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Trump thread #110 where the orange one is going away

999 replies

freddosfrogs · 06/11/2020 04:18

How long will this one take to fill ?

OP posts:
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33
StatisticallyChallenged · 06/11/2020 21:48

I think the fact he's leaving after one term possible tips the balance towards doing something about his abuse of office - if it was after two terms he (personally) couldn't try to run for re-election so at least he would to some extent fade in to the background.

A lot will depend on how he behaves in the next few months and after Biden takes office (all being well) - if he continues to be a thorny pain in the ass then leaving him alone may become less appealing.

Runningdownthathill · 06/11/2020 21:49

@CaraDuneRedux

The US was founded on puritan ideals driven out of Europe which have endured through time and the 60s era of USSR rivalry and Mccarthism.

We must understand this. And learn what motivates rather than dismissing fears and differences of values as 'backward' or 'bigotted'. They are just 'different' more often than not and not out of outward malice nor desire to oppress. That does exist of course but it needs to be separated out.

That's a very shrewd observation, RTB. Visiting France and Germany as a teen/young woman, I was always struck by how fundamentally similar in a lot of respects (language aside) they were to Britain. The first time I went to the US I was similarly struck by how very, very different it was, despite the shared language.

The more I read about American history the more I'm struck by the deep roots of these differences. For instance, it's important to remember the genuine political and religious oppression the puritans faced in Britain (and not just puritans, a generation earlier, the first political liberals like John Locke, whose writings exerted an immense influence on the Founding Fathers, and who had to flee England for Holland for political reasons), and the huge role this played in shaping the American constitution.

The way this history plays into things that Europeans find so difficult to understand, such as the 2nd Ammendment. Is it the right to bear arms because they're all redneck cowboys who just like huntin' and shootin' (the European stereotype). Or (endless arguments over that comma) is it that ultimately the people have the right to bear arms in case the government gets too big for its boots - the ever-present fear of the founding fathers who'd escaped European tyranny and thrown off the yoke of colonial government?

And the immense and poisonous legacy of slavery. We were equally culpable, but because we were the merchants (for the main part) rather than the owners, the bulk of the poison has landed up on American shores, and we've got off pretty much Scot free (a phrase which itself has roots in the legacy of American slavery). The way that led to the civil war. The war by other name phony peace which followed culminating in the liberal north screwing over blacks in the south, and the Jim Crow laws.

The curious tension that the white Americans saw themselves as having thrown off the colonial yoke while simultaneously being the colonisers who'd done a massive land-grab from the Indigenous people.

And so on and so on - exceptionalism, reluctant engagement in world wars, the cold war (and terror of communism)...

It's massively shaped by a history which is very different from that of Europe - we split apart nearly 2 and a half centuries ago now, and I think (two nations divided by a common language) we often forget just how very, very culturally different the US is from pretty much any western European nation.

Great post
ladymalfoy45 · 06/11/2020 21:51

To quote the glorious Malcolm Tucker
‘ Fuckety Bye’

CaraDuneRedux · 06/11/2020 21:51

Interesting analysis on CNN, about the future direction of the Democratic party and what will (and won't) win them votes.

edition.cnn.com/2020/11/06/politics/abigail-spanberger-house-democrats-2020-election/index.html

AskingQuestionsAllTheTime · 06/11/2020 21:51

we've got off pretty much Scot free (a phrase which itself has roots in the legacy of American slavery)

"Scot free" was in use centuries before (most!) Europeans got to the Americas: in the twelfth century "scutage" and "scot" were both forms of tax. The word "scot" has nothing to do with a slave called Scott born in 1799; it comes from the Old Norse, "skattr", and means tax.

www.dictionary.com/browse/scutage?s=t
www.dictionary.com/browse/scot?s=t

ladymalfoy45 · 06/11/2020 21:52

That’s to Trump. In case anyone thought I was talking to them.

CaveMum · 06/11/2020 21:54

BBC projection on what we can expect tonight:

“If you, like us, are staying glued to your screens as the election drama continues, here's a look ahead at what's to come.

We should get more results from Nevada - probably Clark County - by 19:00 EST (00:00GMT).

More results will also come in from Arizona's Maricopa County around 21:00 EST (02:00 GMT). This should include around 100,000 votes, so it will play a role in figuring out which candidate Arizona goes for.

In Georgia, we may also get an update with votes from the Atlanta suburbs. Officials have said there will be a recount in the state given how tight the race is.

Philadelphia officials are planning to update the numbers again in the next few hours - with somewhere around 3,000 votes. All eyes are on Pennsylvania because if Biden wins this one state, he'll win the presidency.

And to further amp things up: Pennsylvania's top election official, Kathy Boockvar, told CNN that a result could come by the end of Friday.“

NonCisWoman · 06/11/2020 22:02

Sorry if this has been covered, but what is taking so long with the last few % of votes?

