AIBU to not let the father of my child take her abroad once a month?

[tuesdayschild17]

My daughter was unplanned with a partner who I had not been seeing for long. When I found out about her, I informed him and gave him the option to walk away. We did not stay seeing each other romantically after this time.

He chose to be involved in her life and has his name on her birth certificate (allowing him joint parental responsibility). She is nearly 4 now and he has seen her throughout this time with various levels of consistency. His family live abroad and also wish to be involved. I have done everything I can so far to facilitate contact, allowing them to stay in our house and look after her for weekends occasionally and letting her go on holiday to their country with and without me.

However, there have been large gaps in between him/them seeing her where he has been bad with contact. He has either been struggling with addiction issues or just unwilling to be around during these times. I have tried to still remain understanding, believing that it would be best for my daughter to maintain a relationship with him. Unfortunately, after she spent a week away from me in the Summer with his family abroad, I started to reconsider this. Her behaviour was really unsettled when she got back. She suddenly threw more and more tantrums and wouldn't eat properly. The nursery separately commented on a big change in her behaviour and asked if she was unhappy. I felt that this was a result of the change in circumstances and being away from her home at such a young age. Obviously the typical 'we don't have to raise her, so we can say yes to everything' came into play too.

Initially, I was raising her with substantial help from my own mother in terms of costs/childcare. However, since the beginning of this year, I have been doing it solo as a student and with a part-time income. Her father has a well-paid full-time job. Prior to September, I had never asked him for financial support as I didn't want to scare him away from a relationship with her. However, the financial strain of raising her single meant that in September, I asked him to begin contributing. We are struggling to come to an agreement.

As part of his side of the bargain, he wants me to agree to her travelling abroad once a month for a weekend to stay with his family. I am unwilling to do this because I feel it would be really unsettling for my daughter and cause more problems with her behaviour. I have agreed to give him access every other Sunday though, (which is the most regular he wants), as he does have a residence that he's renting and living in near where we live. AIBU to say that I will not agree to her travelling abroad and being away from me overnight, once a month while she is so young? (travel time would be around 5/6hrs each way). He Is threatening me with court, do you think a court would force me to allow this?

Any advice appreciated and sorry for the lengthy post.

And that by January regardless of the COVID situation he should be taking her abroad. Bearing in mind I am asthmatic and a bit worried about the risk. His response to that was that I was choosing to have her in nursery (which is for her wellbeing as she's an only child and very sociable, and also so that I can work/study to provide an income), and therefore already taking risks.

He's an arch manipulator isn't he! Has an answer for everything! And you have been far too nice and accommodating for far to long. You don't have to justify sending your DD to nursery; she's 4 so its good for her and faciliates your study. There is no should about him taking your DD abroad. This is a man who can't be bothered to do 2 x 90 minute round trips once every 4 weeks in order to spend a day with his DD but wants you, who never has a childfree day take on one of these trips for him. And yet he expects a 4-year-old to take a 10 to 12 round trip once a month in order to see grandparents that she does not really know. This and turning up really late for contact (and 3 hours is an eternity for a small child) suggestd he doesn't really care about her at all. In addition, if he says he can't afford to pay maintenance, how is he going to finance all these flights! I don't know how he has convinced you he is a moral person; he really sounds awful.

Get maintenance sorted right away. A third party like the CMS is neutral and will not fall for his manipulation. This way you do not have to engage with him at all. And if the money comes through you will have more to pay for legal help.

FWIW, his travel proposal sounds absolutely ridiculous; you don't need Covid or anything else to make it so. My mum was from another country with family a similar travel distance away. In an age before cheap travel, we visited on average every other year. The idea of having to do the trip every month as a small child even with my lovely mum who was a constant presence in my life, fills me with horror. How much more so with a dad who is just an occasional and sporadic visitor!

Not a chance, no way

@tuesdayschild17

They are in Ireland.

I mean @PaperTowels he would have to illegally break the lease on his flat and also quit his job and break COVID travel law to do this currently. He has been a twat, but he's yet to have ever not returned her at the appointed time or surprise me with unexpected travel plans. I am not saying it isn't a possibility.

The fact that it's Ireland, I would be less worried about him just staying there and you not getting her back tbh (I'm Irish) and I think our authorities wouldn't protect him if he just took her and held on to her. I still wouldn't agree to her travelling every month like that, it's too much for a young child and too unsettling as well

Yes, worries over him disappearing with her are not such an issue with Ireland.

I just wanted to say that it really comes across how much you love your daughter and are trying to do what is best for her. Do not beat yourself up about any choices you have made. The summer holiday was an unknown. Each child responds differently. You have tried to give him the best chance possible to prove himself- that is important.
I just really empathise with how hard it sounds when he isn’t working, like you are, to keep her centre of all decisions.
She is lucky to have you.

