Anyone else annoyed when someone saying 'get a job'

[RUNFAST11]

Before COVID it was still hard to find a job but now it has become more difficult.

Recently, Dispatches showed a programme where there were 947 applications for a waiter role at a Manchester role and the pay was around minimum wage. And the person who got that job was later told they could not be hired due to the new lockdown restrictions.

www.thelondoneconomic.com/business-economics/minimum-wage-restaurant-job-receives-947-applications/02/11/

Unemployment is likely to rise and could reach double figures in 2021. Getting a job is not as easy it was in the past where you could walk in and get hired. Now you have things such as: online applications, Skype interviews, Face to Face interviews, Online tests etc...

To the person who mentioned that the dole office is open. It's not. You can now get your benefits without that dreadful feeling of shame every week.

Not half op.The reduction in jobs has been happening for years, along with the reduction in the real worth of wages. At least now everyone can see it happening and is prepared to admit it. "Get a job in a shop" has particularly annoyed me lately because I used to work in retail, in supermarkets, and I could do checkout and customer service work in my sleep: but I've taken one look at the 'personality profiling' rubbish they do now and there's no way I'd pass just to the interview stage. Then they make you do all manner of irrelevant hippy-clappy crap in the interviews too. To pass the personality tests you need to be either totally innocent and oblivious to the breakdown of the economy, or an incredibly good actor: as an embittered 40 something with very little to show for the last 20 years of work I have no chance. To pass the interviews you need to be highly extrovert, confident and outgoing, and the mere ability to do a job you've done before gets you nowhere.

What I am finding is that the pay for most jobs seems to have dropped drastically, employees seem to want massively more from people plus several years experience but only want to pay entry level salaries.

This is true too. They require experience even when you don't need it - in retail I used to train people to operate checkouts in one afternoon, experience is not required yet it is demanded nowadays. Then you have jobs for what are called "assistants" in various sectors. Years ago such jobs used to be generic and pretty transferable. Now you often need sector-specific qualifications. In my own area "assistant jobs" paying £20k now come with a list of job requirements that used to be considered those of a qualified "professional" 25 years ago, and paid £30k. Meanwhile house prices went through the roof. I am totally sick of it all.

After 40 years in the employment market, I would love to know more about this mythical time when people could just turn up and just walk into a job. Never happened to me, and I was working in London in the 80s. I was made redundant from 3 jobs in a row due to variations in the economy, have been through at least 3 recessions and am frequently told I am overqualified for positions. Yes, I have managed to get jobs but it has always been hard. Not long after I left school 3 million people were unemployed, anyone remember that time?

I think get skilled and keep applying. My last two jobs have been about luck. Being in the right place at the right time. But having skills massively helps. It's about what you can do, rather than what you know.

This pisses me off. I’m highly experienced and skilled at what I do. I have a good work ethic and a spotless job history. But when redundancy hit the fan before COVID it took me 6 months and hundreds upon hundreds of applications to secure something else. I’ve found the old adage of it being in work to find new work true in the last 20 years. I fortunately found a great job after spending 9 months in a minimum wage, boring, job. My husband has been a SAHD for a few years. Our agreement was that as soon as our son was in school he would find a job and go back to work. Just as our son was settled COVID hit and he was so demoralised job hunting because it’s become so hard I told him not to bother for now so he could save his own self worth.

YANBU OP. My place have just advertised for a few spots doing the same role. Before pandemic they would receive around 20 applicants in total, they are now receiving around 100 applications A DAY! This is not for a desirable job, it is for an outbound telesales role! They used to hire anyone off the street, hadn’t finished school, no call centre or at all relevant experience. Now it’s bachelors degree and two years experience minimum.

Care manager here too....

Hundreds of vacancies in my area for care home and support workers.

Of course care isn’t for everyone but we desperately need staff. I do wish more people would consider it - yes it’s a hard job but it’s also very rewarding and no care homes I know offer 0 hour contracts.

My dd and I were both job seeking several years ago and due to differences in age and experience etc were applying for very different jobs. Both of us could see on the websites that there were usually over 200 applicants per role.

Dd was job seeking again this year and reported to me - and I noticed myself when I started checking out sites for her - that it's now close on 1000 applicants per role and that's even with her now being and job seeking in a better off area. I also looked in my area her previous area and many were over 1000 applicants per role - and that's just that sites count. Many jobs are advertised in multiple places so i took the example of one entry level retail role and totted up roughly how many applicants across several sites plus average number of applicants to newspaper ads and that resulted in a likely number of applications for ONE role of over 4000 applicants.

