To complain to the class teacher?

[Whatisthisfuckery]

For the last few weeks DS has been complaining that in a certain lesson he has been seated next to a student who, quite frankly, is a pain in the arse. According to DS he’s always talking, messing around and drawing attention to himself, and the poor behaviour is preventing DS from concentrating on his own work. DS is a good student, he gets good marks, always does his work and I’ve never had a bad word from school about his conduct.

I’ve been telling DS that if he wants to be moved then he needs to tell the teacher. DS is a bit short on confidence so needs a lot of encouragement and reassurance in order to speak up for himself. Today he’s come home and told me he told the teacher that this kid was preventing him from being able to concentrate and he’d asked her if he could be moved. The teacher refused, her response was, ‘I’ve sat x there because I know you two (DS and another female student) are sensible.’

I am bloody annoyed about this. Well behaved students aren’t there to help teachers manage the behaviour of more challenging students, and why should my DS suffer because the teacher wants him to act as a buffer for someone elses disruptive behaviour? Should DS start playing up in lessons so he can get moved next to some less disruptive kids? Not only that, the teacher has refused to listen to DS’s POV and refused his request because it’s inconvenient for her to do so.

AIBU to complain to the teacher about this?

What so only children in SET 1 or 2 deemed academic need to be able to concentrate🤦🏻‍♀️

@RuleWithAWoodenFoot

Do we teach in the same place?

I had a year 7 call me the C word last week 😬
One kid set fire to the blinds... whilst screaming fuck you bitch because I asked him to give me his lighter!

I’m struggling to believe that so many parents are defending the fact that teachers use well behaved kids to buffer disruptive ones. Is it a compliment if the teacher seats your quiet studious child next to a little shit who won’t let them get on with their work? No, I don’t think so.

I get that it’s a difficult job being a teacher, and they can’t do write for doing wrong, but that’ is not going to make me think it’s ok for my child to be manipulated into being put upon. If the teacher had just said, ‘I’ll be changing the seating round next term’ I’d have told DS to just get on with it, but she used the fact that DS is sensible to basically get him to shut up. No, I’m not having that. next time she should not be so blatant about the fact that she’s using well behaved kids to manage disruptive ones.

It doesn't matter if he's doing a shit or a great job. It's not his job. I can't believe you just compared the responsibilities and abilities of a teacher with those of a child.

I didn’t interpret that from that post. Pupils do have a responsibility to focus on class (that’s not a ‘job’) and Rule is fair to put that out.
Pupils who allow themselves to be distracted (and you have to actually be in a classroom to understand exactly what I mean) are equally a problem and obviously we have no idea if that is the case with the OP or not and I am not saying it is but it is an issue as much as a chatty kid is (and it does just read from the OP that his other kid is just overly chatty).

@Choccylips

It sounds like this child needs a support worker sat next to him he obviously has problems and is disrupting everyone he sits next to. Why should your DS have to take responsibility for him. The teacher needs retraining and it needs reporting to the head teacher. Failing that get a solicitor this is a serious matter children have lost enough time this year without putting this problem on their shoulders.

Counties don't provide funding for willfully poorly behaved children to have dedicated support workers.

Slightly off topic but I was that hard working, well behaved kid getting disruptive kids sat next to me and annoying me. My mum complained and I got moved to sit and work on my own in the hallway....it backfired on us a bit.

@Whatisthisfuckery

I’m struggling to believe that so many parents are defending the fact that teachers use well behaved kids to buffer disruptive ones. Is it a compliment if the teacher seats your quiet studious child next to a little shit who won’t let them get on with their work? No, I don’t think so.

I get that it’s a difficult job being a teacher, and they can’t do write for doing wrong, but that’ is not going to make me think it’s ok for my child to be manipulated into being put upon. If the teacher had just said, ‘I’ll be changing the seating round next term’ I’d have told DS to just get on with it, but she used the fact that DS is sensible to basically get him to shut up. No, I’m not having that. next time she should not be so blatant about the fact that she’s using well behaved kids to manage disruptive ones.

