Stop asking if I’m Mrs or Miss

[catspyjamas123]

I just hate it when companies ask if I’m Mrs or Miss - what business is it whether I’m married or not? I’ve politely put up with it for years but it makes me fume. They don’t ask men if they are married. Even worse, some companies assume I am a Mrs. I am NOT. I am very happily divorced and definitely a Ms. Are they being unreasonable? Vote yes if it’s a completely unnecessary intrusion into your home life. Vote no if it’s quite alright to all live in a 1950s nightmare!

Yes, I do seriously believe marital status has no bearing on promotions or pay rises, based on a 45 year professional career. I’m perfectly willing to believe women with small children get passed over, which in the latter part of my working life worked to my advantage, despite being ringed like a pigeon.

You really are naïve if you think marital status has had no bearing on promotions or pay rises during your professional career if it is spanned 45 years. Just because you haven't been discriminated against it doesn't mean nobody else has . In the 80s and 90s some employers would quite openly state that they would be less likely to employ a woman who has recently married because they might go off on maternity leave. They wouldn't necessarily admit to it nowadays but I'm sure it still happens.

Asking your title isn't asking your marital status it's verifying whether you prefer to be referred to as Miss, Mrs, Ms, Dr, Prof, Dame?? In the same way a man would be asked whether his preferred title is Mr, Master, Dr, Prof, Sir?? How is that in any way shape or form offensive or intrusive??

Men have options if completing a form but they are never asked verbally. Women in contrast are usually asked if they are Miss or Mrs. Try saying you don't have a title and you will be told you have to have one.

You can never be sure you are not paid less due to marital status or gender unless you have full transparency about the pay of those on an equal footing. You’re unlikely to get that in the private sector. The public sector can be different but you only have to look at BBC pay to see women are not treated equally.

Equal pay - or the lack of it - has nothing to do with marital status.

some employers would quite openly state that they would be less likely to employ a woman who has recently married because they might go off on maternity leave. They wouldn't necessarily admit to it nowadays but I'm sure it still happens

I’ve a acknowledged this in relation to women with children. Given that so many unmarried couples have families now, I very much doubt it happens in relation to marital status.

You really are naïve if you think marital status has had no bearing on promotions or pay rises during your professional career if it is spanned 45 years. Just because you haven't been discriminated against it doesn't mean nobody else has . In the 80s and 90s some employers would quite openly state that they would be less likely to employ a woman who has recently married because they might go off on maternity leave. They wouldn't necessarily admit to it nowadays but I'm sure it still happens.

Thankfully we are not in the 80s or 90s anymore! I have never heard about discrimination based on marital status in this country either and that's my professional experience too. Not from the 90s, that's was 30 years ago!

Thankfully we are not in the 80s or 90s anymore! I have never heard about discrimination based on marital status in this country either confused and that's my professional experience too. Not from the 90s, that's was 30 years ago!

I mentioned the 80s and 90s because the poster said that women have not been discriminated against based on their marital status during her 46 year professional career. Even if they aren't discriminated against now (I would dispute that) they certainly have been in the last 46 years.

I’ve a acknowledged this in relation to women with children. Given that so many unmarried couples have families now, I very much doubt it happens in relation to marital status.

They didn't have children. That's my point. The fact that they were married suggested to the employer that they might have them in the near future.

If asked, I use Ms, but as you can use whatever you like, l think there are bigger issues to worry about.

@Belladonna12

I’ve a acknowledged this in relation to women with children. Given that so many unmarried couples have families now, I very much doubt it happens in relation to marital status.

They didn't have children. That's my point. The fact that they were married suggested to the employer that they might have them in the near future.

You don’t have be married to have children. Around half of parents aren’t. This is like trying to debate with an eel, you just can’t stick to the point, can you?

Next time someone asks me in person, I'm going to say "Oh it doesn't matter..you choose...I don't care.

And they'll be and might say "But how do I know if you're married or not?" and I can say "Well you don't! Because I don't choose to tell you!"

Saying it doesn,t matter you choose is odd, as it,s not just about marriage 4 of my family go by Dr and thats male and female.

" Given that so many unmarried couples have families now, I very much doubt it happens in relation to marital status."

I think it probably still does. It's still quite a strong indication of possibly having children in the next few years, even if unmarried people also have children.