There's been over 1mn redundancies this year as a result of covid alone.

Prior to covid there were still approx 3 times more people needing jobs than there were jobs available - and that's govts own stats. People needing jobs did not include under 18's, over 65's, mothers of under 4's, disabled people in certain categories and certain groups of immigrants AND "jobs available" is ANY job, not just full time properly salaried and secure jobs, but 4 hours on a Saturday, zero hours, bank work, scam "self employed" nonsense etc EVERY vacancy is included in govt stats.

This govt have done precious little to support Uk based industry or encourage companies from outside the Uk to come here to manufacture, recruit etc They also haven't addressed issues like providing good, reliable public transport to places where the jobs are especially when they're in out of the way industrial estates etc Good, reliable childcare provision

We have among the best scientists, artists and technical creatives in the world but they emigrate to be properly recognised and rewarded.

We have an education system that is overly skewed towards specific academic subjects which not all children will be adept at.

Vocational training is paid mere lip service and employers are scamming school leavers left, right and centre.

Employees are being underpaid, conned and even abused and this govt does nothing.

The UC system which was SUPPOSED to be more flexible and adaptable wrt temp contracts and shift workers who may well work slightly different hours over a calendar month is worse than the old system meaning those on it feel and are more caught in the "benefit trap" than before.

Brexit means employee rights are likely to erode even more and quickly.

Yet on this thread and in the voting booths and in the msm the blame is apportioned not to those who have the POWER and have created the current situation and also have the POWER to change it, but to those victimised by it and who are POWERLESS to change even their own circumstances.

Stop blaming the people WITHOUT the power and blame those responsible!

I'm just wondering those on thread saying "I've never struggled to get a job" -

What's your

Age
Race
Sex
Health status
Address - are you in a part of your local area that's well regarded or considered "rough"?
Do you have an anglo style name?
School - is it a school that is well regarded or is it known as the "rough" school?

Because to be honest when I was an under 30, healthy and fit, woman living in a "naice" part of whatever area I was living in at the time I too had no problem getting a job, yes the economy was doing better but these things can have a significant impact on success with job seeking.

That last time I was job seeking was the first time since I had become disabled and been long term sick, turned over 40 and am now living in a "rough" part of town.

I have friends and family who've always had it harder because they're not white and/or have an obviously "foreign" name and/or dress in a way that is particular to their religion which is noticed at interview stage even if it's not been apparent prior to that stage.

It gets harder as you get older and as you get older you're also more likely to have declining health or simply not be as fit as previously and this works against you.

Then there's factors like

Being a woman of child bearing age makes certain employers reluctant to consider you, if it comes up you're also recently married they can think you're even more likely to soon be taking maternity leave.

Addresses - as well as snobbery there can be bigotry issues that employers with local knowledge will recognise certain local addresses as the residents there are more likely to be black, Catholic, large families etc

Personally I think all applicants at "paper" application stage should be identified only by a reference number, some larger employers have started doing this. To eliminate conscious or unconscious prejudices in their recruitment processes.

So while it may be easy to job hunt for you it may be considerably harder for others without certain factors which give you a level of privilege.

Even weight can be a factor. I've applied for sedentary office jobs that when I was young and slim I'd have walked into but which as an older and heavier woman I've noticed prospective employers reacting to my current size or even directly commenting when it had absolutely no bearing on my ability to perform the role.

Dd has managed to find 3 part time jobs this year, but it took her a good while considering she was applying for anything and everything, has no other “ties” eg children, is relatively fit and healthy, is white and has a very “British” name, has an address at the moment which is quite “posh”, has a good cv with a few years experience working full time plus part time roles and has excellent refs from them all.

She understands this too - that she’s pretty much an ideal candidate for many roles in terms of experience and ability and being cheap as still under 21. Yet still it was pretty challenging to get the jobs.

Most people could get a job in care tomorrow if they wanted you’re talking utter nonsense! Thankfully! I have many years experience as an hcp in elderly care and that hasn’t been the case for DECADES! It is an area that is legally required to be stringent in recruitment practice. Which unfortunately still means not all staff are best suited to the work!

DH already works there and was able to vouch for him

Yep - in an employers market it becomes very much WHO you know rather than WHAT you know!

Fortunate for your son, not so good for all other applicants.