You do seem to be making this into a bigger issue than it actually has to be. I like Primary your child is not sitting next to this other child all day every day and can easily be sorted if you just send an email. Have you actually spoken to the teacher or did you want to have a rant (which is fair enough if you did) ?

@Choccylips are you in some parallel universe? WHAT support workers?

And as for @ILoveAllRainbowsx No behavioural issues in grammar schools?
My children have been shocked at the low level constant disruption when they went to grammar school. Lots of precious little PFBs who have never been told to sit down, shut up, and get some bloody work done.

But then, they're the children that get the disruptive ones moved next to them.

I'm going to stop reading this thread now - it just keeps reminding me why I walked after 30 years. I loved teaching. I was really good at it. I loved teaching students to think for themselves, to question, to debate. The vast majority of students are their parents were lovely.

But some were not. They bullied, they disrupted, the closed their minds. I grew weary of the fight so I chose to save myself and walked away.

There is no money. Support staff costs money. Smaller classes cost money. There is simply no option to refer disruptive students to a support worker. there is no support worker. If you want to know what is happening to behaviour management in many schools I will tell you. It is all about what you can do on a shoestring. In practice this means keeping as many students in mainstream classes as you can for as long as you can. There are no real sanctions available. So, when faced with teenagers who have no discipline at home, who have been up all night gaming, who may not have had a decent meal in days but are allowed to eat high calorie, high sugar crap that impacts on their behaviour, who see no value in education because no one at home does - what do you suggest teachers do? Trust me if you have any ideas market them - because there are HTs who would pay good money for you to come into school with your powerpoints and video clips to peddle your ideas.

The classroom in 2020 is very different from the classroom many parents remember from their own schooldays.

Sorry Unlike Primary not I like Primary

@RuleWithAWoodenFoot

I can't believe you just compared the responsibilities and abilities of a teacher with those of a child.

I can't believe you thought it was a serious comment.

Oops.

[quote Choccylips]@asifiwould If a teacher is not capable of handling a disruptive pupil and expects another pupil to handle that child for them they should be sacked. They are obviously not doing the job properly in the first place. Why should the best pupils have to have such a disruption to their education because you teachers can't handle them. That is what you get support workers in for or don't you want to admit that you can't handle this child, do you feel a failure so use pupils as support workers so the head doesn't think the worse of you. You need to question yourself not me. I know what I would do if it was my child being used and disrupted.[/quote]
You don't have a fucking clue about what a lot of classrooms are like, do you.

What is with these threads at the moment?

It's annoying , yes. Although the kid does have to sit somewhere. Speak to the teacher.

People advising you to go to the head with this absolute nonsense at any time let alone at the moment have clearly never set foot in a school.

Someone said detentions don't work. Why not? We used to have supervised litter picking collections outside for detention, or lines, or litter collection in the packed lunchhall (appreciate cannot do that during covid). If you didn't turn up, letter sent home and detention doubled. It worked fairly well in my day. What has changed?

@Choccylips

If a teacher cannot refer a child to receive support from a support worker and expect the best pupils to handle them for them, they actually need sacking! You are not just asking that pupil to do your job and be disrupted and lose precious education time but cannot do the job yourself. Is that enough of a reaction for you.

Teachers are not asking the best pupils to handle other children for them. They're not asking them to do their job. They sometimes tell them to sit next to them. That's all.

You're being ridiculous.

OP you have a point. It’s not your son’s job to manage feral kids. Neither it is the teachers, to be fair. It’s the parents. So if they archers cannot manage these kids, they shouldn’t be in school, mush less disrupting others who want to learn well. You should complain.

@Choccylips

If a teacher cannot refer a child to receive support from a support worker and expect the best pupils to handle them for them, they actually need sacking! You are not just asking that pupil to do your job and be disrupted and lose precious education time but cannot do the job yourself. Is that enough of a reaction for you.