Saying it doesn,t matter you choose is odd

No more odd than making only women state their marital status on paper. Oh...unless you're a Doctor.

You are not being asked whether you are married, you are being asked what you choose to be called.

Certainly, on forms etc, it should not be mandatory.

I also have single friends who opt for Mrs.

Slightly dafter, the correct term for a female surgeon is Mr!

One of our fairly recently new recruit just went away for a few months on adoption leave... He's not married. And he's gay

Back in the real world, the time assuming that only "young married women" are a risk is long gone! It might have been true in the past, it certainly is not now. I cannot think of ONE company putting on hold recruitment for any female between the age of 20 and 45, married or not, because they "might" chose to have a baby.

The world really no longer works that way, your marital status is so irrelevant.

No it is odd because you may ask a man as well I know rev and dr not every one is Mr or Mrs/miss/ms.

Back in the real world, the time assuming that only "young married women" are a risk is long gone! It might have been true in the past, it certainly is not now. I cannot think of ONE company putting on hold recruitment for any female between the age of 20 and 45, married or not, because they "might" chose to have a baby

i am 49. I took voluntary redundancy in my late 30’s as my company offered it just as dh was setting up a business and needed help, and my kids were starting school.

Interestingly, after a year I started looking for employed work again. I did not get one interview until I turned 45, when suddenly I was getting an interview for pretty much every application.

My qualifications and experience hadn’t changed. In fact I’d been out of the workplace for longer and longer...

I can only infer that I’d aged out into a demographic where it’s assumed I have older teens or adult children, and no longer need to be leaving early or taking time off for child illness/nativity plays etc...

Interestingly enough, the main complaint I hear is that employers are less interested by "older" candidates...

As an anecdote, at least half the mothers in my kids primary school are in their 40s as it happens. I have even seen a few "50s" celebration posts.

Things have changed too much to keep away half the workforce.

I think next times someone asks me I'll just say "neither".

The employment bias against married women, who might have a child is still alive and well, especially in small businesses. Oh, they'll play lip service to the rules, say someone else was better at interview, but it still happens. And that's regardless of whether the employer is male or female. Even the younger employers are biased. Not all, but certainly a proportion of employers are still thinking this way.

I know 2 small business owners, both female, who have said to me that they won't hire women in the usual child bearing age bracket, because they can't afford the hassle and costs associated with maternity leave, maternity cover, etc, etc.

There is a rather easy solution here:

“Are you Miss or Mrs” : Takes 5 words to say and is only ever said to women.

“What is your title please?” : Takes 5 words to say and could be said to any gender.

Some might say “Mr”, some might say “Dr”, some might say “Ms”, some might “Reverend” and some might “7th Earl of Fancybollesuxeaushire”.

There’s always an easy way to not be sexist and still find the information one needs for the form.

🤷‍♀️

Although I must add that I love being asked in the singsong voice “Are you Miss or Mrs” and I LOVE saying - “Neither. It’s Dr.”

I know 2 small business owners, both female, who have said to me that they won't hire women in the usual child bearing age bracket, because they can't afford the hassle and costs associated with maternity leave, maternity cover, etc, etc.

I am sure it happens, but it means not employing any woman between 18 and 50, and the huge assumption that fathers won't take parental leave.

Practically, they are shooting themselves in the foot big time.

@ExpensivelyDecorated

I think next times someone asks me I'll just say "neither".

the problem is, the person asking you is unlikely to be the one who created the forms and it's likely the system will demand they put something

*I am sure it happens, but it means not employing any woman between 18 and 50, and the huge assumption that fathers won't take parental leave.

Practically, they are shooting themselves in the foot big time*

Really? We see on here that 99% of partners that reduce hours or quit to become sahp are the women. It’s usually the woman that takes on the bulk of child responsibilities like school runs and child sickness.

Dh has struggled in his industry - child caring is still seen as a womans job- if he says he’s leaving early to pick up the kids the response is quite n “can’t your wife do it?”

Many stories too of schools always phoning the mother, even if told not to, as the assumption is “dad is busy at work”.

In my large industry it is very rare for dads to take parental leave.

In theory, job roles and family balancing should be more equal. Fact is it’s not.

Not to say it doesn’t happen, but your chances of an employee’s work being affected due to children is vastly increased if that employee is female.