It’s a particular issue where I live which is known for being very insular anyway. The main local supermarket and the council are especially bad for it. When I first moved here I applied for a number of jobs at the council I could have done stood on my head! Couldn’t understand why I wasn’t even getting to interview stage. Upon getting to know and chatting with school gate mums, neighbours and so on they ALL said “yea there’s only 4 families work at the council...” and reeled off the surnames, right enough in over 10 years of living here I have NEVER spoken to ANYONE at the council that didn’t have one of those 4 surnames! Out of curiosity I sort of double checked via Facebook and yep, they’re all related! And 2 of those families are inter-married at 2 generational levels

Nepotism in the extreme!

If you apply for a job in Manchester but give me an address in Truro, your CV goes straight in the bin why?! They might be willing and able to relocate! Indeed the govt are TELLING people to do this inc at dwp job “coach” level so claimants are being forced to make such applications

Most low/minimum wage employers don't want to employ highly skilled people. or at least as you say assertive people who know their rights!

BUT I agree there are issues with poor application and interview skills too. I noticed this STARTING almost 30 years ago when I was attending interviews and noticed more and more applicants were turning up casually dressed (I don’t mean that as in a style judgment but eg turning up to a job interview in ripped jeans and trainers!), ill prepared (knowing nothing about the organisation they were applying to, what the role involved etc) and even things like arriving up to an hour late!

I’ve also been on the hiring side of things and seen appallingly written cv’s and application forms riddled with spag errors, factual mistakes (eg dates of employment clearly wrong as they’d have been eg 5 years old at time of employment! Former employers addresses wrong etc), also things like coffee mug stains etc just so unprofessional.

And these were definitely applicants who actually wanted the jobs as I’d get the calls asking for us to expand on why they’d not been successful or from chatting to other applicants they were clearly really keen to get the job.

I had parents AND there were lessons in pshe at school especially in 5th year who told me how to apply for a job, how to dress and behave for an interview (this was late 80’s it was even considered “wrong” as a woman to attend for an interview in smart suit trousers! My mum actually took me shopping to get a 3 piece skirt suit, court shoes and tights and a smart bag for interviews! Now I know not everyone could afford to do that and money wasn’t even in great supply in our family but things as basic as I saw a lad arrive for interview in relatively smart clothes but he’d not bothered to polish his shoes. They were quite badly scuffed but would’ve looked much better with a polish!

Are schools and parents not teaching this stuff now? It seems to be much worse.

Dd was teased by certain acquaintances for getting an interview outfit and smart bag - the people who teased her were still looking for work a year after she’d started her job!

@lemmywinks84 I’m genuinely wondering exactly how the ad was worded and exactly where advertised as that’s very very unusual to have so few applications

only if they only list their (irrelevant) skills and experience.
You can be "over qualified" but sell yourself to make yourself interesting for the employer.

This sort of thing can be EXTREMELY tricky and was basically what buggered me last time I was job seeking because:

If I included most recent experience it would be clear I was over qualified

BUT

If I DIDN’T include most recent experience my cv gap was even LONGER which is also a no-no

Ditto

If I was honest about my long term sickness/disability that would put most employers off

BUT

If I neglect to mention it my cv gap could look like I’m simply workshy.

I was advised to omit dates just listing experience - that didn’t work

I was advised to be honest re health with supposedly “disability positive” employers who “guaranteed” an interview - that didn’t work

I was advised to omit my correct job title of most recent experience as it made it clear how well qualified I was - that didn’t work

So what are people supposed to do?

Why would you bother to train a 19 year old who has never worked on a desk, when you can have an older person who has extensive reception experience and needs less training and supervision?

Short answer? They’re cheaper, less assertive and therefore easier to take advantage of.

What I am finding is that the pay for most jobs seems to have dropped drastically supply and demand! It’s an employers market, they can demand more and offer less because potential employees massively outnumber jobs available. Employees don’t have any real power.

Not long after I left school 3 million people were unemployed, anyone remember that time? I was a school leaver and job hunting around this time. It’s NOTHING compared to now! I applied for jobs in Easter break, attended interviews after school or weekends, left school on the Thursday started work on the Monday.

My parents certainly remember walking straight into jobs the problem with my dad is he forgets that was nearly 60 years ago!! Economic boom, industrial city (glasgow) he literally popped into one of the shipbuilders on the way home from his last day of school, quick chat, no cv or written application just told to be there 8am next day to start training. He then joined the army. He’s NEVER been on the applicant end of modern job hunting and as a result his attitude stinks!

Mum as a trailing spouse had it MUCH harder after marrying dad and she “gets it” she knows how it works. But her 1st job, again popped into post office on way home from school, quick chat, told to be there 8.30am Monday to start. Well paid admin/back office role she did for 5 years despite leaving school with zero qualifications or work experience.