Roussette · 06/11/2020 22:03

Mail in votes take more time and there are more because of covid

RedToothBrush · 06/11/2020 22:03

@nauticant

If he isn't, it throws the door wide open for others to behave the same.

That's why I think that for realpolitik you target those around Trump. You send the message that the main man/woman can have freedom to act (which is generally a good thing) but you also send the message to those around the main man/woman "be careful about enabling this shit".

You do this in the hope of creating a self-policing system.

Yep

Donnie Jr best not carry on with the treasonous shit come January...

There is also no shortage of people willing to claim a scalp from the clan.

CaraDuneRedux your post at 21.30 is spot on. Brits in particular dont get the constitution and how it was a fuck you to authoritarian tyranny, because to do so requires a revision of nationalism in some respects. We didn't explore the world and become powerful from that through being nice...

CaveMum · 06/11/2020 22:03

They’re the “mail in ballots” so have to go through several layers of checking to make sure they’re valid.

LadyWithLapdog · 06/11/2020 22:04

Nevada should be aces at counting. Honestly.

lionheart · 06/11/2020 22:06

@PerkingFaintly

I understand the arguments above about prosecutions.

At the same time, I would really like to see him brought to book one way or another on the emoluments clause, pour encourager les autres.

If he isn't, it throws the door wide open for others to behave the same. And this won't just be a minor side issue: personal enrichment while holding the office of president will motivate the Trumps of this world to seek the office; and then incentivise corruption, cronyism and bad international decisions while they're in the office.

As if those didn't happen enough already, without it being open season!

(And let's face it, if someone can't work out how to get rich after being POTUS and therefore needs to rake in the cash while actually in the office, then they're probably not bright enough to hold the office.)

I don't think it within Biden's gift to let Trump go 'Scot-free'.

It may be a matter of conscience but it will also be political decision, with constitutional and legal repercussions.

No one knows for sure the full extent of the corruption before he took office but the SDNY might have some ideas about that.

That's before you even get to the 500 children separated from their families or E. Jean Carroll:

www.thedailybeast.com/doj-fails-in-bid-to-protect-trump-from-rape-accuser-e-jean-carrolls-defamation-lawsuit?ref=home

lionheart · 06/11/2020 22:07

Uncharted territory. Ford doesn't come close as a precedent.

Pomegranatespompom · 06/11/2020 22:07

Someone needs to do an intervention before he speaks again tonight.
I’ve watched get too much news today - it’s fascinating. I can’t really get my head around the trump supporters one of which I’m friends with - ex oat, he’s being so vocal on fb but no one else commenting on his posts.
Apparently pray for trump as he is facing unimaginable evil 😮

DuncinToffee · 06/11/2020 22:08

Georgia

Biden 4,263
Counts remaining (est.). -3,458

RedToothBrush · 06/11/2020 22:12

@NonCisWoman

Sorry if this has been covered, but what is taking so long with the last few % of votes?
Absentee ballots need verifying and checking before counting (all the postmark stuff for starters) unlike in person votes.

Pennsylviania wasn't allowed to start this process until after the polls closed unlike Florida which can prepare this and start counting immediately on close of polls.

Also we know that Pennsylviania was having problems counting a lot of batches via machines. So they've had to switch to more time consuming hand counting.

I think there similar issues over verifications in at least Arizona.

Nevada was hampered by a court order which prevented it from counting today (cant recall what it was exactly).

Georgia because they knew it was going to be so close have been hyper vigilant on accuracy so have deliberately taken longer over procedures. Also the deadline for Absentee ballots is today so it was always going to be doing some counting today.

North Carolina has some sort of law over Absentee ballots which is why they aren't counting til next week (again dont ask me what the fuck that it).

Its November in Alaska. Things dont move so quick between remote settlements. And no one really gives a fuck apart from Alaska itself anyway.

lionheart · 06/11/2020 22:13

Biden leads 4,263 in Georgia. Smile

AskingQuestionsAllTheTime · 06/11/2020 22:13

pray for trump as he is facing unimaginable evil

That would be the damnation of his immortal soul, then? that's what prayer might help him with.

Butterer · 06/11/2020 22:14

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

bitheby · 06/11/2020 22:15

On CNN they are showing a huge, slow moving queue of people waiting to verify their ballots with ID. So their votes can't be counted until they've been verified.

nauticant · 06/11/2020 22:15

One ironic thing about this is that Trump endorsed the tactic* of getting his supporters to vote in person rather than by mail, but this means he's undergoing a humiliating reversal and death by a thousand cuts day followed by dismal day.

  • clever politics for sure but looking at how it's playing out it's an ideal way of Trump publicly performing his narcissistic injuries as they mount one upon another
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