Ireland less of a problem in terms of language and distance, but it's still a separate country with its own jurisdiction. Question mark about any existing EU conventions or protocols between ROI and UK after 31 Dec this year, due to Brexit.

It all goes on the child's "habitual place of residence" which AFAIK is 6 months, so if she's been resident in the UK all her life and he did just take her back to Ireland and refuse to return, OP would be v likely to "win", and the father would come off worse in any future custody order, due to having breached the existing arrangement.

But obviously as PP have said it's all about what's best for the child and clearly all that travel at such a young age is detrimental.

There is a common travel agreement between Ireland and uk. He could arguably go from Scotland to NI and there are no passport controls to drive into the 26 counties. Photo ID is recommended for the ferries but I don’t recall ever being asked for children’s ID (someone else may shed light on this.) He could easily circumvent the passport issue.

Personally, I wouldn't let my child go abroad until she is old enough to use a cellphone.

He may never bring her back. I would take this to court

You can prevent him from taking her abroad but he could do it to you as well! Just something to keep in mind.

Also, I feel like the going abroad part and the 'unsettled when she comes back' are not necessary linked. If your DD was spending the weekend in the UK but with the same people the end result might be the same (it happens with my sister's DD even though her ex lives locally, he and his parents just feed her treats and let her do what she wants).

What I am saying is maybe try to separate both issues: the weekends abroad could maybe happen once a month, with the view to increase to twice when we reaches a certain age and/or if she is not too unsettled when she comes back.
The tantrums on returns IMO is the real issue and you need to find a way to make your ex care... if he loves your DD hopefully he will get it.

@CecilyP Thanks for taking the time to address all of this. I do feel like he's manipulated me into feeling that his demands are totally reasonable and that I'm somehow denying him his paternal rights. It's frustrating when I've given him so much leeway previously.

@AryaStarkWolf Thanks for the reassurance!

@Somewhereelsewhere Thank you so much for these kind words. I honestly love her so much and picturing him letting her down hurts. Equally, I have a good relationship with my father who divorced my mother when I was very little. I was terrified that by scaring him away, I was ruining the opportunity for her to have the same.

@Alys20 @Blueberries0112 My main concern is that the travel will be detrimental to her and that's why I'm refusing to consider it at the moment. I just don't think it would benefit her.

@TinaTurnoff True. I will say that he's been reluctant to ever do 'more' than his agreed amount of solo visits with her and so he's unlikely to ever commit time and planning into secreting her away illegally. Especially as I believe he's aware of how this would affect him if it ended up in court.

@NoSleepInTheHeat My DD has spent a weekend with my dad/stepmother without me and seemed very comfortable on her return. The change in her after the holiday was really noticeable and not just to me. I am also not just concerned about her being unsettled after, but also that 12hrs travelling once a month will knacker her for the week ahead, particularly once she starts school.

I've tried appealing to him emotionally about the fact that being away for so long affects her happiness, but he refuses to address this. He is an incredibly emotionless person and often I've felt that he stays in contact with her sporadically because of being 'seen to do the right thing' rather than genuine love. I think he is also pushing for the abroad visits because of his parents desires, and because it would be a way for him to have her overnight without the responsibility of it.

How would the travel even work realistically once she starts school?

At best, she could leave after school on Friday, get there very late Friday night. Spend Saturday there. Then fly back Sunday.

That will be exhausting for a small child and crazy to do every month, especially when it's not at all necessary to see her father.

It would be better to suggest slightly longer visits in the school holidays, that shows you are trying to be reasonable but also putting your daughter's needs first.

Well, he’ll have to address all the issues, like it or not. He cannot interfere with her schooling by exhausting her with travel. Also in the future he will have to accept that she might want to attend after school activities/sports, or Saturday morning things. A court would definitely support this. She isn’t a doll to do with as he likes, she is an individual with needs and interests, and chances are when he realises how this complicates his life he will become flakey again.

I've been down the court process.
I can only base my answers on my own experience. They did take into consideration addiction issues I raised, he denied- court acted with caution so did caffcass report.
The difference in my situation is myself and ex had raised kids together (married)til he left then he got very involved in drugs. Was inconsistent with contact failed to show up etc.
The court awarded me residency and awarded him less than I had offered. He could have them up to so many nights per year but the wording of the order was that I could refuse.
He like your ex threatened me with court said his father would pay so I became proactive and proceeded with it myself as I was fed up with bullying horrid messages, and inconsistency with contact. I represented myself but I kept all messages etc EVIDENCE!
I think someone mentioned about him being there between 9-12 probably not saying defo but it's very easy to fall down the rabbit hole addictions so it would fit with being fit to drive.
Yes maintenance is separate no need to bring that up with contact. Cms all the way don't accept direct pay though (just my experience)
I wasn't required to drop them off also.
Good luck babe don't back down you know what's best.
Also he never really bothered with court order as it was all just a control thing he at this current time hasn't seen them since beginning October or spoke/text since end of October.