I can't believe I'm engaging this but I will.

Firstly there is no such thing as a support worker. Secondly , there is funding in place for support needs and a teacher cannot request this. Thirdly, if it did work like that and we were called for every 'disruptive' child. based on the word of a child we'd need more support assistants than teachers. Indeed , if a teacher was making noise about wanting a support worker for a low level disruptive child , that would cast far more doubt on their abilities than not.

Also it's near on impossible to sack a teacher.

You haven't got a clue.

@SillyOldMummy

Someone said detentions don't work. Why not? We used to have supervised litter picking collections outside for detention, or lines, or litter collection in the packed lunchhall (appreciate cannot do that during covid). If you didn't turn up, letter sent home and detention doubled. It worked fairly well in my day. What has changed?

Parents who think litter picking is tantamount to child slavery.

@SillyOldMummy

Lots of parents actively tell their little darlings they don’t have to stay for a detention.

We used to do house detentions on a rota but now we can’t mix year groups

Some kids actually want to sit in a detention rather than go home

Some kids are so fill up of other subject detentions you have to book them In 3 weeks after the event

@sst1234

OP you have a point. It’s not your son’s job to manage feral kids. Neither it is the teachers, to be fair. It’s the parents. So if they archers cannot manage these kids, they shouldn’t be in school, mush less disrupting others who want to learn well. You should complain.

Feral?

OP mentioned low level disruption. 'if teachers can't manage kids they shouldn't be in school ' you lot are so entitled it's actually amusing

@Weepingwillows12

Slightly off topic but I was that hard working, well behaved kid getting disruptive kids sat next to me and annoying me. My mum complained and I got moved to sit and work on my own in the hallway....it backfired on us a bit.

Jesus don't say that in here. This lot will be saying you should have complained to the director of education and be booking you in for counselling.

On a serious note , a child being known for not being willing to sit beside anyone less than perfect generally doesn't fare well.

Someone said detentions don't work. Why not?

We are not able to give out detentions at the moment, due to Covid19 anyway.

They sometimes tell them to sit next to them. That's all.

You know very well that sometimes that's definitely not all. They also have to deal with the constant chatter,sometimes inappropriate language,topics or behaviours. Their things being manhandled or stolen etc.

DD was specifically told she was sat next to X to "calm him down" and to help him with his work.

If there are no support workers to handle the disruptive pupil, the teacher certainly isn't handling him just shifting the responsibility onto another child then what is the answer because it appears his parents have definitely not taught him any discipline. He obviously needs assessing for support help or guidance but not from another pupil.

@asifiwould

I hear you, and I'm just support staff. I feel grateful every day that I decided against being an actual teacher. They have an impossible task these days, it really isn't like when we were at school. I also can't believe that some people are saying that kids who get distracted by these disrupters are an issue themselves. Victim blaming or what? What happens is when kids get so disrupted by a fellow pupil to the extent that their anxiety builds up and up then they just GIVE UP trying to do anything. THe teacher doesn't seem to be hearing them, no-one is noticing that they can't concentrate. This is NOT that child's fault. I've seen so many good kids come into secondary school really well behaved, but because of 2 or 3 problem kids taking up ALL the teacher's time, or disrupting the concentration of those around them, the well-behaved kids just give in and don't even TRY to concentrate anymore, as to their mind, what is the bloody point?

It's hellish in schools, terms of problem behaviour. The poor teachers have nowhere to take the issues. SLT don't want to know. They blame the teachers too. The good teachers who've been in the game a long time get far too frustrated with this attitude and lack of support or options and decide to just leave. So schools are left with inexperienced young teachers who come in, see the generalised poor behaviour and accept it as the school culture.

We should not tolerate this. It isn't normal, and we should try to expect our better behaved kids to just live with it.

What the answer is, I don't know. It's a multi-faceted problem.