I think get skilled and keep applying

please do explain how people are supposed to “get skilled” when the massive cuts mean colleges no longer have anything like the courses or vacancies that were available in the past even as little as 5 years ago. Employers aren’t willing to train people and apprenticeships are like hens teeth?! My local college has had HALF its courses cut due to lack of funding. The nearest place to get post compulsory gcse level maths and English, among others, is 2 hours away by public transport, overwhelmed with applications (because ours isn’t the only college that’s been cut and so they’re being hit by applications from students who would ordinarily have gone to several other colleges) and at the moment attending would be very problematic re covid restrictions!

Could he do care work/ delivery van driving?

@MustardMitt

I feel really wary of the 'anyone can do care work' mentality. Not everyone can. I couldn't. I wouldn't be able to wash an elderly person who had soiled themselves without retching, and they deserve better than that. There is an element of vocation and care which I don't think should be glossed over.

Do you have dc?

How do you manage to change nappies/ clear up sick, if you are so incredibly precious about smells etc??

Honestly, if you did it a few times, you’d just get used to it.

I'm more glad than ever that I no longer have to take part in this corporate talent contest to get work! Before accepting a contract with my current employer, I only ever had to speak on the phone, have a quick chat in person, and then send my licenses for proof of certification.

I then usually got a few days work and the company would offer me more if they were happy.

Office workers often seem to look down on trades, but truth be told, unless you're senior management you're probably earning less and jumping through a lot more hoops in addition to being squeezed much harder - a tradesman generally quotes how long it'll take him rather than being 'delegated' to.

I've declined further work from companies I found irritating to work with and it has never been an issue. I'm confident I could sack off my current contract and find work with a day (well, I'd have to work a week's notice I think but in principle it's the same).

Sorry if it sounds like I'm gloating! However, one of my biggest frustrations is that trade work was never really portrayed as a viable option growing up in a middle class family in a nice area. I wasted 10 years being miserable in office work and attained a hefty student loan before realising that I was jealous of my mates who worked in skilled trades.

Back in the day people were also prepared to travel great distances to work or even move areas but this is not the case now.

Surely a lot of that is due to the cost of housing? The areas with lots of jobs have correspondingly high housing costs. People can't relocate because they'll be making themselves homeless.

mrsbyers
There are loads of seasonal opportunities locally along with longer term factory / unskilled work yet still high rates of unemployment in pockets - it must be that a lot of people want to live on benefits maybe ?

What are you meant to live on during breaks in seasonal work? Universal Credit is a nightmare for those who have zero hour contracts and constant fluctuations in earnings, unless you have considerable savings to support yourself with whilst your benefit is recalculated.
We had contact tracing jobs offered in our LA and received thousands of applications some from solicitors for a job that paid £21k a year. These are desperate times.

Some points I haven't seen mentioned yet:

You can be too poor to get a job. In small towns, the first question out of the interview's mouth is always "how did you get here?". It doesn't matter if there is a regular train or bus, or if you are in walking distance, if the answer wasn't "I drove here", the interview's eyes will immediately glaze over. Too bad if you are disabled and can't get a licence. You can also be too poor to pay for public transportation for the first month, even if you were to somehow get a job.

You can be both overqualified and underqualified. If you have a STEM degree (or similar) but got a 2:2 or third, you're going to struggle to get an industry job without a master's. However, every non-industry job will see you as overqualified and likely to leave soon. You can't leave it off your CV as employers are very suspicious of gaps in employment and some applications state that you must explain any gaps of 3 months or longer.

Most interviews favour extroverts who can invent stories of a time they helped someone in a team on the spot. They are not good at judging who is actually the best at the job requirements. Chatty people are chosen over quiet people who just want to get on with their work.

A lot of jobs advertised are not actually looking to hire anyone. Some are just for collecting some CVs, others already have a candidate in mind. For every waste of time interview you apply for, prepare for, and go to, you have less time to fill out a genuine job application. Even just pre-interview personality tests often require more than an hour to go through and then going to an interview can take most of a day.

Regarding the large number of poorly written applications, a lot of these will be JSA requirements. Some people are expected to apply for 40 odd jobs per week or risk losing their benefits. The system does not favour applicants tailoring their CVs and seeking out jobs that they are right for.

The people advertising jobs picking berries don't want locals. They want foreign people who don't know their rights and will be forced to pay to stay on site in caravans.

