while benefits are cut, it does seem very disconnected to go through with public sector increases.
Under the last decade of austerity, public sector pay was either frozen or increased below inflation while private sector pay rebounded much more quickly. It is disconnected but not in the direction you think
Birdsandbeez · 26/11/2020 12:07

I guess those that have supported lockdowns are now starting to realise they will now have to start paying.

It has cost the economy billions and that money has to be got from somewhere - wait till we have all the impending service cuts and added unemployment.

Coastercat · 26/11/2020 12:09

I have worked in both public and private sectors. When times are tough, private sector workers get no increase - not ‘no cost of living increase’ - no increase at all. For years. I’m public sector now and loving it. Yes I don’t get a bonus or private medical cover but the holidays are so much better, it’s much much harder to be made redundant, the pension is INCREDIBLE, pay rises happen most years. Some public sector workers just don’t understand how good they have it!

JudyGemstone · 26/11/2020 12:10

Does anyone know if this is coming in next year or the year after? I thought payrises had already been agreed under agenda for change until 2021? They can't go back on this can they?

JudyGemstone · 26/11/2020 12:11

This one...

The betrayal of a public sector pay freeze
Birdsandbeez · 26/11/2020 12:12

@thatwouldbeanecumenicalmatter

Public sector workers also pay taxes, think some people forget that.
They do but ultimately it is the government getting it's own money back.

I'm no supporter of the Tories but they are right in realising it is the private sector that supports the economy.

Ilovesugar · 26/11/2020 12:12

I’m not sure what you were expecting? You said it yourself it’s an economic crisis. I think most people saw this coming surely?

Everyone has been affected financially in the public and private sector. It’s not a competition of who has it worse or better.

I can think of multiple private sectors that have kept the country going too; grocery sectors that will include logistics, lorry drivers. Pharmacists and medicine producers which would include factory workers. Bus drivers or anything for public transport.

I’m not sure what the point of the thread is, I appreciate the public sector but also the private. I think people need to stop pinning the two sectors against each other. The grass isn’t always greener.

WitchesSpelleas · 26/11/2020 12:12

I'm in the private sector and it's been about 7 years since I've had a pay increase that covers cost of living increase. I'm not saying that two wrongs make a right, but it isn't only public sector workers who are suffering.

Indecisivelurcher · 26/11/2020 12:12

I'm public sector, my husband is private. Similar fields. I have more holiday, better sick pay, a better pension, better job security. He gets paid £15k more than me to do an easier job that he's less well qualified for. Its swings and roundabouts. We all pay tax.

I think on balance I'm 'good' with not getting a pay rise now! However the backdrop is I've only had a 1% pay rise twice in the last 10yrs. Its the backdrop that's the issue.

If we as a country don't have the money then we don't have the money. However I would argue that they ought to stop wasting money on the car crashes that are Brexit, HS2 and trident, for starters. Oh and MPs pay rises and expenses!

Ilovesugar · 26/11/2020 12:14

Forgot to add multiple people have lost their jobs or aren’t having payrises either. It’s just the private sectors aren’t allowed to complain....most companies have a clause stating you can’t slag off the company as it’s bad for their image

DynamoKev · 26/11/2020 12:16

YANBU OP - it's a highly cynical piece of politics - shafting people just because they can.

As for all the people saying "but I am private sector and haven't had a rise for ten years" - you are part of the problem, talking each other down, trying to outdo each other with pride at how much of a shafting you've had.

Until we stop voting for Tories it will continue to be a race to the bottom for ordinary folk.

TheKeatingFive · 26/11/2020 12:17

To be frank of the economy is closed and people are not working and paying taxes, the government cannot continue to fund everything.

This is what a lot of the lockdown supporters do not seem to understand- there cannot be an NHS or other public services unless there is a successful economy with people in work and funding them.

There will have to be huge cuts to public services to fund these lockdowns- this is just the beginning.

All of this. I can’t believe it’s news to people though. This couldn’t have been more obvious.

Yes public sector workers pay tax, but it’s coming from money that was public funds to begin with.

Private sector generates the revenue that’s taken as tax receipts to fund everything else. If they are fucked, the public sector absolutely is too.

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