@CecilyP Thanks for taking the time to address all of this. I do feel like he's manipulated me into feeling that his demands are totally reasonable and that I'm somehow denying him his paternal rights. It's frustrating when I've given him so much leeway previously.

Do you have anyone in real life that you could discuss this with and sounding board to guage his behaviour. Perhaps a more forthright girlfriend or even your parents. I would imagine you spend a lot of time just you and DD but having other adults to talk to who could be objective would be really helpful.

[quote tuesdayschild17]@NoSleepInTheHeat My DD has spent a weekend with my dad/stepmother without me and seemed very comfortable on her return. The change in her after the holiday was really noticeable and not just to me. I am also not just concerned about her being unsettled after, but also that 12hrs travelling once a month will knacker her for the week ahead, particularly once she starts school.

I've tried appealing to him emotionally about the fact that being away for so long affects her happiness, but he refuses to address this. He is an incredibly emotionless person and often I've felt that he stays in contact with her sporadically because of being 'seen to do the right thing' rather than genuine love. I think he is also pushing for the abroad visits because of his parents desires, and because it would be a way for him to have her overnight without the responsibility of it.[/quote]
Oh I get it, this is exactly what my sister experiences when her DD comes back after a week at the ex-ILs. Overwhelmed, in a bad mood after too much sugar and screens, tired, tantrums...

@dreamingbohemian I agree that the travel would be crazy during term time. I'd consider longer visits during holidays if he'd been consistent with the daytime visits for a significant period of time beforehand.

@girlywhirly I agree. There is definitely an element of treating her like a doll and I'm glad you think a court wouldn't support this.

@oldstudentmum wow thanks so much for sharing! I'm really glad to hear that a court takes into account these issues. I'm sorry that your EX is still so hopeless like mine but thank you for all the advice :) much appreciated

@CecilyP I've talked to my parents about it but their opinions seem to change all the time and also I think they are sometimes affected by their own opinion. As I am slightly younger, none of my peers are parents yet and able to offer advice although I'm luck that they are all supportive!

@NoSleepInTheHeat It's so frustrating isn't it? The difficulty is that dealing with the aftermath of travel exhaustion and no routine every month feels a bit too much on top of everything else. I'd rather DD established a consistent routine that worked around her needs instead.

Update: I have informed him that I am going to go through CSM and taken all the previous posters advice to tell rather than ask him what her current routine will be. I've said that I will continue to facilitate visits every other Sunday: on the basis that he arrives at the set time (or I'll take her out) and drops her back on time too. I've stated that I won't sign any parenting plan that he's provided. I will also not commit to readdressing the issue of overnight stays until he has had consistent Sunday visits for over 6 months. And at that point, only if he had suitable living arrangements/it seemed it would be beneficial for DD.

Thanks for all the help. I definitely feel less threatened by the possibility of court now and more willing to seek legal advice. Any additional advice is still very much appreciated :)

@tuesdayschild17

Oh well done you! I think it sometimes helps to air things and realise that, actually, you hold all the cards here and with the strength of the right information, you can make the correct decisions for your DD.

He will hate this of course, it's a loss of control. Especially the CMS thing. However, unless you do this officially, it'll become a stick to beat you with. Let him make an application to court, if he actually does. They often threaten this and don't go through with it, however, if he does, then you know what to do or you post and there will be many, including me, who can guide you through. Well done!

Oh wow, well done!! I'm glad this thread has been so helpful to you.

He may start to become very nasty now so do be careful. Legal advice is still a very good idea.

I haven't RTFT, but this stood out for me:
I am fairly certain he needed the letter alongside scans of my passport etc. because I also have parental responsibility and he therefore needs my permission to take her abroad. It could just have been a precaution though?

With a child from a man from a different country (I have one) you really need to get up to speed on the legal ins and outs of taking a child abroad by the other parent.

Forwarned is forarmed and all that.....

Reunite is an organisation for parents whose child has been abducted abroad. There is a wealth of information there for you.

www.reunite.org/

Sorry if it's been mentioned already.

All the best. You sound like a great mum.

Well done for making a decision and telling him how things will be. It will be much better for DD if she can have a routine where she comes home after each contact rather than being transported away and is tired. She will need that when she starts school. Plus he will have to step up without his parents doing his parenting for him.

Well done.

Brace yourself for some name calling. Threats etc.

Dont engage. Take your time about responding to any further demands. If at all.

Good for you!
I think the «prove yourself for 6 months and we’ll see» is quite smart as he can’t say it is unfair and as an added bonus your DD might see him more often/more consistently. Win win!

Well done for advocating for your dd. He’s going to be horrible now. But you’re in control.