Some people are expected to apply for 40 odd jobs per week or risk losing their benefits. The system does not favour applicants tailoring their CVs and seeking out jobs that they are right for.

I've only had to apply for JSA once and had the same experience. I was confident I could find another business development job within a month, but obv these usually take a few weeks due to first, second, and sometimes third interviews, the latter often being a presentation requiring a fair bit of preparation and research.

My job advisor (or whatever his title was) got shitty with me for not wanting to work as a car park attendant, but it just didn't make sense doing that before I'd at least tried to get something more appropriate, as it would then make it harder to be available for interviews etc.

I think they just want people to get into some form of work as quickly as possible and then do the cherry picking whilst supporting themselves.

I'm always bemused when people say that employers respect people who will do any job and that it shows work ethic etc because that has never been my experience at all. I couldn't count the number of times I have been interviewed and asked something along the lines of 'i see you worked doing X, was that because you weren't interested in having a real job? It doesn't show you in a good light'.

Thankfully I have been very very fortunate in the sense of only ever having had one very short spell of unemployment (3 weeks) a few months after leaving university but it's well over 20 years since I left university and every job application I fill in, I still have to justify every waking moment since the day and hour I graduated. The application form for my current job was 28 pages long, and that's not the longest I've ever had. I remember as a 16 year old looking for a Saturday job spending hours and hours filling in 12 page long application forms and desperately trying to prove that I had experience doing X, Y or Z and thinking 'how could I possibly provide evidence of an occasion when I resolved a customer complaint to their satisfaction? I'm 16. Just let me sweep the floor until I've proved I'm reliable'.

It's also surprising the amount of hoops you have to jump through to get the lowliest jobs at some big companies.

After 10 years of climbing the corporate ladder I decided to get my HGV license. I was always a bit jealous of my mate who earned £55k as a mobile crane driver and didn't have to put up with corporate bullshit.

I'd passed my practical test and just had the final theory modules to complete, which are pretty easy tbh. In the meantime, I decided to apply for a warehouse job at a large supermarket to get some experience in that area, and because I was burning through my savings fast with paying rent etc.

I had to do a pretty involved online test about product knowledge, and then turn up for an entire day's unpaid assessment which involved loads of stupid group exercises which were like the very worst of corporate team building days I'd done in my youth. The guys interviewing me were a couple of pretty dismissive nobheads too and undoubtedly saw me as an odd candidate being much more qualified than the role required.

I was declined for the position but in an amazing twist of fate was offered a £35k driving job a month later by an agency who were recruiting for the very same retailer. It was absolutely amazing when I did my first delivery to that store and got to sit back and have a coffee whilst the warehouse guys unloaded my wagon, supervised by the very same two supervisors who'd interviewed me for that £18k warehouse job. 🤭 The dockets had to be signed in black ink and the supervisor looked really pissed off when I said "sorry blue ink won't do, you'll have to go and get another pen from upstairs" lol.

Most people could get a job in care tomorrow if they wanted

I really hate this, some people are really not suited to care work, I did it for 3 days as a temp job and couldn't cope with it.

I really hate this too. People who work in care need to be a special type of person, not just anyone who doesn't have a job. So many seem to think anyone can do it - which says a lot about their attitude to the vulnerable!

I'm shocked at the judgemental people on this thread. Just because someone in your family managed to find a job on the first day of their search doesn't mean everyone else can do it. As for wanting to live on a benefit - do you have any idea how little money you get? Some of you really do live in a different world.

If you are not picky and averse to hard work there are jobs out there.

What a load of rubbish! I've applied for all sorts of jobs, from cleaning to supermarket work and the only interviews I've had were for admin jobs. I've worked in admin all my life and don't want to do it any more, but needs must. I've had temp jobs doing all sorts of manual work and enjoyed them - but can I get a permanent job? No I can't - maybe the fact that I am 61 has something to do with that. Please don't make such ridiculous statements, you really have no idea.

I run a charity that supports people with learning difficulties/disabilities into employment, and I agree with everyone saying how tough the job market is, and how it will only get tougher. The majority of our clients have little formal qualifications, and very low skills - the jobs that would be appropriate for many of them are having massive numbers of people applying. A low skill cleaning job in London had 4,000 applicants! It definitely isn’t as easy as “just getting a job”.

@DenimDrift

i'm a retail manager and currently recruiting

retail experience is vital ....especially in this climate. Don't care if candidates have degrees in rocket science.....you would need a few years in recent retail under your belt

retail is no longer the 'shit' job it used to be seen as

Why do you insist on a few years experience? And why does it have to be recent?